Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Posted: **Wed May 03, 2006 4:44 pm**

I have seen the stamped metal plates to suit a GQ although they are expensive for what they are $150.00 odd dollars after buying bolts for 2 plates. I have also looked at the hooks heaps cheaper but are they as good/practical?
Any other ideas.

Welcome any advice, I only want do this setup once and have confidence in it.

cheers fnq

Posted: **Wed May 03, 2006 5:27 pm**

Get an OEM chassis mounted front hook from a wrecker for $20

Posted: **Wed May 03, 2006 6:00 pm**

Thanks blkmav are they rated very high? Not like the rear loop on the patrol? Might have trouble finding a couple around my area the wreckers are a bit slack and the prices way high, but I will check it out.

cheers fnq

Posted: **Wed May 03, 2006 6:03 pm**

fnqcairns wrote:Thanks blkmav are they rated very high? Not like the rear loop on the patrol? Might have trouble finding a couple around my area the wreckers are a bit slack and the prices way high, but I will check it out.

cheers fnq

send a message to Giantracing
he will have some.

they are what your taught to use in driver training
the rear one, if your talkin about the one on the rear alloy step, is not to be used. although some say they are fine, they are not recommended in the 4wd associatino training.

Posted: **Wed May 03, 2006 6:15 pm**

Patrol front hooks break under high side loding, ie pulling sideways from a rut. They snap right where the hook meets the mounting plate
They are outlawed here in some clubs in NZ because of this
J Top

Posted: **Wed May 03, 2006 6:44 pm**

J Top wrote:Patrol front hooks break under high side loding, ie pulling sideways from a rut. They snap right where the hook meets the mounting plate
They are outlawed here in some clubs in NZ because of this
J Top

Good bit of info dude, I'll get our training dudes to check this out tonight at the club meeting. maybe its changed since I did mine 4 yrs ago...

Posted: **Thu May 04, 2006 7:59 am**

What about an Outback Ideas bolt on front recovery point? I've got one on mine, they're about 10mm plate, pretty strong, around the $60-70 mark from memory.

Posted: **Thu May 04, 2006 8:07 am**

bogged wrote:
J Top wrote:Patrol front hooks break under high side loding, ie pulling sideways from a rut. They snap right where the hook meets the mounting plate
They are outlawed here in some clubs in NZ because of this
J Top
Good bit of info dude, I'll get our training dudes to check this out tonight at the club meeting. maybe its changed since I did mine 4 yrs ago...

I asked last night and they have heard nothing about 'not' using them, or any issues with them. They have had one straighten on a driver training weekend, but that was caused by this that this and the other.

Interesting thought though.

Posted: **Thu May 04, 2006 9:04 am**

Ok the Nissan original hooks are out, Beretta how do I find the outback ideas recovery point, searched the net and got nothing helpfull, they may be the plates I mentioned before?
Would be nice to find something that could in theory rip the chassis before breaking.

cheers fnq

Posted: **Thu May 04, 2006 9:17 am**

Make your own maybe? Some 10mm or 12mm sheet, some hi tensile bolts, drill the correct holes, shape with the grinder, a lick of paint and your done.

How come you dont want to use the hooks?

Posted: **Thu May 04, 2006 9:22 am**

You can contact them here outbackideas@three.com.au

Be aware they do not stand behind their products and I am doubtful they have public liability insurance.

I have one of their rear hooks, as you can see from the picture it has a manufacturing fault. This is a 4x4 accessory and I cannot believe the rust after 12 months. When I contacted Outback Ideas they said 'As a piece of recovery gear it is a throw away item when it shows signs of wear'. So I need to buy one every year of should they use the correct zinc coated bolts in the first place?

Posted: **Thu May 04, 2006 9:51 am**

blkmav wrote:You can contact them here outbackideas@three.com.au

Be aware they do not stand behind their products and I am doubtful they have public liability insurance.

I have one of their rear hooks, as you can see from the picture it has a manufacturing fault. This is a 4x4 accessory and I cannot believe the rust after 12 months. When I contacted Outback Ideas they said 'As a piece of recovery gear it is a throw away item when it shows signs of wear'. So I need to buy one every year of should they use the correct zinc coated bolts in the first place?

thats woeful! I wouldnt pay $ for one with that quality.. I'd steal yours though..

Posted: **Thu May 04, 2006 9:53 am**

V8 making my own is a possibility, my drill press wil struggle badly with the holes probably take a day a plate. Would rather find something up to the quality of what I would make myself and have confidence in. The reply above is the second time I have heard about the nissan hooks giving way when used IMO the chassis should fail first.

Those aftermarket two bolt hooks I believe just dont cover enough clamping area for my liking, I would need to make a big thick backing plate for behind so I would be back to square one.

blkmav thanks for the link shame the metals used were not to standard because it looks tough, not many would buy it if they knew it was going to do that!
Here is a link to one I just bought, have not used it yet but it looks like it is good quality. Price here is good too as a bonus.

http://www.4x4store.com.au/Tow-Hitch-Re ... 71097.html

cheers fnq

Posted: **Thu May 04, 2006 10:12 am**

where are you going to mount that on the front?

Posted: **Thu May 04, 2006 11:16 am**

blkmav wrote:You can contact them here outbackideas@three.com.au

Be aware they do not stand behind their products and I am doubtful they have public liability insurance.

I have one of their rear hooks, as you can see from the picture it has a manufacturing fault. This is a 4x4 accessory and I cannot believe the rust after 12 months. When I contacted Outback Ideas they said 'As a piece of recovery gear it is a throw away item when it shows signs of wear'. So I need to buy one every year of should they use the correct zinc coated bolts in the first place?

