Outer Limits 4x4 Board

I keep hearing people constantly say a deisel has more torque than a petrol.

I am looking at the original brochers from toyot that i got with my cruiser.

A naturally asperated deisel's delivers a torque of about 260 Nm at low rpm and a max of 271Nm peak.

A petrol delivers a minimum ( of 320at low rpm)Nm and a peak of 373Nm.

So whats the deal deisel owners.

Yes you do have a flatter torque curve and produce your maximum down low but even that maximum at optimum revs is not even close to a petrol at worst case senarion.

so please tell me why they are better. (My mates keep telling me I don't have areal truck)
apart from fuel consumption. Even with that if you drove petrol the way a deisel drives there would not be much difference in fuel.

let alone power.
A petrol peaks at 158kW and a deisel at 96kW.

the turbo at 118kW close but no cigar
Steve

it all come back to rpm! why u ask? well i asked the same question my sisters boyfriend, he bought a brand new v6 luxie, and wholey shit they have some go but we tried to see what the torque was like and test my rig, intercooled TD 2.4 lux. well both rig were in 4 box high and tried pulling at the same stump well the petrol made fart and squeeling noise, like someone raping a pig but just clutch burn and smoke we could all smell, where as mine didn't have any clutch spin and levered the stump out? go figure? i no this isn't rocket science stuff but from my eperience it the rpm in relation to the torque down low that matters, slower rpm+more torque low end= more control!

just my 2c
cheers
simon

you say in practice this is the case, I'm not saying your definetly wrong, but could you a deisel owner exlain why the data is wrong.
The figures produced by toyota temselves say that the petrol still has more torque down low tha a diesel.
260Nm vrs 320Nm, the deisel stays fairly constant from here on but the petrol's increases drematically as the rpm increases. (the gap increases.)

Starts at a higher torque than diesel at low rpm and the gap gets icreases as the rpm increases.please explain what i'm missing.
to me, we have higher torque at low rpm and even more torque again at higher rpm
Im just looking at the munufactures specs.

eliteforce
clutch burn does not indicate a lack of torque, just bad drivline or driving.

powerchipped Hilux 305nm
dtronic hilux turbo diesel 365nm

petrol may be quick off the mark but choke with big tires, trailers and weight.

Put this gear behind a diesel you won't ever know its there,

powerchipped V6 hilux above.

maty wrote:powerchipped Hilux 305nm
dtronic hilux turbo diesel 365nm

petrol may be quick off the mark but choke with big tires, trailers and weight.

Put this gear behind a diesel you won't ever know its there,

Funny, most think diesel are ok until they put 35's and a trailer on it, even after lowering the diffs they still want a turbo, petrol pulls the same with 4.1 diffs and no turbo, no problems.
Fuel economy may suck as they load up but they don't lose power as fast a NA diesel ckimbing the Toowomba range, at least you still have grunt to overtake while towing.

Had NA desiels
Had turboed desiels

I`m over em

and now I only have petrols and other then the fuel usage of the cruiser I love em.

bruiser wrote:
Yes you do have a flatter torque curve and produce your maximum down low but even that maximum at optimum revs is not even close to a petrol at worst case senarion.

so please tell me why they are better. (My mates keep telling me I don't have areal truck)
apart from fuel consumption.

I think the flatter torque curve is the reason lots of guys like diesels- feels like a truck.

Interestingly, my bro bought a new Nissan Navara with the 115kW T/D and he hates it, much preferring the V6 Triton he had as work truck b4- considering he drives 200km+ each day with heavy trailer I was surprised to hear this.

it's not just the specs on the sheet.

the sheet specs are at the specified rpm AT FULL THROTTLE.

if you measured them at say 1/2 throttle the diesel probably would be making similar figures to foot to the floor figures, where as the petrol may be making 1/3 less torque or something, hence the fact with the stump pulling in a petrol,

you'd A have a lot less torque untill you cracked the throttle, so you'd either floor it and side step the clutch, or keep the revs up as you slowly brought out the clutch, in an effort to keep torque up, where as the diesel you could probably get away with less throttle opening while the clutch was engaging, then you could stomp it with the driveline fully engaged. probably better for the driveline this way

bad_religion_au wrote:it's not just the specs on the sheet.

the sheet specs are at the specified rpm AT FULL THROTTLE.

