Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Need advice on whether you can fit a 4BD1 isuzi into a disco to replace the 3.5l

[quote="suzidisco"]Need advice on whether you can fit a 4BD1


Far easier with 13bt .Use the Dyna M series bellhousing .Use your clutch plate (only 2mm difference ) rover throw out bearing ,toy throw out arm ,use the toyota slave .Unbolt your bellhousing off your box and make adapter from box to back Dyna bell .Starter motor clears with plenty of room (it will be on left side ) Oil filter clears front tail shaft even when you remove bump stops .My adaptor took 4-5 hours ,cost $35 .Engine mounts line up perfect ,but are too high ,cut them off and make new ones .Make new exhaust ,hook up radiator hoses and your done .Far easier and cheaper than 4bd1 ,not to mention that it will happily rev to 4100 rpm is smoother and nowhere as noisey .91KW 3400 RPM , 280NM 2000 RPM. When I fitted mine the front springs sat 15mm lower .The 11.5 km/litre dont hurt either .

will it fit onto an auto and can you get the 13b with turbo

Yeah but its a toyo donk, would rather fit a daewoo motor!

I'm just doing the conversion now and also retaining my auto trans. 4bd1 will undoubtably require turbo as its a slug in county with manual trans. Bags of torque, but revs to around 3600. So, you also need to change transfer gearing and/ or run bigger tyres. I'm using 235/85/16 and 1.003:1 transfer high range from early torque flite rangie. The weight of the engine is unbelievable. I was told around 360kg, and I reckon it is. Unless you are a total ISUZU nut like me, I would probably go for the TOYOTA in the previous post. The only reason I'm not using one is for longevity, and B series engines seem to have constant head problems in the trucks. Also make sure the one you get is from a 12volt application, and has had a good service life. ISUZU turbo geared right is good for 2000rpm@100kmh, and 28 to 29 mpg.

Justin, where did you source the adapter for this, i would like to fit a 4bd1 to my Rangie with the t/flite.

toyota diesel suck with auto, well the one I drove did....slug on hills and it was turbo.

If money isn't a consideration the Ford/International 2.8 litre Powerstroke
turbo deisel performs extremely well. based on the 300TDi but with all the Rover design faults engineered out, it pulls like a steam engine down low with very little turbo lag and revs well too. In the past month i have fitted one to a series 1 disco and one to a 300Tdi defender and the allround performance of these trucks have been completely transformed.
The downside $10,000 plus fitting, about $1,000.
Bill.

$10,000 ! It would be worth as much as the disco! Pity would be a good powerplant for a Rangie but i wouldnt even consider a donk worth double the Rangie

No not dreaming, for that budget you could get a mid eighties 4dr and fit a tdi from a disco. Check out the post from Maggot 4x4, he has recently bought a Rangie fitted with an ex county 3.9 Isuzu and lt85 5spd- this is my ideal Rangie, one with some sort of economy !

I saw a Rangie with a 300TDI on the Ozexplorer web site just after I got mine for under 10k. Be worth a look if it's still there. Was in Melb though.

suzidisco wrote:will it fit onto an auto and can you get the 13b with turbo

13b=N/A ,same hp/tourqe as 4bd1

13bt=turbo
When I fitted mine I moved the rad back 5 1/2 inches ,they are not that big.3b is identical size and many parts interchange
Can you fit an auto ? Anything is possible .
Know of a 4bd1 with T/F ,just depends on if your a dreamer or a doer .
Toyota engine life ? ,mates 13b in his Dyna has over 650,000 km .Change oil as per the book and it will reward you .Weight =315 kg fully dressed ,starter aircon etc .As for some people saying that they are dear to fix ,oil filer is a Z9 Reyco and SMS/Bernie Parts sell genuine parts for them ,IE exhaust gasket @Toyota $45 -SMS $15 .Isuzu owners in Brisbane can buy their parts from Fastair Spares at Windsor ,they sell genuine parts for all Isusus ,and that is all that they sell. (I am not affiliated in any way to these companies ,when I had the Isuzu I found them to be very good/cheap to deal with)


When fitted in Dynas they are geared to 3000 rpm @100 km ,M153 box-5.33 first-.788 fifth ( even come with a ten speed box) ,they will lug right down to 200 - 300 rpm but still like to rev .Mines governed @4100 (standard) and will hit the governer in all gears .
In case someone thinks I dont like Isuzus ,I have owned them .I am just sharing what I know in the way of more options .If you like the sound and feel of Masey Fergusons by all means fit one .

