Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Guys, getting series about looking for one of these vehicles. Just cant seem to find much info on them. Seen some pretty slick pictures of both, just need to work out which one is would be the better buy.

Just need someone to clear some things up.

1. The 70series SWB Hardtop (not the coil sprung bundera) seems to have a different rear suspension set up to the 73series MWB. True?

2. Does the 73series run hilux running gear wheras the 70series runs the same as the bigger 75series?

3. Which would be the better buy, or would it just come down to condition and $$?

Any help? Oh, and where can i find some more pictures of customised versions of these vehicles...

Many thanks...

Ok... the 70 and 73 Sereis MWB all have 45 series running gear and leaf suspension... and come with a 4.2lt 3F petrol, 3.5lt 3B N/A Diesel, and the 3.5lt Di-TD 13-BT Diesel... if you can get your hands on the later you will be in 4WD heaven!



Search is your friend :
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... hlight=mwb
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... hlight=mwb
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... hlight=mwb
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... hlight=mwb

Heaps of good pics in this thread:
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... hlight=mwb

4WRNING wrote:1. The 70series SWB Hardtop (not the coil sprung bundera) seems to have a different rear suspension set up to the 73series MWB. True?

no, they are the same.

2. Does the 73series run hilux running gear wheras the 70series runs the same as the bigger 75series?

no, the BJ/FJ/HJ 7x all run 9.5" diffs front and rear. only bunderas (LJ/RJ70/71) have "hilux" style gear.

3. Which would be the better buy, or would it just come down to condition and $$?

unquestionably the factory turbo BJ73 (or BJ74 if you want something a bit newer, though they have an 8" high pinion front diff) is the winner, but they are rare and expensive. around $10k for a fair condition one.

good luck!

The BJ7x stopped production in 12/1989 and the HZJ7x started in 1/1990, when the high pinion front diff was introduced. So . . . BJ's should still have the cruiser standard diff up front, HZJ's have the smaller high pinion up front.

Cheers,
Dave

beanz2 wrote:The BJ7x stopped production in 12/1989 and the HZJ7x started in 1/1990, when the high pinion front diff was introduced. So . . . BJ's should still have the cruiser standard diff up front, HZJ's have the smaller high pinion up front.

Cheers,
Dave

BJ74 is 1990 on, with high pinion front diff.

BJ73 is to 1989, with 9.5" low pinion front diff.

Hmm, I didn't know they still sold the BJ7x after 1990. I thought they went to the HZJ and PZJ series, and the BJ73 was the naturally aspirated and the BJ74 was the turbo. I learn something new everyday

Dave

main differences are as stated: 70 series touch shorter, ie less room behind rear seats, hard top, ie good if want to go for rof racks

73 series touch longer, can actually fit some stuff behind rear seats, frp top so roofracks are bit of problem. and they (mine) creaks a bits. have standard rollbar that is pretty good tho




go either one, but try for turbo cos with bigger tyres on na diesel slow up hills. ie go the diesel. a lot of 75 series stuff bolts on too. haven't driven a 70 series but own a 73 and reckon it is awesome, on road and off. prob only difference would be ramp over angle, and not much at that.



cheers
Lance

Have owned a BJ-70, now own an FJ-73. 73 series is more comfortable. ( wheelbase 300mm longer ) both good rigs. Most 75 series stuff fits. beware of rust at lower rear corners of side windows, and in front & behind rear wheel arches. Also check lower corners below taillights behind rear bumper ( the seam there may be a problem if its had a rear end collision and the bumper tagged it )

If your thinking of having restraint points for kiddy seats - you'll need a 90 model or later MWB. ( If you can find one that is built 89, imported 90 you'll get all the anchor points on the rollbar and still have a cruiser front diff like mine)

Hope this helps

Mick_n_Sal

Purchased mine (fj70) about 12 months ago for $7500 in good condition, (160000k) no rust ect, turfed the 3f and swapped in a 1hz, Its a late 1990 model with the high pinion front diff, the running gear is all landcruiser, no hilux stuff

As far as SWB vs MWB the mwb are slightly better in hill climbs ect but the swb is are more manouverabe in tight twisty stuff, it really comes down to what you want to carry and what sort of wheeling you do.

I came across a 1992 BJZ75 (1hz fitted from factory) and the owner was about 80, rekons it is the best 4wd he has ever owned, former mechanic and nissan dealer...... that says something

Mick_n_Sal wrote:If your thinking of having restraint points for kiddy seats - you'll need a 90 model or later MWB. ( If you can find one that is built 89, imported 90 you'll get all the anchor points on the rollbar and still have a cruiser front diff like mine)

actually fitted my own (this was my first mod to the cruiser). bolted straight thru floor pan, thru extra cross brace underneath that forms rear clip point for seats. anchor points on roll bar be better tho, could do this to anyway. or buy rac(whatever) mounting bracket.