if you measured them at say 1/2 throttle the diesel probably would be making similar figures to foot to the floor figures, where as the petrol may be making 1/3 less torque or something, hence the fact with the stump pulling in a petrol,

you'd A have a lot less torque untill you cracked the throttle, so you'd either floor it and side step the clutch, or keep the revs up as you slowly brought out the clutch, in an effort to keep torque up, where as the diesel you could probably get away with less throttle opening while the clutch was engaging, then you could stomp it with the driveline fully engaged. probably better for the driveline this way

He said it all. With a diesel, you can control the torque a lot easier, without foot flat to the floor. They dont have the same amount of punch as a petrol, which makes them awesome for rock crawling.

I reckon it dosen't matter whats on paper, you really need to drive a few and get a feel for what you like, me like turbo diesel although I dont mind a quick fang in the wifes supercharged commodore, when i feel the need for speed (only to the speed limit of course)

Cheers Dazz

i agree with Daz. apart from the crummydore bit . but petrols are brilliant if you get the need for speed. offroad, depends on the stuff. mud where you need to spin the sh!t out of the tires to clean the treads, give me a petrol. but for cruising long distances, or tight slow speed stuff, diesel all the way (never driven a turbo diesel).

carts wrote:, which makes them awesome for rock crawling.

I tend to agree with this

[/b]

I'll bet u couldn't close that door after u openned it on that angle

I disagree, what makes a great rockcrawler is an Auto!

LilBlkDuck wrote:
I disagree, what makes a great rockcrawler is an Auto!

Otto?? Who is Otto?

LilBlkDuck

Do yourself a favour and drive both and decide what suits you, if you want. personally i like the deisel in manual as i feel i have more control and the torque is good down low. on the other hand there are times a petrol would be good.

it comes down to preference and dricing style

Tiny

could the difference in engine compression also a deciding factor when your considering a purchase?

i reckon Ive laid off my braking heaps and just the the gearing/engine braking when i can.. would you have the same with a petrol?

shorty_f0rty wrote:could the difference in engine compression also a deciding factor when your considering a purchase?

i reckon Ive laid off my braking heaps and just the the gearing/engine braking when i can.. would you have the same with a petrol?

Yep, in a big petrol yes, and besides a petrol can compression brake at 6000rpm, a diesel can't

6000RPM!!! what is the point? you can see the fuel guage drop
Tiny

If you think that a petrol engine can produce well over 3-400 Nm of torque at 1400 rpm then you must be dreaming. I have heard of a few guys getting 300kW and 700Nm of torque out of a factory turbo diesel cruiser.

#Tiny wrote:6000RPM!!! what is the point? you can see the fuel guage drop
Tiny

Don't usually use the throttle while compression braking
Not because I want to, because I can

bah.... rock crawler gears are better for rock crawling

Otto?? Who is Otto?

My name is Otto, I like to get Blotto!

umm the facts

100 Series Turbo diesel

• 430NM at 1400rpm
• 150kw at 1400-3200 rpm
• 11L/100km

100 Series Petrol

• 410NM at 3400 rpm
• 170kw at 4800rpm
• 16L/100km

from a toyota brochure....

trouble is TD is $12000+ more than petrol

I recall a mag artical on this very subject a while ago and bottom line was that to recover (petrol$) the additional $12000 of the diesel you would need to travel 350,000+ Kms.
They however didn't take into account the increased service shedules. 2:1 diesel :petrol, so it could be further.

On the other hand, that $12000 is enough to transform the petrol into a 4wd beast. Pour those $$$ into suspension and recovery gear upgrades and see who gets further in the real world.

Are the Toyota Diesels mechanical? That is will they run without electronics like the old diesels (and the 4.2 Nissan i think?).

alfred the butler wrote:umm the facts

100 Series Turbo diesel

• 430NM at 1400rpm
• 150kw at 1400-3200 rpm
• 11L/100km

100 Series Petrol

• 410NM at 3400 rpm
• 170kw at 4800rpm
• 16L/100km

from a toyota brochure....

trouble is TD is $12000+ more than petrol

Yes well you forgot to quote any facts for a N/A diesel and Turbo petrol

$12k buy's a hell of a nitrous, turbo set up on a petrol or a 454 blown chev conversion