Outer Limits 4x4 Board

I'm getting closer to working out what I am after. It's going to be a Disco, but I need to find the right one. I've found a very clean one with some extras, but it has a slightly crotchetty LT77 and lash in the driveline.

From all the reading I have done, there seem to be a handful of different ideas on the best lubrication to use in the Disco drivelines. At the risk of inviting a public stoning, I thought I might pick the collective brain and ask if anyone has any experience with Molybond additives in diff or gearbox oils. So, any comments good bad or indifferent. I ask because a mate of mine (long time Roverphile) currently has a SIII Stage 1 that he has run with Molybond in everything (including engine oil) and when torn down 2 years ago (at about 300K) everything looked peachy and one of the guys working on it commented on just how good all the usual wear points looked. Been exchanging ideas on potential purchases with him for a while, and he thought that an LT77/LT230 combo showing its age might benefit from treatment with Moly'd oils.

My argument to him was that I'd rather not get all experimental on something that in the short term I'd rather be driving than fixing, but he argues the proof is in his pudding coloured Stage 1.

So, one and all, confuse and confound me!

I've never had any concerns with Molybond. I first used it with my FJ (Holden, not Toyota) in the late 60s. The old grey motors had no oil filtration so I figure some help with wear resistance would be a good idea. They also chewed through king-pins at a high rate. Using Molybond grease certainly reduced king-pin wear.

I've also been using it for years with a Lister diesel that has no oil filtration.

As it's a wear reducer, not a friction modifier, it shouldn't effect gearbox synchro operation although I've never used it in a gearbox. It certainly doesn't clog oil filters as was once a common claim. It's been around for probably 60 years. Unfortunately, the products available over the counter are greatly reduced. I used to buy the oil additives, greases, etc. direct from the factory in Dandenong in the 70s. It's now made in Sydney.

Don't use it in a newly rebuilt engine until it's run in, or it will slow down the bedding in process.

Molybond is a solid lubricant, same stuff as you puff into locks, molybinum disulphide just in an oil carrier.. It gets between the gears and creates a cushion/barrier.

I used to use it years ago but cannot find it easily now. I reckon it would be great in diffs, transfer,swivels , UJs etc. Castrol make a grease LMM.
I dunno if I would use it in an engine now with full flow filter as most would clog up the filter.
Gearboxes go with proviso that it affects some synchos.
Teflon is also good in those applications. I use teflon grease in my UJs and wheel bearings. But Nulon seemed to stop making one suitable for a rangie BW transfer or diffs.
regards Philip A

Not quite. The powder used in locks is just graphite (carbon). Graphite is a good lubricant as the carbon molecules are arranged in planes and slide across each other (so to speak). Graphite was used as an engine oil additive prior to the development of molybdenum disulphide just after WWII (from memory). Molybond is a colloidal suspension of molybdenum disulphide in oil, or as an additive in grease. It lubricates in much the same manner as graphite except that it has a tendency to attach itself to the metal surfaces. You therefore have moly to moly wear rather than metal to metal with an oil film between. The other advantage of moly is that it tends to self-repair. If the bonded layer is broke, moly from the oil suspension fill the gap.

Being a colloid, the particles are so small that they remain in suspension and don't settle out. They are also so small that they pass through the filter without clogging it. The carbon that accumulates in the oil of a diesel engine also passes through the filter which is why the oil remains so black.

I used to have a full set of Molybond technical bulletins at home, but may have ditched them years ago. I'll have a look on the weekend and post anything helpful I can find.

Warwick.

Nulon (with Teflon) is a friction modifier adding an extra slippery coating to the surface.

Thanks Warwick! Interesting stuff. I'd be interested to see what you can dig up if you still have the technical garb.

I have used Moly bond many times in Noisy diffs and Gearboxs. And it realy does quiten them a lot. Usually when rebuilding a second hand gearbox or diff with second hand parts i will add this just to make sure its less likely to whine.

I would be wary of using it in an engine, even though the particle size is very small (0.45-0.75 microns). Some of it will still end up in the oil filter.

Molybdenum Disulphide (MoS2)

Used by manufacturers of specialized oils and greases and in the manufacture of high-grade disc pads. Available in 3 particle size distributions
i.e.:
M-3 average particles size 0.75 micron.
M-4 average particle size 0.45 micron
M-8 average particle size -75 micron.

http://www.goldtown-phils.com/lubricants/graphite.htm

Below is a theoretical (but reasonably typical) filtration efficiency curve for an oil filter. Based on the particle sizes for molybdenum disulphide above, and a density of 4800kg/m3, you would expect about 10-15% of the molybdenum particles in your oil to end up in the filter, and since the oil goes through the filter many times between changes, this could be even higher.

The Molybond Colloid 20 (Colloid 10 years ago) was a 20% suspension of MoS2 in oil with a particle size of under 0.5 micron from memory. The recommended dose gave about a 0.75% concentration in the engine.

I can't find the folder full of tech bulletins from the 70s when they were owned by Placer. Must have thrown them out in a house move. Sorry.

I used to be able to buy it in 500ml and 1 litre cans from Morgan Chemicals but only seems to be around in the more expensive single-dose yellow tubes now.

Still have a can of GA10 bearing grease and 122L aerosol for dry treatment before assembly (as an anti-seize agent) from the early 70s.