Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Hey guys - thanks again for all the help! Looking more like I am saving for a new motor every day...

How much time do I need to set aside to do the job? I mean, is a weekend enough or do I need a week?

Drewe

Depends on your experience, workshop facilities, tools, etc.

You should be able to knock it over in a weekend, especially if you've got a mate or 2 to help.

I took a week to do mine, even with a couple of mates helping, had a few hiccups and I was a bit over engine swaps by that stage... it was my 4th engine swap in a month in different vehicles.

As always, any questions or probs, post 'em up here and somebody should be able to advise a resolution.

Good luck.

How long - Depends how many mates you can con into helping you.

Now let me think:
I just did a Commodore motor swap and planned on 3 weeks. So 3 months later it is finally going - turned into a bit more than a motor swap.
Today the man in the tow truck came and took away the old shell much to the delight of my wife..
Yes with a bit of help your Feroza could look like this.

When the time comes let me know and I'll offer to help you - providing you're close to Brisbane.

Stu

Double your estimate and then allow time for stuff ups!

Seriously, it would be best to not have any pressure on to get it done by a certain day. It's when you rush things that expensive mistakes happen.

if u use your roza as a DD maybe buy a really cheap car with a month or so rego on ebay?? like less than $500... just a thought so your not without a car. ( i bought a $500 ute and she had less mech problems than my rocky )

With that money.. you could put it towards getting a professional to do it.. only take a day (maybe 2) to do a straight swap

HotFourOk wrote:With that money.. you could put it towards getting a professional to do it.. only take a day (maybe 2) to do a straight swap

Yeah, but.......nah, i got nothing

haha

Thanks Guys - I am still working on options. I am positive the notes my engine makes when started and cold are the death rattle - getting less and less out of each tank - I can't even get up a slight grade when cold with less than 4K on the tach - can't launch from the lights either without revving like a boy racer - and it takes when cold like 10 seconds, foot flat to reach 3-4K on the tach! She is one sick puppy.....

No $$ for a couple of months right now - something about a boat and the missus reversing the good car (12 month old falcon - I got it new!!) into a ute a couple of weeks ago :(

Oh well. I'll keep you updated... Still thinking of finding an appluase from a granny somewhere, take it's engine, drop my dead donk in it and sell it for bits to even out

Drewe

Is it using oil Drewe- or just lacking power and chewing fuel?

Using oil as bad as petrol..... I think I put in about 1L with the last tank and it was gone with it!

:(
@#$#@ car. Rego just came and I am soooo tempted.....

Yes, that sounds terminal then.

Damn - I was hoping you would say something like 'well, then it just this #3 part......'!!

Whats the eating all the oil thing? Is it burning it or what? Man, I so don't have any power anymore, and it almost thinks before responding...

Hey - I could just buy a Lada badge and call it new!!!

I'm thinking you're low on compression (rings or valves?) and oil is getting burned. This in turn will have stuffed your oxy sensor, causing it to chew fuel due to incorrect mixtures and be sluggish to respond to the accelerator. Plus with low compression you'll have lost power.

It's a great theory anyway!

I just don't know what to do with the @#$@$# thing now!

- Burning Lotsa Oil
- No power
- Definately no power under 2-3K
- Can't go up hills (foot flat on a slight grade in third and you don't get much past 60!)
- Has either an exhaust or bearing rattle (please no the second!)
:(

Now the problems
- I paid too much for it, only 6 monthish ago!
- I spent $1200 on the head getting it machined perfect and all that
- Radiator, leads, fuel and air filters, and all that add $2K to my high purchase price
- @#$@# thing has a stuffed interior and full of dents and rust spots!!!!


I just can't decide whether to throw another 2K at (Import or low K engine, maybe keep/use my head and all my new bits!) - or cut my losses and buy something more conservative for the second car - and loose $5K or more selling the rest off, over 6 months!

Oh well, I have to take the flak, I got ripped in the first and all downhill from here..... I love my little Roza, but my pockets only go so far....

Drewe

Have you done a compression test? Do that and see what it shows.

An Applause motor should cost you less than $1000.

You've had some bad luck.

I just might - but compression loss means basically a rebuild of the bottom end anyway doesn't it? I mean, the whol head has to come off and pistons out, may as well do the lot....

I have found an import Feroza motor for $1100 and the missus says it is ok to buy.... Just going to spend the week I think working out cost options, I still like the roza enough and think if I spend this it should last a fair bit longer (As long as I get onto that rust!!)

Otherwise I will go the granny applause route - get that into my Roza and then rebuild it's engine (maybe) and sell it.... Probably cost as much, or with my luck more!!

Drewe

Go the Applause motor. You'll pay top $$$ for a Feroza engine as they are harder to come by.

The Applause engine will have a bit more power too and only a few things will need to be swapped over to fit it (there's another post in here somewhere with a list of them.)

Most likely cause of your engine failure is crap fuel causing pinging....a funny rattling noise usually around 3500rpm.

This will cause, usually, burnt valves, hence the need for your head rebuild, but more importantly, it puts a lot of stress on the bottom end, stuffing your rings and main crankshaft bearings. Do the Applause swap and you won't look back.

You can do the lot for <$1000.

Do a search on Applause motors in this section for more info.

I've had very few probs with pinging since I installed the Applause donk.

AJ, funny you should mention pinging!

