Outer Limits 4x4 Board

I am currently saving to get a winch for my suzuki to be used for play and comp work. Looking at entering vicwinch05 if all is ready.

My question is: should i go for a low or high mount?

The only benefits i can see with a high mount are the no load line speed.

Where as a 6000pd warn has 4+hp motor and better speed under load, and the 8000pd low is nearly as quick under load as well.

Which do you believe is more important for comps, load speed or no load speed?

Also, weight is a big factor on a suzuki, so the 15kg of difference is a fair bit.

Your 2c is needed.

Cheers

6000pd

12V DC PERFORMANCE SPECS
Line Pull Lbs.(Kgs.), Line Speed FT./min(M/min.),

0 48.5(14.8)
2000(910) 23.7(7.22)
4000(1810) 12.9(3.93)
6000(2720) 10.0(3.05)

8000pd

12V DC PERFORMANCE SPECS
Line Pull Lbs.(Kgs.) Line Speed FT./min(M/min.)
0 42(12.8)
2000(910) 16(4.88)
4000(1810) 11.9(3.63)
6000(2720) 9.79(2.98)
8000(3630) 8.01(2.44)

8000pd Hi Mount

12V DC PERFORMANCE SPECS
Line Pull Lbs.(Kgs.) Line Speed FT./min(M/min.)
0 73.4(22.4)
2000(910) 22(6.71)
4000(1810) 12(3.66)
6000(2720) 9.50(2.90)
8000(3630) 6.10(1.86)

Depends on how much coin you're gunna have but a 9.5XP would drag a zook up just about anything at warp speed.

for comp use and performance, the 9500xp or high mount

I wish i had the dollars to get a 9.5XP.

Anyone got one going cheap?????

9.5XP

12V DC PERFORMANCE SPECS
Line Pull Lbs.(Kgs.) Line Speed FT./min(M/min.)
0 38(11.6)
2000(910) 16.8(5.1)
4000(1818) 12.8(3.9)
6000(2720) 10.1(3.1)
8000(3630) 8.8(2.7)
9500(4310) 7.6(2.3)

I love my XP

the other advantage with a high mount for comp work is that spares are fairly readily available as so many enterants have them.

If you burn out a motor, getting one off someone at the event would probably be achiveable.

Go the Highmount. You do not want to dunk a hot motor in water so the high mount has an advantage there. Not sure if the low mounts have brakes but the highmount does. You cannot go past a highmount with a 6hp motor. Spares readily available to.

LudaCris

Anybody know the mass of a high mount without the winch cable?

I am still concerned that it will put too much weight over the front axle, as my spring packs are already flat.

Also, what to look out for if i find one second hand?

I had to send a high mount via courier recently....looking around the 30-34kg mark with no cable or fairlead roller.

Second hand. Make sur everything moves freely like brakes. Clean around the solinoids. Works when connected to a battery. Comes with controler. CHEAP.Lets say around 6 to 8 hundred so that you can afford to get it comp preped in the future.

LudaCris

Should i be worried if it is an older hi mount? Or just do the common 6hp motor upgrade?

The XP and the 8274 are both good and fast but they require proper maintenance if you really use them hard in the wet. With the 8274 that means new seals every time. The 4.6hp 8274 is a bag of sh*te, made by illiterate monkeys in an old zoo somewhere. Swap in the 5.6hp Premium/DV/Master Winch motor for speed and reliability.

The best minimal maintenance, hard work, beat the sh*te out if it winch around at the moment - and this is on price as well - is the Premium/DV/Master Winch. They aren't as quick as the Warns, but not far off and you have to go along way to break them.

Yes I know you all have super fast Warns that never break and you have never maintained them ever and every Premium you know of has broken the first time out. But that is just Bullsh*t and Urban Legend.

Fact: 55% of ALL Warns sold worldwide are never used
Fact: 58% of all Warns used break in the first month of useage
Fact: The HS9500i is the most unreliable electric winch Warn have ever made
Fact: the 8274 has a max load of 8000lbs on the last wrap

Fact: Premium/DV so impressed Superwinch they replaced thier whole recreational range with them


The Premium 9000/9500 has a 5.6Hp motor and the brake is in the gearbox. The 6000 is the same winch with a slightly smaller motor.

I have just been beating the hell out of a T-max 11,000 for the last month.
Yes the freespool lever is a bit cr*p and the solenoides leave a bit to be desired but it's a damn good winch. Slow yes but it just keeps on going. Dragging 2+ tonnes through deep mud, up slopes all day. Deliberately using it in the most un-economic way. Well worth the money as it is so cheap.

The Warn M8000 is a good little beast if you want light weight and power, beloved of a lot of 'real world' users like the BGS and the UNHCR. It is very reliable as well...