Cliffy wrote:swapped in a 1hz

how much was this, cost, marks adapter stuff or.....?????

interested in any info about this



Lance

Bluey wrote:

Cliffy wrote:swapped in a 1hz

how much was this, cost, marks adapter stuff or.....?????

interested in any info about this



Lance

Strait swap, except for engine/chassis mounts, as they differ between petrol and diesel, any 75 series gear will fit into a 70, except for the front diff as they differ.

Cost????? doing all the work myself, engine will be the biggest expense, I purchased a complete 4000 km engine for 6000, However there are no adapters and everything bolts up, add a turbo and intercooler and its starting to get expensive, but the power to weight in a SWB will be pretty awsome

Ok, difference in high pinion and low pinion...

i know size difference, but apart from that, why is one better than the other...

I never realized that the 70series was still made into the 90's. There you go eh...

I need to get out and test drive some of these buggers then eh...

Thanks guys.

4WRNING wrote:Ok, difference in high pinion and low pinion...

i know size difference, but apart from that, why is one better than the other..

it can be a bit difficult to get your head around the "advantages" of a high pinion differential. essentially it is a diff with the gears cut the other way so that diff is running "forwards" when the vehicle is being driven forwards. it means the diff is running in its intended direction, which makes it stronger and quieter when driving forwards. in fact, the 8" high pinion diff in the front of landcruisers is stronger (when running forwards) than the 9.5" low pinion diff, because the low pinion 9.5" is running backwards most of the time, which forces the gears apart and loads the "overdrive" side of the gear teeth.

an incidental bonus is that the front propellor shaft is higher off the ground and enjoys better universal joint angles.

The high pinion front axles have bigger brakes and CV joints so everything else is stronger than the older gear.

the downside is, the diff is much, much weaker in reverse, and landcruisers with the 8" high pinion front diff are famous for blowing the diff gears when reversing up steep hills. This is exascerbated in locked diff applications. It's usually nothing to worry about unless you are planning to go pretty hardcore.

I never realized that the 70series was still made into the 90's. There you go eh...

Toyota stopped exporting them to Australia in 1989/90 so if you are looking at a BJ74 it will be a "grey" import. In the case of that particular vehicle, it's not a big deal, just about every part in it is available in other locally sold vehicles so there is no issue with parts availability from dealers and aftermarket.

cheers

Brian

So, if im clued up on this now, the low pinions have the bigger front diff housing, such as you earlier cruisers, 60series, etc... The high pinion diff is that used on hiluxs and 80series etc...

If thats all true, then im on my way to understand all this..

Cheers Mate
Lee.

Ok, just while im here. Just two more questions, im finally getting somewhere. If i had either of these vehicles nearby, i could answer these myself, but i dont, so here goes...

I found out in another post that the 73series has a leading and trailing rear shock setup like the hilux, but doesnt have hilux running gear. It runs the same as its bigger brother the 75series.

Now, the 70series (pre '90) runs the same but with the standard rear shock setup, ie, both behind the diff.

Ok, a third question, the 1hz was only offered in the 70series after '90.

Thats all blokes
Lee.[/url]

4WRNING wrote:So, if im clued up on this now, the low pinions have the bigger front diff housing, such as you earlier cruisers, 60series, etc... The high pinion diff is that used on hiluxs and 80series etc...

If thats all true, then im on my way to understand all this..

Cheers Mate
Lee.

all landcruisers to 1989 have the low pinion 9.5" front diff, identical front and rear. (except bundera which isn't a real landcruiser)

all landcruisers 1990 on with a live front axle have a high pinion 8" front diff.
IFS 100 series and Prado (90 and 120 series) do not.

all hiluxes with a live front axle have a LOW pinion 8" front diff.
IFS Hilux and 4Runner have a 7.5" rigid mounted front diff.


enjoy!

4WRNING wrote:
I found out in another post that the 73series has a leading and trailing rear shock setup like the hilux, but doesnt have hilux running gear. It runs the same as its bigger brother the 75series.

not sure on that one. it makes no difference, the shock placement will me more to do with clearning the exhaust, fuel tanks etc. suspension performance will be more or less the same either way and its easy to modify shock mounts of you really want to.

Now, the 70series (pre '90) runs the same but with the standard rear shock setup, ie, both behind the diff.

yes

Ok, a third question, the 1hz was only offered in the 70series after '90.

1HZ was never offered in 70 series to the best of my knowledge, not in the Australian market anyway. 1HZ is only available in 75,78,79,80,105 series. in a 70 you can get 3F, 3B, 13B-T, and in a 73 you can get all of those plus possibly a 1PZ but they are pretty rare.

Thanks...

I just had the chance to check out the rear of a 73series, and the rear shock setup is now understood.

It has one shock in front, one behind, but not like the hilux where the leaning angle of the shock runs lengthways of the vehicle. The 73series rear shocks still both lean in towards the centre of the vehicle.

Ok, wats the 4wd engagement like on 70-73 series... Freewheeling hubs and lever activation 4wd? Im just hoping not to hear that its pushbutton or something else queer like that.

