Vitara Bottom Ends

Post by **greg** » Mon Jul 11, 2005 2:03 pm

Hi Folks,

I'm considering building up a Vitara engine that I have lying around someone elses garage and was just wondering what people are doing to these engines when the bottom end needs a rebuild?

here's what i have found on the suzisport website:

Big Bore Kit A$ 450.00
Big Bore Kit expands your 1590cc engine out to approximately 1750cc . This will give your vitara that extra punch .
Kit includes 4 x pistons and rings

Has anyone had anything to do with this? Does it sound like the beez knees of ideas?

We're talking about an EFI engine here, so i'm guessing the computer might need changing?

Fill me in on the goss.

Thanks,
Greg

Post by **greg** » Mon Jul 11, 2005 2:05 pm

ok, i found this:
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... light=bore

but i'm still wondering about the injectors / computer issues

Post by **Guy** » Mon Jul 11, 2005 3:17 pm

greg wrote:Hi Folks,

I'm considering building up a Vitara engine that I have lying around someone elses garage and was just wondering what people are doing to these engines when the bottom end needs a rebuild?

here's what i have found on the suzisport website:

Big Bore Kit A$ 450.00
Big Bore Kit expands your 1590cc engine out to approximately 1750cc . This will give your vitara that extra punch .
Kit includes 4 x pistons and rings

Has anyone had anything to do with this? Does it sound like the beez knees of ideas?

We're talking about an EFI engine here, so i'm guessing the computer might need changing?

Fill me in on the goss.

Thanks,
Greg

This is for you daily driver I am assuming ..
So long as it is not going to be revved hard I would go for it, the price sounds quite reasonable.
The reason I ask if it's for your daily driver is that the connecting rods in the 1.6 are known to break at high engine speeds, the added weight of the larger piston it may be slightly dubious how well they hold together..

would make some very nice torque though for a smallish lightweight donk .. get the head redone with some slightly larger valves and and a decent cam and exhaust it would be pretty good runner capable of devloping much more torque than a normal 1.6

Post by **Damo** » Mon Jul 11, 2005 3:31 pm

love_mud wrote:
The reason I ask if it's for your daily driver is that the connecting rods in the 1.6 are known to break at high engine speeds, the added weight of the larger piston it may be slightly dubious how well they hold together..

All else being equal, adding 3mm to the diameter of the piston is hardly going to add much weight. You could probably trim the skirts or something to get them back to original if you really wanted to.

In any case the rev limit would be more of an issue, and being EFI the engine should be rev limited, so I can't see any problem.

Post by cj » Mon Jul 11, 2005 3:35 pm

Do it!!

MX-5 pistons or TX-3 pistons (78mm) with a little machining to the piston tops and the rods to allow a 1mm larger dia. piston pin and a comp. ratio around 10:1. along with some larger sleeves (have a look at L.A. Sleeves) Personally I wouldn't go with the Suzisport kit as there are no oversizes available and it's not resleeved and still uses a stock headgasket and its actually less than 1750cc. The only piston I have found with the same piston pin diameter that may work with some machining to the piston top to get the right compression height is a Mitsubishi 1597cc 4G32 engine. Has 76.9mm pistons standard and has 0.5. 1.0 & 1.5mm oversize options. I have also seen some custom 79mm pistons being put in an engine. They are $$$ from ACL I think and they can make custom head gaskets too but they don't require machining to the rod. Have a talk to Dion at Susuki Carbusters as he does these mods and did the one for 4play, not Joe. The computer and injectors should cope with this degree of mod from what I have been able to find out so far.

Post by **Guy** » Mon Jul 11, 2005 3:37 pm

Damo wrote:
love_mud wrote:
The reason I ask if it's for your daily driver is that the connecting rods in the 1.6 are known to break at high engine speeds, the added weight of the larger piston it may be slightly dubious how well they hold together..
All else being equal, adding 3mm to the diameter of the piston is hardly going to add much weight. You could probably trim the skirts or something to get them back to original if you really wanted to.

In any case the rev limit would be more of an issue, and being EFI the engine should be rev limited, so I can't see any problem.

They have been know to some apart at lowish (5500/6000) rpm. the added 3mm of metal at 5000 rpm adds alot of additional weight and could cause fatuige quicker than standard ..
It will most likely hold together perfectly well .. it is just an added stress on the motor that should be taken into consideration.

(I was repetedly told that 1.6's blow up easy .. i tried pretty hard to kill mine regularly taking it past redline and keeping it there in bog holes etc, it showed no signs of abuse after years of thrashing).