After many ,many,years of Rovers I have gone to the dark side and bought a .......GASP!! ........Toyota BJ42 .Took the 13bt out of the rangie and put it in the BJ .
Rangie now does what it is best suited to ,killing large patches of grass ,while sitting in the back yard minus engine .Still has reg and compliance ,so make an offer .79 2 door usual crap fibreglass hoodliner/lift etc, dry/straight body .Make an offer .In Brisbane .

cane toad wrote:If you like the sound and feel of Masey Fergusons by all means fit one.

A properly set-up 4BD1(T) will be just as smooth as a 13B(T) if not smoother. If your 4BD1(T) sounds or drives like a tractor, the injector timing is wrong. Change it 1/2 a degree or so and it will be smooth. My 4BD1 is as smooth as a 300Tdi, but if I changed the timing 1/2 a degree it would sound and run like a tractor.

As for power and torque:

13BT - 120Bhp@3400 Rpm 210Bhp@2200 Rpm
4BD1T - 120Bhp@2500 Rpm 240Bhp@1600 Rpm

The ISUZU hits peak torque (30lb/ft higher) 600rpm lower, and has an almost flat torque curve until the redline 3300-3400. I know which one I would prefer in a 4x4.

i just put a 4bd1 in a 2 door rangie haven't driven it yet. only needs an exhaust and its a goer. Its bolted up to the original gearbox. also i've got another 4bd1 with a 727 bolted to it with the adapter to bolt a lt230. this motor had a turbo but i pulled the turbo off cause i needed the manifold. i drove this motor in and old scout for 3 years, the most reliable and quickest diesel i've ever drove.until the scout rusted away

bobtail do you have any pics of your conversions
and did you have and problems with the conversion

Bobtail, i am interestd in any info you can provide on the 4bd1 to t/flite conversion. My 85 Rangie has a t/f and i am keen to know how this would go as a daily driver, will the gearing be ok being a 3spd without an o/d ?

barnsey wrote:Just bumping this thread back to the top.

Does anyone have contact details for Cane Toad?

Hasn't answered his PM.

Keen as mustard to talk to him!

I have read your pm .PM your questions .

[quote I know which one I would prefer in a 4x4.[/quote]


Well if you already know ,then wtf are you telling me for .I don't care . I am well aware of your so called knowledge on diesels ,so spare me .Did I piss in ya wheaties 'cause I don't yell and scream 4BD1.....4BD1....get a life and a clue

My original post stated that it was easier and cheaper . What part of that didn't you get Mullins .

cane toad wrote:[quote I know which one I would prefer in a 4x4.

Well if you already know ,then wtf are you telling me for .I don't care . I am well aware of your so called knowledge on diesels ,so spare me .Did I piss in ya wheaties 'cause I don't yell and scream 4BD1.....4BD1....get a life and a clue

My original post stated that it was easier and cheaper . What part of that didn't you get Mullins .[/quote]

On the contrary, I was wondering who has pissed in your wheeties. I was trying to give some facts, rather than the biased information you post, for people considering an engine conversion. Is was just trying to point out that while the 13bt may be SLIGHTLY cheaper and easier to fit than a 4BD1T, the 4BD1T would be better offroad - not that that would concern you (Willmer ?) since you never go offroad anyway.

And that is Dr Mullins to you.

If that is you Luke, i don't know why you didn't keep the leaf sprung S1 you built if you now drive a BJ42 - they both have an equivalent ride.

barnsey wrote:Which Toyos ran the 13bt?

Toyota Dyna trucks, and probably the Coaster minibus as well.

