Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Been thinking of buying a mig welder to do some bar work on my truck, rear bar, sliders and other stuff. What would be a good welder to look at without going overboard on size or price.?
Would something like a 130 amp or a 150 amp be enough or would l be better off to go bigger?
What about gasless?, are they any good?.

Cheers,

I'd be looking at atleast a 150 amp. If a welder is advertised as being capable of welding 6mm steel it doesn't mean to can weld two pieces of 6 mm together because that's 12mm of steel. Well you could weld them but not with very good penetration.
Don't go gasless. it's convenient but i find it doesn't weld anywhere near as good.
Good luck!

Hi eighty8, I’m a welder by trade, I recommend a welder about 200amp
Gasless ok for light metal, but gas is the way to go.
But this all depends on how often you are going to use the welder,
Maybe just hire a welder.


baldrick

Search - I would be looking at unit over 200Amps if you wanted to do structural welds.

Tom

ruff wrote:
There have been just a couple of threads on here in the past discussing Welders-

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... ght=welder

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... ght=welder

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... ght=welder

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... ght=welder

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... ght=welder

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... ght=welder

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... ght=welder

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... ght=welder

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... ght=welder

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... ght=welder

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... ght=welder

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... ght=welder

I noticed some of these threads came from someone familiar to you

Try a search next time before you ask a question that gets asked every month or so

hey i work at a tool shop be carefull with some of the cheaper migs around we sell sip 150 amp migs with a 10 amp plug and a WIA 150 amp mig with a 15 amp plug the wia is a genuine 150 amp while the sip is around 100 amps that probably why the wias about 800 bucks dearer
hope this helps Adam...

Agree with Ruffy, the rutile strength of gasless wire would not be strong enough for your applications.
I would go for a 200A machine, you can always turn the heat down if need be and have that extra in reserve for heavier stuff.
I gather you would be using medium or heavy guage pipe.
Remember too that some welders are like cars, they might have 240kph on the speedo but it doesn't mean they will go that fast.
Go for a reputable brand, there's plenty of good ones about WIA, BOC, Cigweld, Lincoln, Liquid Arc etc.

cheers

im an apprentice boiler maker by trade i run just a simple 2 phase gas mig welder with 0.6 and 0.8 wire , this one i got between 6 and 10mm plate, they well do ur slider and whats not, it call due mig

i got mine from a guy in sydney who build his entire hot rod with it and alot of his 4x4 work

id reacon a good 400-500 buck will get you what you need to do

I use a 220amp Cigweld fantastic machine.Have welded 1.2mm through to 12mm plate no probs at all..

matthewK wrote:im an apprentice boiler maker by trade i run just a simple 2 phase gas mig welder

I hope you know more about boilers than electricity

Peter.
Ps, have you had that pizza yet?

Just remember that using .8mm gasless wire is about the same as using .6mm gas wire. This is due to the wire being hollow and full of flux.

droopypete wrote:

matthewK wrote:im an apprentice boiler maker by trade i run just a simple 2 phase gas mig welder

I hope you know more about boilers than electricity

Peter.
Ps, have you had that pizza yet?

he obviously knows more than you droopy........ive never worked on a welder that uses all 3 phases, theres just a gun and a earth, they only use two of the three phases.

mickyd555 wrote:

droopypete wrote:

matthewK wrote:im an apprentice boiler maker by trade i run just a simple 2 phase gas mig welder

I hope you know more about boilers than electricity

Peter.
Ps, have you had that pizza yet?

he obviously knows more than you droopy........ive never worked on a welder that uses all 3 phases, theres just a gun and a earth, they only use two of the three phases.

Classic!

chimpboy wrote:

mickyd555 wrote:

droopypete wrote:

matthewK wrote:im an apprentice boiler maker by trade i run just a simple 2 phase gas mig welder

I hope you know more about boilers than electricity

Peter.
Ps, have you had that pizza yet?

he obviously knows more than you droopy........ive never worked on a welder that uses all 3 phases, theres just a gun and a earth, they only use two of the three phases.

Classic!

You basically have a choice of single-phase power and three-phase power from any power station. The word "phase" relates to the AC cycle.

The way it works is this. An AC generator produces power in a cyclical way - remember the original dynamo is actually a rotating mechanism, so the power produced goes up and down, up and down, in a regular pattern. This is what the 50Hz refers to if you look under your alarm clock - it'll say something like "220-240VAC 50Hz." 50Hz is 50 times a second, so an ordinary single phase power point goes up and down 50 times a second.