Thts not going to affect shear on the bolts. Just wire brush and put on some UV stable paint.

Bazzle

Posted: **Thu May 04, 2006 11:27 am**

Hi Tuffrangie it fit's into the tow bar but could be adapted to fit the front I guess although I wouldn't bother, there must be something sold that people use and trust on the front.

cheers fnq

Posted: **Thu May 04, 2006 2:30 pm**

bazzle wrote:Thts not going to affect shear on the bolts. Just wire brush and put on some UV stable paint.

Thanks for the tip

Sounds like a job for Reamer

Posted: **Thu May 04, 2006 7:23 pm**

Thats not outback ideas fault, they just used the bolts that came with some generic hook they bulk bought.
Just tested some more hooks this week.
Std 3/4 towball broke @ 8.15 tonnes
Snatchmaster chrome hook broke M12 8.8 1.75 pitch bolts at 7.12 tonnes
Supercheap Ridge Rider black hook with NO rating on bolts broke the hook @ 8.57 tonnes and the bolts were seriously distorted, near failure.
BlackRat black hook broke the hook @ 5.54 tonnes
BlackRat chrome hook Straightened @ 5.27 tonnes, so no metal projectile only the rope.
Pintle hook with 4 M10 x 1.75 bolts, ie rear mount on GQ, pulled threads @ 12.71 tonnes
Pintle hook with 4 M12 x 1.75 bolts stalled the test rig @ 20.14 tonnes.
All these hooks were supported well past the last bolt which means they stood a higher loading than if they were able to bend straight after the last bolt.
Isuzu Bighorn factory hooks with 10mm bolts pulled the bolts @ around 4 tonnes and when drilled to 12 mm broke the hook @ around 6.2 tonnes.
Think about these missiles when doing your hooks, sites on the net quote
500kph velocity at 8 tonnes stretch/break
J Top

Posted: **Thu May 04, 2006 7:29 pm**

Pintle hook with 4 M10 x 1.75 bolts, ie rear mount on GQ, pulled threads @ 12.71 tonnes

so does this mean the rear loop on a partol is rated for recovery???

Posted: **Thu May 04, 2006 7:41 pm**

NO IT IS A TIE-DOWN POINT
A pintle is a rated towing hitch, sometimes called a NATO hitch
J Top

Posted: **Thu May 04, 2006 7:56 pm**

J Top wrote:NO IT IS A TIE-DOWN POINT
A pintle is a rated towing hitch, sometimes called a NATO hitch
J Top

thats awesome to fead about the pintle, ive got one on the back of my GU ute, i think it will definately stay there.

Posted: **Thu May 04, 2006 8:01 pm**

J top that's some seriously great info

thanks for sharing

, Was the pintle hook fitted to a hayman reece via it's receptacle and pin?

cheers fnq

Posted: **Thu May 04, 2006 8:10 pm**

fnqcairns wrote:J top that's some seriously great info thanks for sharing , Was the pintle hook fitted to a hayman reece via it's receptacle and pin?

cheers fnq

no that would not have been attached to a hayman reece........it would have been something similar to this pic. This pic is on the back of a leaf GU ute, so the last crosmember is a round pipe instead of a c section, then there is a Macs Engineering tow bar bolted to that and each rail along with bracing back to the tray body mounts.

Posted: **Thu May 04, 2006 8:16 pm**

No just a homemade test rig, self taught welder so I was pleased with the 20 tonnes, I did test a Hayman Reece pin in a homemade test rig and it showed no damage at 9.8 tonnes, ie a Snatchmaster hook with 1/2" grade 5 bolts straightened at 9.8 on that rig
J Top

Posted: **Thu May 04, 2006 8:55 pm**

Hmm... so much for the old adage that you down use a tow ball.....

It rated way higher than most of the hooks.

Posted: **Thu May 04, 2006 9:02 pm**

That is some very intersting data I am rethinking my recovery points now

Posted: **Thu May 04, 2006 9:06 pm**

The towball is not rated higher than the hooks, it is rated 2000kgs, but the important thing here is that it BROKE. You want a hook that will straighten so you only have a rope flying towards you. Remember 24mm stretch rope is rated @ 12 tonnes which is 50% over the towball and I have seen these break
J Top

Posted: **Fri May 05, 2006 12:04 am**

J Top wrote:No just a homemade test rig, self taught welder so I was pleased with the 20 tonnes, I did test a Hayman Reece pin in a homemade test rig and it showed no damage at 9.8 tonnes, ie a Snatchmaster hook with 1/2" grade 5 bolts straightened at 9.8 on that rig
J Top

So you would say that using a strap straight into the Hayman Reece hitch and pin is the strongest of the lot? (except for the pintle which the mounting let's it down and provides a REALLY big projectile)

Can't say I'm surprised.

Posted: **Fri May 05, 2006 6:29 am**

RoldIT wrote:
J Top wrote:No just a homemade test rig, self taught welder so I was pleased with the 20 tonnes, I did test a Hayman Reece pin in a homemade test rig and it showed no damage at 9.8 tonnes, ie a Snatchmaster hook with 1/2" grade 5 bolts straightened at 9.8 on that rig
J Top
So you would say that using a strap straight into the Hayman Reece hitch and pin is the strongest of the lot? (except for the pintle which the mounting let's it down and provides a REALLY big projectile)

Can't say I'm surprised.

well with 4 x M12 bolts (ie rear of GU) it stalled the test rig rather than breaking anything...............

Posted: **Fri May 05, 2006 11:32 am**

Kris the reciever hitch loads the pin next to its support, whereas if you put a rope in the middle of the pin I suspect it will bend the pin at high loads and may make removal difficult
J Top

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