Outer Limits 4x4 Board

I was wondering if some of you could post the name and ISBN for any suspension books that you recommend, and if possible where you purchased them from. I am keen on learning more about how suspension really works such as how geometry affects the drivability and such of the vehicle. The book does not have to cover offroad suspension in particular as I am interested in learning about all types. Any help would be appreciated.

Cheers Stuart

http://www.pitstop.net.au/pitstop/page/technical.html

All you need here

bazzle

I've heard good things about pitstop. I may give them a try. I will check uni first though as they've got a pretty comprehensive library.

Any titles in particular you can suggest?

There really arent any that deal with long travel suspension.

I can give you titles and isbn but you can spend a lot of money and all you will be able to use from them is how to determine, instant centres, anti squat etc. None will tell you what values to use or answer many of your questions.

Search here and on pirate - will be be more fruitful. Then ask questions here.

I've been searching the online bookstores and your right Bush65. It seems the detailed books on vehicle dynamics are quite expensive $150AUS up.

I'm not necessarily after what figures to use or long travel suspension just a better understanding of suspension from an engineering point of view and physics involved in suspension. You speak of instant centres, anti-squat etc , both of which I do not understand that well (I have no idea what instant centres are ) and how they are affected. But thats what I'm trying to learn.

I've found these two titles which seem to be stocked by most of the big online stores which cover suspension in general and are a reasonable price:

http://www.pitstop.net.au/pitstop/page/ ... /3322.html

http://www.pitstop.net.au/pitstop/page/ ... /1932.html

Both titles may seem performance orientated but from the reviews I've read both books apparently cover the general stuff too.

Also a tip to others, it seems that the two publications put together by the Editors of Four Wheeler Magazine are just articles from the magazine and only cover basics (not that anyone actually gives a toss).

A more concise view of what I'm trying to achieve is a general understanding of suspension so that when I do see it discussed both this forum and pirate I can see what has to be changed for offroad use and what needs to be catered for in a design.

Cheers Stuart

PS sorry if it all seems to be bullsh*t but I'm keen to learn about this stuff

I'm not farmilar with those pitstop books.

Race Car Vehicle Dynamics by Milliken and Milliken, published by Society of Automotive Engineers. ISBN 1-56091-526-9 is a good text book of 890 pages. The only useful info is spread over probably less than 6 pages.

Another good text book is Fundamentals of Vehicle Dynamics by Gillespie, also published by SAE. ISBN 1-56091-199-9 (493 pages).

Generally books on this subject assume that you have a good understanding of statics, dynamics and kinematics.

I still recommend what I said in my earlier post.

Instant centre (IC) in the context of link suspensions is a point in space where the pair of straight lines through the connection points of 2 links intersect.

As the axle moves it travels in a radius which has it's centre at the IC, but the IC also moves as the angle of the links changes so it anly applies for an instance (in time) thus it is called instant centre.

However it is not that fact which is important about the IC. What is important is: Resolving forces from a pair of links is best done at the point where the forces intersect. This point happens to be the IC since the forces in a link (tension or compression) are directed along the straight lines through the connection points (same as used to find IC).

Generally we can use graphical methods (instead of mathematical methods) to resolve the forces and find most of the results that we are interested in (such as anti squat and anti dive). Graphical methods can also be used to find roll centres and axii.

The graphical methods for anti squat and anti dive are different for live axles and independent suspension. One problem with the text books is they is they give a method but dot tell the reader whether it is for live axle or independent suspension.

Heres a good thread on suspension on pirate:
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=168577

I don't know if its in-depth enough for you or not, but worth a look IMO

Mark

Cheers for the help guys. I'm gonna head down to pitstop today when I go to see what there selling in the sales. It says they stock the Milliken and Milliken so I may have a look at that. Don't know if I want to fork out that much yet though

Stuart