Three phase power is three lots of single phase power with the peaks coming at different times. So when one phase is dropping down, the next phase is peaking, and then the next, so you get more peaks all the time - more power.

So, typically, relatively low power domestic equipment is single-phase, while more serious industrial gear is three phase. A three-phase welder still only has the gun and the earth, but it has more grunt. Lots of heavy equipment that uses electric motors is three phase, such as a good lathe.

Three phase airconditioners and so on are the most common three phase things to find around an ordinary house.

If I've remembered this wrong, someone tell me.

Jason

chimpboy wrote:

chimpboy wrote:

mickyd555 wrote:

droopypete wrote:

matthewK wrote:im an apprentice boiler maker by trade i run just a simple 2 phase gas mig welder

I hope you know more about boilers than electricity

Peter.
Ps, have you had that pizza yet?

he obviously knows more than you droopy........ive never worked on a welder that uses all 3 phases, theres just a gun and a earth, they only use two of the three phases.

Classic!

You basically have a choice of single-phase power and three-phase power from any power station. The word "phase" relates to the AC cycle.

The way it works is this. An AC generator produces power in a cyclical way - remember the original dynamo is actually a rotating mechanism, so the power produced goes up and down, up and down, in a regular pattern. This is what the 50Hz refers to if you look under your alarm clock - it'll say something like "220-240VAC 50Hz." 50Hz is 50 times a second, so an ordinary single phase power point goes up and down 50 times a second.

Three phase power is three lots of single phase power with the peaks coming at different times. So when one phase is dropping down, the next phase is peaking, and then the next, so you get more peaks all the time - more power.

So, typically, relatively low power domestic equipment is single-phase, while more serious industrial gear is three phase. A three-phase welder still only has the gun and the earth, but it has more grunt. Lots of heavy equipment that uses electric motors is three phase, such as a good lathe.

Three phase airconditioners and so on are the most common three phase things to find around an ordinary house.

If I've remembered this wrong, someone tell me.

Jason

well i just learned something......thankyou mr txu.

hienuf wrote: well i just learned something......thankyou mr txu.

If you don't mind, I've changed my name to Mr TruEnergy

my dad just bought a 250amp CIG, i love it, so much nicer to weld with, id recomend it,

ozy1 wrote:my dad just bought a 250amp CIG, i love it, so much nicer to weld with, id recomend it,

How much may I ask?

mickyd555 wrote:he obviously knows more than you droopy........ive never worked on a welder that uses all 3 phases, theres just a gun and a earth, they only use two of the three phases.

At last someone who knows welders!

Whats wrong with the lincoln/liquidarc SP170? they can be a bit pricey but there one of the best home welders you can get. they take a 5kg spool of wire - and weigh about as much as a remote of a 210 with a 15kg spool. I have never had any problems with the innershield fluxcore wire (just remember to swap the polarity around on the gun and earth) and its welded half inch with ease. Just get the settings right.

Andrew

Just a quick question.... how do you run 415v (two phase) in a standard house?...

DUE Mig's are good, i got one of their smaller 240V units, but they are also out of production so parts and service will be an issue.

Spock

Pinball wrote:Just a quick question.... how do you run 415v (two phase) in a standard house?...

DUE Mig's are good, i got one of their smaller 240V units, but they are also out of production so parts and service will be an issue.

Spock

You get 3 phase pulled in by energex or your local power authority
and you need to have your switchboard re-wired to balance the load and finally a new meter installed to meter the 3 phases

Tom

droopypete wrote:

matthewK wrote:im an apprentice boiler maker by trade i run just a simple 2 phase gas mig welder

I hope you know more about boilers than electricity

Peter.
Ps, have you had that pizza yet?

i know crap all on elec , leave me alone i was tired hehe went to bed 3:30am woke up 7am ready for tafe it was the bigest kick in the guts

thanks for sticking up for us andrew e

it runs off my normal house hold plugs but i had to make adaptor to change it down a tad from a 15amp plug to fit the normal what are they 10amp? im only renting and i aint gonna add things into this house
but useually you have to get the power boys to upgrade the power box to run biger jucie sucking machines

in my opion get the gas migs they can do helo of a lot heavyer plating then gasless, i personaly dont know of any welders who use gasless

lincons are just a bit on the $$$$ but are the best yes
cig welds prolby a decent one and good for your $$

You guys know shiat.

With 3 phase the difference between any one phase and neutral is 240V and between any two phases is 415V.

