Outer Limits 4x4 Board

I've been tossing up the idea of buying a Detomaso Charade half cut
Rolin Imports want $1800. Does that sound like a good price

I only wanna swap the head, manifolds and computer over as it has the same block as the feroza.
The detomaso engine has an extra 22Kw over the feroza donk and it also has more torque lower in the rev range

Let me know what u think.

Would it be worth it or not

hopefully you should be able to sell off the bits you dont need and you will still have a spare donk in case you decide to use a shit load of nos.

what a ripoff.you can get them for cheaper.

Not real keen on NOS

Dont forget a half cut does include the gearbox which I would try and sell

They origonaly had $2000 on it but have now reduced it

if they reduced the cost yhey cant sell it all the better for you to bargain them down

Wonder if they would take $1600 cash

Might email them and find out

It would only be worth it if it was a DeTomaso Pantera.

[quote="awill4x4"]It would only be worth it if it was a DeTomaso Pantera.


the owner of the broken hill wreakers was selling a pantera it was a little tame compared to the one in the pic

awill4x4 wrote:It would only be worth it if it was a DeTomaso Pantera.

Yeah, but getting a FRONT cut of a Pantera would be pretty pointless wouldnt it

Anyone remember DrEdlistein? And the pink DeTomaso his wife owned?
Well you might recall backin about 1986 he was decalre bankrupt - the company I was working for somehow recalims the DeTomaso.....
It was enough ta make you wanna cry - they poor thing had ben flooged to within a millimeter of it's life....Seriously it looked like they'd had multiple attempts at standing starts with maximum rpm - it was FLOOOGGGED.....

an person I know , , was rooting her , just after they split up !!!!!

it was proberly him givin' it sh!t !!!!!

rocknferoza
go to www.daihard.org.

James, I reckon it would be a good conversion. Have you investigated if the computer is a straight swap wiring wise, and if the distributor set up is the same (ie not controlled by the EFI)?

Are you sure the heads are different too? I always thought it was just the manifolds and cam that were different?

moose wrote:an person I know , , was rooting her , just after they split up !!!!!

PICS!!!!

rocknferoza wrote:I only wanna swap the head, manifolds and computer over as it has the same block as the feroza.

so why not just buy these parts? 22kw is shit all, you would get that easy with a good exhaust, cam and breathing.


NICK

awill4x4 wrote:
It would only be worth it if it was a DeTomaso Pantera.


Yeah, but getting a FRONT cut of a Pantera would be pretty pointless wouldnt it

Only problem is that the pantera dont have the same block which means custom adaptors and then gotta stuff around with engineers No thanx

James, I reckon it would be a good conversion. Have you investigated if the computer is a straight swap wiring wise, and if the distributor set up is the same (ie not controlled by the EFI)?

Are you sure the heads are different too? I always thought it was just the manifolds and cam that were different?

I might have a chat 2 my cousin or even toyota and find out about the computer and distributor.
I think the head would be the same but I think it would be much easier and less time consuming 2 just swap the heads over then swaping manifolds and changing the cam.
I read on the MRT web site that the fuel injection system is different.

so why not just buy these parts? 22kw is shit all, you would get that easy with a good exhaust, cam and breathing.

I'd be looking at around $400 just for a cam. The detomaso charade obviously has a bigger intake manifold and possibly a bigger throttle body and I can always get them power ported which means more air= more power
The biggest advantage is if something goes wrong with one engine I've always got a spare

Heres a pic of the half cut

Have you checked out the distributor? I can't tell from the pic, but has it got a vacuum advance like the Feroza?

I think it's Tighe cams who make the Detomaso spec cams, they've got all the specs for the HD cams on their website. From memory when I was on the Daihard site a lot, guys were building up their own Detomaso engines using various bits off Charade engines and bolting it all onto a standard Applause engine. I might put a post on Daihard later and find out what the go is (I wasn't interested at the time as I didn't have the Feroza.)

Am I missing something?

If it's the same block, wouldn't it be easier to swap the whole engine and be done with it rather than friggin around with all the bits?!?!

Yes! You are missing something!

The only big $$$ item is the cam. All the other bits (from what I remember) are off various Charade engines and available at the wrecker. Why pay $1800 for a front cut if you can buy the cam and scrounge some bits from the wrecker and bolt them to the existing Feroza engine? Saves the hassle of swapping the engines over.

