Outer Limits 4x4 Board

trying to improve flex in the rear of the rangie, wondering what other people have done.

looking at the moment at rose jointed rear trailing arms, already have the cranked arms tho the bushes still look to be preventing a bit of travel.

however, before i do that, wanted to know what people have done the the upper arms is anything and the shock absored looking thing, can that just be removed? or is that somehow controling diff angle?



also, spring locators? i have just put in the terrafrima locators that are meant to catch the spring, however they look like they will catch on the ring 3rd from the top which will be a bit of a fail. will test it out once the car is moving but keen to see what others have done.

How much flex are you chasing?

If you have lifted the vehicle remove the self levelling unit all together. Chances of it actually working these days is very slim anyway.

IMHO seeing as you already have cranked arms, you can get enough flex simply by installing some longer shocks.
I don't think rose jointing the arms will give much benefit if your still using the standard a frame ball joint.
The ball joint will max out 14" travel shocks before it reaches its limits and you can achieve this with cranked arms (with standard bushes) and longer shocks (raised shock mounts on the chassis).

You might chew threw bushes at an alarming rate thou. I don't have much feedback on that as I havn't wheeled my POS with the above setup in almost three years

Lastly I think its more important to concentrate on the front to get even flex, too many people loosen up the rear and forget about the front, thus mimicking the flex of a nissan patrol

So in other words for what you are doing, bugger it off as its not connected anyway.

Mate this is my old 96 Disco. that is tucking 265 75 16s
Had no sway bars. 2" lifted Flexy springs from england. 2" longer then standard KONI shocks and make sure you keep rubber bushings on both ends of your trailing arms.

wow, that's almost as booty fab as my rangie!

I am impressed


EDIT: on second thoughts that is actually more booty fab then my junk!
random cut guards, springs out of their seats.... hilux's rule on the back window..

cheers for the info Grimace.

disconnected the auto lever thingo over the weekend. picked up probably 2 inches of drop when both wheels are suspended so rather happy with that.

what have you done up the front?

i have the same 5+ inch shocks at the front as i do the rear and the raised shock mounts (and extended brake lines) the front drive shaft appears to bind up on the angle its at, at the moment. have seen the double cardon joint shafts tho i fear i dont have the room for them with the t400 box conversion i have done, drive shaft is mighty close to the sump as it is.

GRIMACE wrote:wow, that's almost as booty fab as my rangie!
I am impressed
EDIT: on second thoughts that is actually more booty fab then my junk!
random cut guards, springs out of their seats.... hilux's rule on the back window..

I am not joking when I say "I used this thing to bulldoze and make tracks" I fixed the springs that weekend after that trip by using hose clamps on top and removing the lower retainer
I cut those gaurds that morning using the only thing I had. A 9" with a thick ass grinding disk.

Hey Dave, our car had one of these jobbies done to the a-arm using a Johnnie joint. The axle mount will need to be customised to accept the joint though.



If you want some suspension for that booty fab Disco we have a long travel kit we need to get rid of for cheap.

In my last range I ran 3" rears an cruiser big bore shocksin the front and in the rear 5" springs with pro comp 32" shocks had insane levels of flex tho u have to have dislocating cones as they can an will pop out. I learnt that the hard way

Removing the self levelling arm helps a lot for spring drop also as it will max out before yours suspension does

Bored a lot wrote:In my last range I ran 3" rears an cruiser big bore shocksin the front and in the rear 5" springs with pro comp 32" shocks had insane levels of flex tho u have to have dislocating cones as they can an will pop out. I learnt that the hard way

Removing the self levelling arm helps a lot for spring drop also as it will max out before yours suspension does

Similar set up to mine (height wise & shock lengths), only I highly recommend retaining the springs both top and bottom, front and rear.

I have found that cranked radius arms and rear links are a great way to minimize the stresses placed at the lower link chassis bushes.

The front radius arm bushes at the differential end are the limiting factor. Castor correction bushes are even worse for flex IMHO. If you can source some Haultech holey bushes they improve flex, even more so when they flog out

Luv
Grimace
XOXO

alexcliffo wrote:Hey Dave, our car had one of these jobbies done to the a-arm using a Johnnie joint. The axle mount will need to be customised to accept the joint though.



If you want some suspension for that booty fab Disco we have a long travel kit we need to get rid of for cheap.