Once into the welder the power gets converted into DC anyway. If you drop or don't use a phase use lose alot of power, therefore capability.

I have a SIP 150 and it's OK for what I do, it's built 3 trailers so far. Would have liked something bigger but at twice the price this will do. For most bar work the max thickness you'll probably do is 3-4mm except maybe the mounting plates which you'll be able to get to and weld both sides anyway.

just cruizin' wrote:
I have a SIP 150 and it's OK for what I do, it's built 3 trailers so far. Would have liked something bigger but at twice the price this will do. For most bar work the max thickness you'll probably do is 3-4mm except maybe the mounting plates which you'll be able to get to and weld both sides anyway.

Just thinking about this - when you are learning how to use the thing it is a lot easier to learn when you have more power at your disposal - would you all agree ?

I know - I am a very average welder but when I use the big amp units I can make things join together very well, however if I only had a little unit that required more skill I think it would be more frustrating.

Just a thought
Tom

it runs off my normal house hold plugs but i had to make adaptor to change it down a tad from a 15amp plug to fit the normal what are they 10amp? im only renting and i aint gonna add things into this house
but useually you have to get the power boys to upgrade the power box to run biger jucie sucking machines

you probably shouldn't cut down 15A plugs to fit a 10A outlet, may cause electric shock/fire.

ausoops wrote:it runs off my normal house hold plugs but i had to make adaptor to change it down a tad from a 15amp plug to fit the normal what are they 10amp? im only renting and i aint gonna add things into this house
but useually you have to get the power boys to upgrade the power box to run biger jucie sucking machines

you probably shouldn't cut down 15A plugs to fit a 10A outlet, may cause electric shock/fire.

really i should of had the 15amp plug installed. the only on i have in the house runs the really old air con and for what i was doing at the timewasnt an issuee

althought i was in bunnings thinking they do got the full trades man cord to fit a normal house plug coming out to a 15amp?
and for a nice price of 30-40 bucks
for the price i mad my own for 16 bucks
useing the 15amp wire with 15amp plug on one end and the normal house plug on ther other

i only really reduce the welder cabability to a lesser power sorce

i could of use the old dinosur of an arc welder but i would of burnt holes in the body work and just wasnt worth time and effort and electrodes to do it that way

[quote="RaginRover
Just thinking about this - when you are learning how to use the thing it is a lot easier to learn when you have more power at your disposal - would you all agree ?

I know - I am a very average welder but when I use the big amp units I can make things join together very well, however if I only had a little unit that required more skill I think it would be more frustrating.

Just a thought
Tom[/quote]

You're right is easier to learn using a high power unit, I am also an average HOME welder by all means but welding is more about practise then anything. I've done some pretty good welds with my small unit far better then anything I've done with a big one just because I'm used to it and more practised now.

Plus for the five hundred dollars I saved I'm prepared too buy a couple more grinding disks

RAY185 wrote:

ozy1 wrote:my dad just bought a 250amp CIG, i love it, so much nicer to weld with, id recomend it,

How much may I ask?

250 AMP CIG and 15kg of wire to suit mild steel came justover $1600

just cruizin' wrote:You guys know shiat.

With 3 phase the difference between any one phase and neutral is 240V and between any two phases is 415V.

Once into the welder the power gets converted into DC anyway. If you drop or don't use a phase use lose alot of power, therefore capability.

I have a SIP 150 and it's OK for what I do, it's built 3 trailers so far. Would have liked something bigger but at twice the price this will do. For most bar work the max thickness you'll probably do is 3-4mm except maybe the mounting plates which you'll be able to get to and weld both sides anyway.

why would you use the potential between phase and nuetral to point that out, most simple 3 phase welders would not use a nuetral. The only reason for a nuetral to be present in a 3 phase welder would be for use in a 240v control circuit. chimpboys sinusoidel wave forms look to be right to me, there is 120* between phase's.

Pinball i thought you were an electrician????? if you want to run 2 phase in a house you can get 2 phase supply from energex, conditions of supply and metering require that any premise with a calculated maximum demand of more than 70amps have the load split up over two phases, but try balancing the load evenly and you will find it easier to get all 3 phases and balance the whole house

ozy1 wrote:

RAY185 wrote:

ozy1 wrote:my dad just bought a 250amp CIG, i love it, so much nicer to weld with, id recomend it,

How much may I ask?

250 AMP CIG and 15kg of wire to suit mild steel came justover $1600

Thanks for the info, sounds like a good deal but still out of my price range for now. Looks like I'll have to stick to my little arc welder for a bit longer.