Spankles..

4WRNING wrote:Ok, wats the 4wd engagement like on 70-73 series... Freewheeling hubs and lever activation 4wd? Im just hoping not to hear that its pushbutton or something else queer like that.

should all be manual locking hubs
i have hydraulic operation for transfer case, so push in buttom and i'm in 4wd hi. ie need engine running to engage unlike hilux et al. then stubby lever to go from 4hi to 4lo

not all have hydraulic activation tho

4WRNING wrote:
Ok, wats the 4wd engagement like on 70-73 series... Freewheeling hubs and lever activation 4wd? Im just hoping not to hear that its pushbutton or something else queer like that.

Spankles..

Many Japanese import HZJ's have electric locking hubs. These are weaker as they only have 4 studs holding them to the wheel hub. Not sure if the pre 90 models get the though.



Dave

Bluey wrote:

4WRNING wrote:Ok, wats the 4wd engagement like on 70-73 series... Freewheeling hubs and lever activation 4wd? Im just hoping not to hear that its pushbutton or something else queer like that.

should all be manual locking hubs
i have hydraulic operation for transfer case, so push in buttom and i'm in 4wd hi. ie need engine running to engage unlike hilux et al. then stubby lever to go from 4hi to 4lo

not all have hydraulic activation tho

it's vacuum operated, not hydraulic. both manual and vacuum systems are quite reliable, sometimes the lever bush flogs out or the lever falls off on the manual one, and sometimes the vacuum lines fall off the vacuum ones, but generally they are both pretty good.

The 13bt and 3b are 3.4 litre donks...the bt is a heaps better performer, so i would look for a bj73/4.
There was also a hz70 and pz70 shorty model made after 1990 with the high pinion (i presume) and either 1pz 5 cylinder or 1hz 6 cylinder...the later is very rare, as it was only released for a short time b4 both being axed.
With the high pinion in the front, the motor could then be mounted centrally in the engine bay, so they handle better (less unsprung weight contributes to better handling aswell)...down side is reliability of front diff when hammered in reverse.
If you ever think you will need a rear seat, go the 73/4
The shorty is a good jigger aswell.
decisions decisions
Andrew

sooo, the earlier 73series motor is not centrally located in the engine bay? Thats fugged up isnt it, or is the handling not that bad...

I need to test drive one of the things asap...

my 3b is mounted center of engine bay left to right, but closer to firewall than front. this would be what dow50r is saying.


thanks for the corection dumbdunce, knew it something like that





lance

sweet!

Thanks men...

Hi Guys on the other side of the world

Your Topic is very interesting and so i decided to register

let me introduce myself:
My name is Toni and i'm from germany,
my english is not the best (sounds strange - but i'm in the english advanced course in school ) - i hope you can understand me
So - im driving a '89 LandCruiser BJ70 (some Pics here )- the heavy duty 70 series is rare in germany, too. The BJ70 is one of the rarest - i only know 5 more in germany.

Most of the german LandCruiser owners are driving a 78 series (HZJ) ... because in germany you can't go offroad where ever you want - so they travel to africa or australia

A year ago I asked myself the same quastion -"a 70 or a 73?" (because i'm driving where ever I want!) - so i searched the net and found one of the largest LandCruiser-Sites in europe www.buschtaxi.de
Than i studied the site and what i know about the different heavy duty J7 is this:

a BJ73/70 LandCruiser is powered by the 90HP 3,4litres 3B Diesel - the last ones (1988/1989 i think) with the 3B-II (new rotary injectionpump and 95HP).
The BJ74/71 is powered by the 125HP 13B-T Turbo-Diesel you allready know (a good base for tuning).
In both differential locks (the old pure mechanical ones) are not stock, but available as an extra.
The BJ73 was also build with a 2,5 litres (not a toyota) engine with around 125HP build in portugal and sold in portugal and italy.
I never heard a BJ73 or 74 build after 1990.
1990 the PZJ-series and the HZJ-series was introduced. The 1PZ is a 3,5litres 5cyl engine and the 1HZ a 4,2litres 6cyl engine, both diesel.
I also heard about a 1HZ with a factory-mounted turbo in australia - nice!
The production of the PZJ was stopped in the middle 90s - i think because the 1HZ is the better engine.
Here in germany you got the HZJ70, 73, 75 and 75PU (leafsprings all around) and now the 71,74, 78 and 79PU (coils in the front) - the first time i read this i was really confused, because the BJ70 is a normal Diesel and the 71 is a turbo.
I've never seen a PZJ70 or 73 here in germany and never heard about one in the rest of the world
In the HZJ-series differential locks are stock (the electrical/vacuum ones).
The large heavy duty petrol engines (3F, FZ etc.) were never sold in a J7 here in germany. The only one with a large petrol engine is the FJ40.
In japan you can get more models of the J7-series ... like the 77:


The vehicle-code is explained on this page.

so thats it ... now im going to read the other topics here

greetings