Don't forget the vehicle may need to be inspected to change engine numbers- plus the Detomaso engine is a FWD set up, so there could be problems fitting it (? will the Feroza gearbox bolt up to it ?)

I've posted a question on Daihard about the engines, will post results here when I get an answer.

"there's SOD-ALL difference. Cam, extractors, ECU, same EFI as the HE-E... that's about it!"

That's the best response that I've had so far!

I'm beginning to think that the Detomaso has ECU controlled timing "same EFI as HE-E" (unlike the Feroza)- meaning a change of the wiring loom to use the ECU.....

So James, bank on changing your wiring looms/ grafting one out of two if you go ahead with the swap!

Ok now I'm confused What is the HE-E engine Is it a later version of the HD-E or what.
My cousin told me awhile ago that some later model Daihatsu Applauses came out with varible valve timing.

ECU controlled timing sounds good 2 me

Heres a bit of imfo off the MRT website
A whole new fuel injection system added to a new inlet manifold yields a 1.6-litre engine that outperforms the 1.6-litre Applause on response and torque. The improved inlet and fuel injection tuning would be useless without a performance exhaust. Here the Charade has a tuned-length 4-into-1 extractor system.

An ultimate combination of power and light weight, it easily accelerates from 0-100 kph in under 9.5 seconds. The all alloy engine is rev limited to 6500 rpm - power is a healthy 92 kW at 6000 with torque of 144 Nm at 4000 rpm.

HE-E is the 1.5l Charade engine.

The Detomaso is just a stock HD-E with a different cam, ECU (which controls the timing!) , extractors (which won't fit the Feroza anyway), inlet manifold (off HE-E again from what I've read). The head and all internals are all the same as a Feroza.

So basically (in my opinion only) you could get a better set up by using similar parts (ie. Detomaso spec cam from Tighe Cams) and an aftermarket ECU with your stock engine. You could even utilise your current distributor as it already has a electronic pick up in it - just lock it in place and let the after market ECU do the timing adjustments. Could be worth looking into if your serious about a power increase.

Oh yeah, from my experiences, avoid shopping at MRT.........

Well I had a look through one of my mags and the detomaso inlet manifold looks the same as the 1.5 charade. If i was 2 get the half cut or put the other manifold on I would have 2 change the hoses between the airbox and the throttle body. The throttle body would be on the firewall side of the manifold.
Obviously the 1.5 inlet manifold must flow more air then the ferozas.

Did you get anymore feedback david

No more feedback James. They're a bit anally retentive on that BBS!

I got the old "read the FAQ" blah blah blah.... Pity it's impossible to find the FAQ and then there's nothing on the subject!

Anyway, basically like I said it's all bolt on external bits (apart from the cam) that are different- the head, pistons, block etc are all the same. It does have ECU controlled timing (the biggest bonus in my mind and probably where most power is gained). As far as the inlet flowing more: it shouldn't be too hard to get a larger throttle body and fit it onto the Feroza manifold.

Personally I would get aftermarket injection fitted to your Feroza, the cam, Feroza headers, and set that up to suit. It wouldn't be hard to use your existing distributor and have ECU controlled timing. Cost would work out very similar and in the end you'd have a better overall power output.

I used to work for an EFI company and regularly did conversions from carby to EFI. The wiring isn't that hard - particularly when the Feroza would only need a few extra wires run for the distributor- the rest is already there. You just lock the pick up in the distributor so it can't move and block off your vacuum plumbing running to it.

That turbo at the top of the picture would also make a good addition to the de tomaso engine.

But also, the de tomaso engine is probably built stronger than a stock HD-E in terms of pistons and other bottom end bits. So simply bolting on the head and efi could totally destroy your engine if something gives.

Rod

r_santos wrote:But also, the de tomaso engine is probably built stronger than a stock HD-E in terms of pistons and other bottom end bits. So simply bolting on the head and efi could totally destroy your engine if something gives.

Rod

No Rod, the one thing I did establish is internally they are identical. There is no difference even with the head.

There are stock internal Feroza engines running around happily with turbos hanging off them, so a few inlet and exhaust mods plus a cam isn't going to cause them to self destruct. Apparently the gearboxes give up first with more power from a turbo.