How cheap is cheap???? I am just starting to do my diff convertion so i am very interested????

this is my daily's current set up. front end remains completely untouched.
set up is a prototype top coil retainer system, with upgraded lower retainers, and a prototype long arm kit. currently still running stock standard shock mounts.
long arm kit uses original mounts on the diff, with new custom mounts on the chassis using GQ lower control arm bushes.
with the rear coils fully retained, the stability of the truck off road has gone up ten fold. the suspension input threw the car is amazing and the added advantage of the front end is now being pushed around a bit making it work better.
the entire suspension set up is going to be completely over hauled, with the hopeful results of serious wheel travel for a daily driver. this is basically stage 1.


rim on the rear on full up travel will get around 4-5" near the rear guards, so it tucks harder then it drops at the moment.
the front end is purposely limited on its drop due to the fact the brake lines are at their limit. (i'll be honest, i fluked the shock length to do so. lol)


please excuse my quick fix bump stops. lack of time caused the dodgyness.

You might want to modify the rear brake line as well.
Easy fix is to bend the bracket at the diff so it's flat, and refit the t-piece pointing vertical.

bracket is just un done off the diff at the moment so no dramas there.

thanks for the reply's guys.

rampt, do you find having the spring fixed at both ends restricks travel in the rear end?

cheers again.

Ross

Ross,

Have a read of these (try reading between all the e-tough and crap):
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/land-rov ... stion.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/technical-cha ... ain-2.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Some info in them but you want the articulation balanced front to rear basically. My preference would be retained as with the axle dislocated you get very little usable down pressure on the dislocated wheel (just half the weight of the axle and the wheel and tyre). By having a balanced set-up front to rear you are giving each wheel as best chance you can of having equal down pressure and traction. The rears on rovers are very easy to get more flex out of but the fronts not so much.

Just before I sold my disco I had the suspension stuff 2" flexi springs and removed the rear sway bar. Flexed really well to the point that the links and bushes were the final items restricting travel but didn't actually perform that well off road because the front was still very stiff so the back danced around and spun wheels and the front did very little work. Had I kept the car I would have concentrated more on freeing up the front end (sway bar disconnects or remove it, holey bushes, cranked arms etc) and once it was as good as the rear then looked to do more on both ends or lockers.

PS the rangie looks to be coming along great on facebook. How long do you think till it'll be on the road?

rusty, i wouldn't say that any travel is restricted at all. its just not as flop happy on the rear. if the weight is there to push it, it will move!
ive just fitted some 36" ranchos to rear. a small improvement.

found front rose joints on rear trailing arms work good. i dont bend trailing arms or have not bent them sinse putting them in,touch wood and flex is not bad and a good shock should keep pressure on axle when spring dislocates.front radius arms my only problem with drop as chassis bush stops down travel. think it good to replace that with rose or make uj setup there and flexy bushies in the axle to gain more rti and maybe drop my truck down to a 2" spring lift

Rampt CUstoms 4x4 wrote:

this is my daily's current set up. front end remains completely untouched.
set up is a prototype top coil retainer system, with upgraded lower retainers, and a prototype long arm kit. currently still running stock standard shock mounts.
long arm kit uses original mounts on the diff, with new custom mounts on the chassis using GQ lower control arm bushes.
with the rear coils fully retained, the stability of the truck off road has gone up ten fold. the suspension input threw the car is amazing and the added advantage of the front end is now being pushed around a bit making it work better.
the entire suspension set up is going to be completely over hauled, with the hopeful results of serious wheel travel for a daily driver. this is basically stage 1.


rim on the rear on full up travel will get around 4-5" near the rear guards, so it tucks harder then it drops at the moment.
the front end is purposely limited on its drop due to the fact the brake lines are at their limit. (i'll be honest, i fluked the shock length to do so. lol)


please excuse my quick fix bump stops. lack of time caused the dodgyness.

have you done any more on this truck? updates?

While this thread has been revisited I may as well add a bit more to my opinion.
The below image is all standard suspension geometry, standard rover rubber bushes all round.
All I have in the rear is longer shocks and cranked arms, springs retained top and bottom, nothing special.
This is how much flex (and probably a touch more) is available from the standard rover rear end.


I installed standard front radius arm bushes (for this trip) to see just how much flex was lost from the front end (as previously been running holey bushes). The lack of flex from the front was pathetic. This helped to force the rear end to work harder in the above scenario.

Going by the above I see no reason to work on any major modifications to gain more 'flex' from the rear end. But I do see a major advantage in a long arm kit.
The vehicle on road will perform much better, climbing off road will be enhanced, and rear steer will be reduced. All a bonus.

The front on the other hand needs attention! Don't want my rover flexing like a pootrol!