Post by cj » Mon Jul 11, 2005 3:37 pm

Ivan Tighe Engineering up in QLD does cams for these motors.

Post by **Damo** » Mon Jul 11, 2005 3:46 pm

love_mud wrote:(I was repetedly told that 1.6's blow up easy .. i tried pretty hard to kill mine regularly taking it past redline and keeping it there in bog holes etc, it showed no signs of abuse after years of thrashing).

I have heard this story a fair bit myself. If anyone has some real world experience to back it up i'm sure there are quite a few that would be interested in hearing about it.

Any more info on these cams cj?

Nice tech in this thread, keep it comin'.

Post by **Guy** » Mon Jul 11, 2005 3:58 pm

based on a visual inspection of the 1.3 rods compared to the 1.6 rods, the 1.3's have WAY more beef around the the top of the big end, about half way up the rod things equal out. (where the conrod is under far less load as well)
It (the 1.6) rod is less beefy in this area due to piston skirt clearance issues.

The 1.6 has a larger psiton and a longer stroke meaning higher piston speeds are reached for the same rpm, putting greater loads on smaller parts that have to control heavier components.

I have not had any first hand experiance with legs out of bd witg g16 motors though

Post by **flyinwall** » Mon Jul 11, 2005 4:30 pm

has anyone put the 1.3 conrods in the 1.6 as they are shorter and with an oversized piston that should push the cc's out a bit further and shave the head put in a towing grind cam slightly larger valves heavier valve springs and dont forget to give it a port and polish and it should give a good power/tourqe increase (yeah i know there is a fair cost involved but i recon it would be worth it in the long run)

Post by **greg** » Mon Jul 11, 2005 5:20 pm

well you've all done very well and i am suitibly confused by all this discussion...

sounds like a whole lot of work to me...

Post by **Beastmavster** » Mon Jul 11, 2005 5:44 pm

What about a baleno 1800cc block?

Post by **Santos** » Mon Jul 11, 2005 6:33 pm

flyinwall wrote:has anyone put the 1.3 conrods in the 1.6 as they are shorter and with an oversized piston that should push the cc's out a bit further and shave the head put in a towing grind cam slightly larger valves heavier valve springs and dont forget to give it a port and polish and it should give a good power/tourqe increase (yeah i know there is a fair cost involved but i recon it would be worth it in the long run)

Well no need to shave the head if your going mazda 78mm pistons if your using 1.3 conrods.. after all wouldn't these negate each other.
(see post a couple up talking about machining

)

I don't think it would be that hard to a regular rebuild greg... just need to plan out the parts and the steps.. there's alot of tech in the teamswift.net sight about overboring the g16 block

If i remember correctly i red that 94 onwards mx5 pistons have a slightly higher compression (though the tx3 ones are lighter and filled with silicon)

(you abandoning your F6a?)

Post by **greg** » Tue Jul 12, 2005 12:25 pm

Santos wrote: (you abandoning your F6a?)

2 sierras
4 engines
5 gearboxes
no garage

sadly gearbox issues mean that the F6A is already taking a back seat mate.

Post by **Santos** » Tue Jul 12, 2005 1:05 pm

well if you want i have triple lock up garage if you need to off load some gear in Sydney

But seriously, would a f5a jimny box do/fit?

Post by **greg** » Tue Jul 12, 2005 5:10 pm

Santos wrote:well if you want i have triple lock up garage if you need to off load some gear in Sydney

But seriously, would a f5a jimny box do/fit?

possibly, but i'm guessing not... still hunting around for the f6a gearbox...

Post by **Santos** » Tue Jul 12, 2005 5:44 pm

$1500 whole car uncomplied, in South Australia

Buy it, Part it out,keep the gearbox

(dibs on Powersteering)

Post by **nicbeer** » Tue Jul 12, 2005 7:37 pm

Santos wrote:
$1500 whole car uncomplied, in South Australia

Buy it, Part it out,keep the gearbox

(dibs on Powersteering)

If you do i want the body.

Post by **Santos** » Tue Jul 12, 2005 7:57 pm

i thought of you for the body but wouldn't it have a chassis number on the firewall not of an australian model... course you could always transfer the plate as i suggested elsewhere

Post by **nicbeer** » Tue Jul 12, 2005 8:17 pm

Hmmm, forgot bout that one.

always a loophole in there somewhere.

cheers

Post by **SiKiD_01** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 12:10 pm

D.I.Y engine rebuild (G16 motor)
http://www.zukiworld.com/forum/index.php?topic=59.0
1.6L Turbo Engine carnage pics (some tech)
http://www.zukiworld.com/forum/index.php?topic=7.0

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