As for power and torque:

13BT - 120Bhp@3400 Rpm 210Bhp@2200 Rpm
4BD1T - 120Bhp@2500 Rpm 240Bhp@1600 Rpm

The ISUZU hits peak torque (30lb/ft higher) 600rpm lower, and has an almost flat torque curve until the redline 3300-3400. I know which one I would prefer in a 4x4.[/quote]

I'm typing this slowly for you Ben


ok lets look at it this way ...
13bt.....3.4 litres
4bd1t....3.9 litres

for the curious they are both direct injection .And by simply adjusting one bolt you can alter when and how much bottom end you want...and if you care to adjust it's neighbour ,you can alter the top end torque..mid range is unaltered...but I digress .

I may have missed this day at school ,but that to me is .5 of a litre..500cc...or half a litre ...take your pick .

Using your formula of an extra half a litre...we will add only .2 ...or 200cc to the 4bd1t to bring it to 4.1 litres ....ala...15b-ft...and we now have 155 HP @3200 and 288ft/lbs @1800......that'll be 382 NM thank you very much ,and no I don't want fries with that ,but thanks for asking .

SUZIDISCO asked about fitting a 4bd1 ...my reply was ....have you considered a toyota blah blah whatever .
I have done the conversion ...cost ,minus engine ,$340 .Bloody Nora..it's only an option .

Bobtail replied regarding the 4bd1 conversion that he has done ( sorry to hear about the scout ,as I always liked that car . )And for the sceptics ,yes it was fast

What conversion have you done ,and how may this help SUZIDISCO ....putting a 2 1/4 lump into a 109 doesn't count as that is only an engine swap...IE they were a factory option.....and your 110 doesn't count 'cause you bought it that way....so once again I'll ask..what conversion have you yourself on your Pat Malone done...


END HIJACK.

Barnsey you have a new pm ..enjoy .

Come on guys calm down, each to their own, the Isuzu being an original fitment in a landy in some models lends itself for an easier conversion as the parts are available and its be done to a range of models.

from what I have found out before I bought my rangie with the 4BD1, the 13BT is quite a rare motor in Oz and according to all the wreckers I spoke to none of them recommended it due to a weak bottom end.

Now this is only hearsay as I don't know first hand, I was even thinking about a 15BT for my cruiser, just information I had gathered from my reaserch before I spent my money.

Just doing a little research...........thought this was a good grave dig

I have drawn up almost my entire 4BD1T engine and conversion parts in my rangie.

Engine mounts and Isuzu gearbox included. Haven't yet begun work on the cable change gear lever.
The model is a little large, but pictures email easily enough.

http://users.actrix.co.nz/dougal.ellen/ ... june07.PDF

When I was in Canada I saw a couple of landies with a toyots 3B(T). The 3Bs drove (and sounded) like a 4BD1.

A couple of toyota guys have told me that the 3B is a nice, big strong, overengineered motor like the 4BD1. The 13B on the other hand, was a re-engineered version to make it lighter and more powerful - and reliability/longevity went down as a result.

Isn't the 3B indirect injection with the usual toyota head problems?

We've got some dyna's at work with the 14B, they're incredibly smooth for a 4L 4cyl.

cloughy wrote:Just doing a little research...........thought this was a good grave dig

Why, you better not, as i rememder you talked me out of doing this

6.5 rangie wrote:

cloughy wrote:Just doing a little research...........thought this was a good grave dig

Why, you better not, as i rememder you talked me out of doing this

Thinking of buying Dave s 120 for a work hack for home, trust me chev diesels are 10x nicer to drive than any 4BD1

Needs a bit of work though, outriggers are trashed, and I'w waiting on prices for transport, might even road tri it home if I get it

KiwiBacon wrote:Isn't the 3B indirect injection with the usual toyota head problems?

We've got some dyna's at work with the 14B, they're incredibly smooth for a 4L 4cyl.

It seems they are indirect...

I think the head problems are exaggerated - like problems with landies. Still would prefer a 4BD1 over anything else though.