Balljoint flip alternative

[DougH]

I was just thinking about the whole balljoint flip. What if you took a stock arm and cut out the section where the balljoint sits. Have a piece fabricated that is that has the same measurements but have it rewelded so that section of the arm is lower than the rest.

Hard to describe, but basically you would be recessing the part of the arm the balljoint sits on.

If you did the work right, and welded it right it would be just as strong as before. A good weld is an improvement over the balljoint flip in my opinion.

You would have more space under the bump stops. The balljoint will still be retained because it will be on the top of the arm instead of under it. And you will have custom arms for a cheap price.

Just playing with the idea. I will be replacing my upper arms soon, so it might be an actual project.

[Bitsamissin]

Yep good idea but the arms being pressed steel might be a problem.
If you look at a Gen 3 arms they are cast now = much stronger.
I wonder how much more it would be to just have custom upper arms made up with a raised and recessed section for the upper balljoint ??
You could profile the pattern to suit a larger balljoint with 10 or 12mm holes (instead of 8mm) for added strength.

[Alex Kogan]

Doug,
Well you know my opinion on the flip. But I was still thinking about possible improvements in that area. One idea comes to mind. Why not just cut off those brakets upper bump stop sits on and reweld them further down at adjusted angle. This would allow upper are to move as much as it can. Of course at some point upper balljoint will start to lockup but there should be some space for improvement. At the same time the integrity of front suspension won't be compromised.

[Noisey]

engineers certificate ??

[DougH]

engineers certificate ??

Not here in the US.

Frank, Alex: I had a whole reply typed up for you two but the site ate it. I will post tommarow, I need sleep, back at working again at 6:00am.

[Alex Kogan]

Still waiting.

[toastmaster]

here in the U.S. we have long travel upper control arms available just buy those dough

[Alex Kogan]

Where

[DougH]

Still waiting.

HAHA

Ok Frank first. I think modifying the stock arms would accomplish the same thing for less money and less hassle. Getting a machine shop to make me custom arms with custom bushing and everything is going to take a lot of planning and money. Getting a machining shop to laser cut and bend a piece of metal on the other hand is a pretty low key job. They are also less likely to start freaking out about liability. One of the guys I work with here at the Navy base used weld on race cars, I can get him to tig weld the piece and the arm up for free (well maybe some beer). There are also less things to get right with modifying, but with the custom arms there are a ton more variables that have to be dead on.

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Alex I have thought about that in the past. It isn't a bad idea I just think it might be an extra pain in the arse. Only one of the upper arm stops is separate. the other one is part of the lower stop. With all the salt on the road the less things I cut and reweld on this frame the better.

If I am replacing the upper arms they are already off the truck. So other than the fabrication the only extra work will be bolting them on.


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I wasn't aware of any company making such things.

[cookie monster]

wilst out running (do a lot of thinking when out on the road !!) the other night i was thinking about the ball joint flip and what other ways could be used to give the same effect.
came up with an idea ! here goes !

thinking about the joint between the upper balljoint and the hub casting.
if i made a spacer the same size as the top of the hub casting where the balljoint fits (from memory it is rectangular and flat) i could turn the taper to suit the balljoint into the spacer block(same thickness as the hub).
this could then be screwed (or welded-not sure) to the top of the hub casting(if there is room for screws).
the spacer could then be attached to the balljoint and then attached(with screws) to the top of the hub casting.

possible issues

balljoint nut may not fit into existing tapered hole, so tapered hole would have to be opened up. or make thicker spacer ?

enough room on top of hub casting to fit 4-off M6 h/t socket head screws.

what do you all think ??

i think it is a possibility, but will have to have a measure up on the weekend. could easily be produced and fitted, as all you would need to do is remove hub, position spacer and g-clamp. then spot through holes and drill hub casting.

cookie monster

[cookie monster]

as soon as i had posted my idea, i remembered i had a pic of the area !
had a look, and you would have to make the spacer at least twice as thick as the hub and also have to weld it to the hub.
also think that there is not enough 'meat' on the spacer to weld onto hub as the nut is almost as large as the hub width.
oh well, back to the drawing board !!

although!!
you could make a nut that goes thru the hub from the bottom and screws onto the balljoint(which is mounted into the spacer).
this would then clamp the spacer to the hub. a piece of nylon fitted into the split pin hole would act as the thread lock. could also tack the spacer to the hub for safe measures.

cookie monster

[DougH]

I dont like the idea of welding on the steering spindle or modifying it.

The upper arm would be much easier to modify!!! You can cut out a section of the a-arm and weld it back up with full penetration. Good luck getting that on the spindle!!!!