Thing is Mudzuki, everyone has their favourite winch and hates to have anything negative said about it:

In the UK opinions vary - the 8274 is still thought to be king for high speed stuff, although in a much modded form and a Husky on the rear.
In Europe they love Ramseys (a rarity in the UK)
In Russia and the old Soviet countries it s Ramsey again along with Premium/DV/etc and T-max
You know what the Good Ole Boys in the US like
In Scandanavia its Warn/Ramsey

Then take into mind the advertising. Warn have been selling the 'Hi-line since BellVue first invented it in the early 60's. Ramsey have been around almost as long. We tend to buy what we are told to buy by the adverts.

Why not go along to a few events with a note book and see who breaks what, see what works smoothly and easily, then get your bank statement out, work out a budget. Finally look at everything available for what YOU want to do with it.

I have seen plenty of winches give up the ghost, spool out then click, click.

Then i have seen a cheap crap boat winch get a rig unstuck, go figure.

If i was after a winch for just recreational use, i would get a M6000, cheap and reliable for a zuk.

But with competition in mind, i am starting to think that i will get a hi mount, scrap the wire to save weight and replace with rope, save for a 6hp motor, get breathers fitted, maybe even look at pressurizing the case through the breathers for the really deep stuff, remote air freespool, etc. The wishlist goes on.

Im not dissing any of the winches that people use, im just asking for opinions on wnches for competition use.

You just have to look at the OBC to see which winch most teams use.

Mudzuki wrote:I am currently saving to get a winch for my suzuki to be used for play and comp work. Looking at entering vicwinch05 if all is ready.

My question is: should i go for a low or high mount?

The only benefits i can see with a high mount are the no load line speed.

Where as a 6000pd warn has 4+hp motor and better speed under load, and the 8000pd low is nearly as quick under load as well.

Which do you believe is more important for comps, load speed or no load speed?

Also, weight is a big factor on a suzuki, so the 15kg of difference is a fair bit.




Your 2c is needed.

Cheers

Youve answered your own question.

Lightweight HS lowmount

Bazzle

Bah!, Electric winches bah!
Mile marker Hydraulic 12000lbs is the way, ready to go $2500 from the US
pull all day and no fried motors, solenoids or slow cable speeds

High mount is the go i know they have their problems i just bought one new with a 4.5hp 24v motor and after one comp motor is stuffed. Bought a 6hp 12v it is running on 24v it wont last a long the experts say but it has out done the 24v motor already. Not to mention it is heaps quicker than the 24v motor even under load. So put two batteries in the car and go 24v and use the 6hp 12v motor.

Cheers

jafa wrote:Bah!, Electric winches bah!
Mile marker Hydraulic 12000lbs is the way, ready to go $2500 from the US
pull all day and no fried motors, solenoids or slow cable speeds

If you pay that then you are being ripped!

http://www.winchesplus.com

US$733 without control modules (SAE fittings)
US$860 with solenoid controls and manifold fittings on motor.

Even if you are talking NZ dollars that works out at less than $1200. Shipping would be about US$250 to Australia and I assume NZ similar.

Aside from that I agree totally. I am in the process of setting one up on my Patrol with a PTO powered pump that will make it pull at more than 10m/min at full load. Rewind speed would be 60m/minute.

Richard.

How did you go Mudzuki.

LudaCris

rlaxton wrote:

jafa wrote:Bah!, Electric winches bah!
Mile marker Hydraulic 12000lbs is the way, ready to go $2500 from the US
pull all day and no fried motors, solenoids or slow cable speeds

If you pay that then you are being ripped!

http://www.winchesplus.com

US$733 without control modules (SAE fittings)
US$860 with solenoid controls and manifold fittings on motor.

Even if you are talking NZ dollars that works out at less than $1200. Shipping would be about US$250 to Australia and I assume NZ similar.

Aside from that I agree totally. I am in the process of setting one up on my Patrol with a PTO powered pump that will make it pull at more than 10m/min at full load. Rewind speed would be 60m/minute.

Richard.

Hi Richard,
Yer I know it seems alot but here goes,
winch - $733
valve kit -$199
pump - $140
shipping - $358
total in USD $1430
total in NZD $1976

Import fee (NZ Customs) - $22
GST - $308.50 ( fookers at customs charge gst on freight too!!)
GRAND TOTAL $2306.50 NZD at my door.

Jafa

PS Still waaayyy cheaper than a superwinch hyd which start about $3000 absoulutely bare, no pump, cable, solenoids or electrics

ludacris wrote:How did you go Mudzuki.

LudaCris

No winch yet, keeping my eye on the trading post to find a cheap high mount that is local to me.

Would love to run a PTO, but i would need to do a twin transfer conversion.

Hydrolics are nice, but i would also need a pump as the zuk doesn't have power steer.

heres 2 cheapies. not a highmount but enough to pull a zook through most.

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll ... eName=WDVW


http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll ... eName=WDVW


Andrew

What rope do you plan to use on the winch, this may have a bearing on the final choice. The Premier lowmount, like the Warn highmount, runs the brake EXTERNALLY of the drum, thus eliminating heat, which allows the use of synthetic ropes. The heat build up in a lowmount Warn can be detrimental to synthetic rope, but this does not seem to deter some folks. Synthetic is a great weight saver too! Hope that helps.