Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Hi all,

Looks likely that I have blown a hole in my head gasket today (if not more than just the gasket), after an overheating incident last week.

Because of where it happened to take place, my Maverick is at my girlfriend's dad's place in Hampton Park... soooo... I can work on it there, but I would rather take my own tools.

Anything in particular I should take? I'll be taking all my spanners, screwdrivers, and socket set, and a torque wrench for when I put the head back on (assuming it is just the gasket)... anything else?

Also, is it a real bitch to get the head off or is it not too bad? I am figuring four hours or so to pull it off for someone who has never taken the head off a TB42 before... is this too optimistic?

Any gotchas, little tricks or dangers to watch out for?

Jason

your planning on having the head tested for cracks etc, or quick gasket job?

bogged wrote:your planning on having the head tested for cracks etc, or quick gasket job?

Well, I am planning on getting the head off for a look-see first. It might be worse than just the head anyway.

Assuming it all looks reasonable to the naked eye, what do you reckon? Test the head or just put it back on with a new gasket?

And if I get it tested, shaved etc, do you know anywhere around Hampton Park, Dandy etc that's good?

Plenty of places down that way.


On top of the likely headgasket issue, the main thing you want to look at is warping. Major will be visible to the eye, but minor warping it's probably best bet is to put it on a flat surface and see if it rocks, or if something thin (say a letter or a feeler guage) can go under any part of it without touching .


Since you're running on gas anyway most of the time, you could probably shave it a bit anyway for better economy and performance anyway, and fill it up on PULP for the times you do use petrol.

If you ever got into a remote location in it, you can carry octane booster or retard ignition slightly to compensate.

Ohh yeah, dont forget to look for holes in the pistons, huge scores in the barrels, dropped valves, that sorta stuff too






Dunno about the TB42 head, but common Nissan practice suggests you may find that you will need a couple of big hex keays (10mm or 12 mm).

Dont forget the razor blades for the scraper.

Did anyone notice his new signature

headmaster in dandenong is the place to get the head looked at mate.

we use him at work and have had no problems with his work.

he is off cheltnham road.

Just did the head on my tb42 about a 2 months ago, all going well.

No special tools needed other than the torque wrench which you have.

When I pulled my head off I found that some of the water galleries that transfer water from the block to the head had completely blocked up (I don't think the previous owner knew what rust inhibiter was). I had to chip it out of the block with a small phillips screwdriver and then power flush the water galleries with the garden hose. I then put the drain plug back in the block and filled the water galleries with vinegar to get rid of all the scale in the block. I drained the vinegar three days later when I got the recoed head back and you should have seen the amount of crap that came out.

I also discovered when i took the water pump off that although the pump was fine the front timing chest cover (which is the back wall of the pump) had a hole corroded in it about the size of a five cent piece which mean't that the pump wasn't doing enough when under load. I'm suprised my engine still ran. The front timing chest cover replacement cost $55 at an engine wrecker (Nissan $300).

Other than that everything was pretty easy. the tb42 is a very easy engine to pull down.

Cheers MEX

Just did the head on my tb42 about a 2 months ago, all going well.

No special tools needed other than the torque wrench which you have.

When I pulled my head off I found that some of the water galleries that transfer water from the block to the head had completely blocked up (I don't think the previous owner knew what rust inhibiter was). I had to chip it out of the block with a small phillips screwdriver and then power flush the water galleries with the garden hose. I then put the drain plug back in the block and filled the water galleries with vinegar to get rid of all the scale in the block. I drained the vinegar three days later when I got the recoed head back and you should have seen the amount of crap that came out.

I also discovered when i took the water pump off that although the pump was fine the front timing chest cover (which is the back wall of the pump) had a hole corroded in it about the size of a five cent piece which mean't that the pump wasn't doing enough when under load. I'm suprised my engine still ran. The front timing chest cover replacement cost $55 at an engine wrecker (Nissan $300).

Other than that everything was pretty easy. the tb42 is a very easy engine to pull down.

Cheers MEX

You can say that again.



Oh wait, you just did

chimpboy wrote:

bogged wrote:your planning on having the head tested for cracks etc, or quick gasket job?

Well, I am planning on getting the head off for a look-see first. It might be worse than just the head anyway.

Assuming it all looks reasonable to the naked eye, what do you reckon? Test the head or just put it back on with a new gasket?

And if I get it tested, shaved etc, do you know anywhere around Hampton Park, Dandy etc that's good?

Do it right, Do it once.. get it tested properly, and pressure tested. even redo the valves and seals etc. Then at least you know its good for another few 100k klms.. You have it apart already...

ask Damige about heads, and bad luck... hes replaced his more than he replaced tires...

Thanks guys. I'll get the head off tomorrow or Friday, I hope, and then take it from there. I'll probably get the whole head looked at by a pro and get the valves etc done as well, as suggested. Might as well do it right since I plan to keep the car for a while yet.

I send all my work and send everyone to Quickdrive Engineering, also off Cheltenham Road. Everything is always done properly and at a good price. Just take some beers with you!

if you are doing the quick n cheap. get a known straight edge ie:steel ruler and shine a torch in from behind it in a dark room.

Some new head bolts I think are recomended as well.

make sure you take a decent sized breaker bar too just in case... also crack ALL the bolts before undoing them totally

Simon

shakes wrote:if you are doing the quick n cheap. get a known straight edge ie:steel ruler and shine a torch in from behind it in a dark room.