I run 98 octane fuel and can still have problems on steep hills in hot weather. I think I know know the cause- the vacuum advance. Mine would do it for a second or so after changing gears, or after flooring it from a closed throttle. I've been driving it with the vacuum advance disconnected and basically haven't been able to detect any detonation.

My theory is the vacuum advance mechanism is a bit sluggish to respond to the change in vacuum and keeps the timing advance too high when the throttle is suddenly opened. The small diameter tubing wouldn't help that's used to run the advance line IMHO.

The only thing is, while my detonation apparently gone, I've now got overheating issues at idle. Guess what- I was just reading the manual and overheating can be caused by retarded timing (ie. possibly from me having the vac advance disconnected!) You just can't win...

I'll have to try reconnecting it to see if the overheating disappears.

I wonder if swapping the distributor for an Applause one would change things- or if the cam would be needed too?

Yep being a tightarse and only using ULP will cost ya money in the long run. The previous owner of mine must have run ULP and it pings its guts out. Burn a valve out within 2 months of ownership costing me 3k for a full rebuild !

Expensive damn Feroza, coulda had my SWB patrol after all.

It seems even fussier now as to what fuel it will and won't ping on. All ULP is off limits. Will ping on all brands of premium unleaded and even optimax and BP ultimate will ping if purchased from outer suburb servos. i've found if I go to the Shell or BP close to town in the richer suburbs it will not ping.

I put this down to the richies using alot more of it therefore not having stale fuel in the tanks or these servos use better or no additives in there fuels.

Either way, im safe if I fill up at a servo that has a high turnover of there 98 RON fuels. PS Mobil and Caltex do not have anything that will not ping.

Cheers
Brad

Ironically, mine all started going bad the first time I put Shell Optimax in it - it was having slight troubles and I though optimax would clean it out - now i lost lotsa power!

Got rid of the rattle though.... Wasn't a bearing! Yeah!

Dg under the car and found one of the U bolt holders for the Exhause had come off the mounting and rattling around.... So much better!

Going to do all the other usual things and see if I can make this thing run just a little longer.... B4 the engine swap!

Drewe

Rb25sil80 wrote: PS Mobil and Caltex do not have anything that will not ping.

In NSW Mobil have 'Mobil 8000' Premium and Caltex have 'Vortex 98', both of which are a minimum 98 octane rated fuel. Just a bit of useless knowledge.. lol

Yeah, I have always ran the highest grade PULP in my cars and the benefit is really worth it.. some people cant see past the 8c or so at the bowser
But I havn't put it in my Rocky yet... better not either.. it may ping some

i wonder how people will go with the new 100 octane/ron fuel

although 5% etholonol they recon its still safe

cheers
elliot

5% is not much to worry about.. At my work we sell a 10% blend which has the same octane rating as Vortex and they claim it is safe for all post 1987 cars that run on regular ULP. We have signed documents from dealers such as Subaru which states what cars can run it with no problems whatsoever, and thier warranty is still valid.
(Only exclusion was MY00 WRX STi - sif theyd use it anyway )

In a short period of time... there will not be a fuel available without a portion of ethanol in it. If 5% or even 10% of the fuel used is saed by substituting with ethanol... thats so many more years of fuel for the world.. the petrol supplies wont last forever.

100 octane will be beneficial for cars that take advantage of a higher octane fuel.. but a lot of it is a sales pitch.. people just love higher octane numbers In a lot of cases it does squat.

I've been running the 10% stuff from United. 94 octane and no pinging.

Since doing the Applause swap, I've had very few probs with pinging, although hot weather on standard ULP will cause a bit. Could certainly try an Applause dizzy, might just do the trick. I certainly wasn't going to use my old one off the old motor.

All this is making me think seriously about a conversion to full electronically controlled timing again.... http://www.delta-digital.com.au/Deltamax%20Info.htm

HotFourOk wrote:

Rb25sil80 wrote: PS Mobil and Caltex do not have anything that will not ping.

In NSW Mobil have 'Mobil 8000' Premium and Caltex have 'Vortex 98', both of which are a minimum 98 octane rated fuel. Just a bit of useless knowledge.. lol

Yeah, I have always ran the highest grade PULP in my cars and the benefit is really worth it.. some people cant see past the 8c or so at the bowser
But I havn't put it in my Rocky yet... better not either.. it may ping some

I wouldnt put vortex in the same sentence with Ultimate and Optimax. It really is a rubbish fuel. I've tried it many times and my cars have all pinged badly on it. If it truly is a 98 ron fuel (which I highly doubt) it must be at least 10% ethanol.

And I would never use a mobil 98 ron as mobil servos up here are about the size of your little independant servo and I just refuse to believe they would stock a high grade premium, let alone have a fresh supply as they do not do enough business to get rid of it before it goes stale.

And yes fuel definately goes stale, 10-14 days in our heat im told.

And as for the 00 STI, Did you say Subaru stated Ethanol is not safe to use in them? Wonder what they will do in a few years when all our gas is watered down with ethanol :(

Probably won't pay to own a performance car in years to come, i'm glad I got my fix at a young age !

Cheers
Brad

On the subject of Ethanol mixtures, I heard somewhere that they are more resistant to detonation? Don't know if it's true or not?

We don't get Optimax in SA, but out of Mobil's 98 (Synergy 8000?)and BP Ultimate, I get BP. Mobil still pinged..... and I tried two different servos.