Some new head bolts I think are recomended as well.

make sure you take a decent sized breaker bar too just in case... also crack ALL the bolts before undoing them totally

Good one, thanks. I will remember to take my big breaker bar now you mention it.

Anyone got a guess on how much this is going to cost me if I do get the head shaved and the valves done?

Not too much to it, i did mine a couple of weeks ago. TB42e with gas and extractors. Carby 4.2 and std exhaust shouldn't give too much grief.

Another thing worth doing is to replace all heater hoses, as many are a biatch to access with engine complete (but remember too, mine's efi godluvit)

I'm not sure if carby head has it or not, but at rear bottom inlet side of head theirs a 5/8 metal, 2-pronged pipe bolted to head. Replace this, as mine blew a hole and it is impossible to remove without removing head or maybe gearbox which is worse! I had mine 'welded' with putty weld for 12mths 'cos i couldn't fit the pipe (about $65 from Nissan)

For heater hoses i just cut lengths of 16mm hose and used unicoils where i needed to create crazy factory bends. There is one 19mm short hose with a 90 bend, i used cheapest 19mm hose with 90 bend i could find at supacheap and cut it to length.

Get head pressure tested and surfaced definately if you intend keeping it. Don't bother shaving it, you'll gain SFA in compression. I replaced valve springs with H/D, seals and re-seated valves. This didn't need to be done but will benefit future turbo or supercharger. PS I didn't bother to replace head studs and even Nissan said not to bother, they don't either.

Mine cost $625 inc GST with good quality graphite gasket kit and was 'hamburger-with-the-lot' job.

Go see Bruce from The Head Stud, Wickam Rd Moorabbin 9555 1147 -- Good work, and good service from small one-man workshop who only does cylinder heads. -- PS he was recommended to me by Yella Terra so he must be good.

GQ Bear wrote:Mine cost $625 inc GST with good quality graphite gasket kit and was 'hamburger-with-the-lot' job.

Go see Bruce from The Head Stud, Wickam Rd Moorabbin 9555 1147

Great info, thanks - so do I read rightly that you got the gasket kit from the same place as you got the head done?

yeah get the head checked out fully and also get the grafite gasket as they are the better one to use, as i used a monotork the first time and it let go 6months later and got another set from acl on waranty and swaped it for grafite that one lasted for a while also check your block as the head gasket metal ring at no 6 pot can corrode and eat into the block, not good
and as bogged said ive had a gut full i just droped another motor in 2 weeks ago and going well.

Dont forget the two little bolts at the front of the head. From memory 8 or 10 mm. These are easily missed.

I was just thinking... it's funny how many people are well-informed about pulling the head off a TB42, isn't it? I guess I'm joining a fair-sized club.

chimpboy wrote:I was just thinking... it's funny how many people are well-informed about pulling the head off a TB42, isn't it? I guess I'm joining a fair-sized club.

i think its called the 125000 Mile high club (200000kms)

Well it is the only thing that seems to break on these things.

stevepet wrote:Well it is the only thing that seems to break on these things.

That's right, gotta have a weak link somewhere. 200k for a head is a lot better than a cv every coupla hard bush runs (80series) or a rear axle every trip (rangie)

Thanks again for all this info. I have called both Quickdrive and Headmaster, since they are pretty close to where the car is, and I have set aside all day tomorrow to pull the head off and drop it off at one of those places.

So, sorry to ask yet another question, but any recommendations for where to get the head gasket set from? Headmaster don't supply them and I forgot to ask Quickdrive. Just Repco? Or Nissan? Or what?

I was also wondering if anyone supplies a complete hose kit for them to save me mixing and matching.

Jason

chimpboy wrote:Thanks again for all this info. I have called both Quickdrive and Headmaster, since they are pretty close to where the car is, and I have set aside all day tomorrow to pull the head off and drop it off at one of those places.

So, sorry to ask yet another question, but any recommendations for where to get the head gasket set from? Headmaster don't supply them and I forgot to ask Quickdrive. Just Repco? Or Nissan? Or what?

I was also wondering if anyone supplies a complete hose kit for them to save me mixing and matching.

Jason

One other thing jason, make sure you have somebody to help you. Heads are pretty heavy, and backbreaking considering the size of a patrol engine bay. Also, i removed radiator as it and condensor needed blasting anyway. This provides heaps of room so you can sit on front of body with legs in engine bay. Much more comfortable working position once head is in place to torque bolts and rocker adjustment, etc.

The head Stud supplied my gasket kit at wholesale cost. I reckon repco or bursons would have 'em, ask for the graphite jobbies (can't remember brand and have thrown away packaging)

Nissan is prob. best place for hoses, would cost a fortune though. Do as i suggested in another post and cut hoses and use unicoils where necessary. It's not that time consuming, esp. considering you're waiting for head to be overhauled anyway.

Tip; make up new hose one by one, but leave old one on vehicle. This will help to work out where each one goes by shape and wear marks, etc. replace as you go to ensure you don't connect them back up wrong.

like someone else said, clean out ports on block, as mine were a bit clogged up too, don't worry about front 2 as gasket covers them anyway.

Good luck and have fun

GQ Bear wrote:The head Stud supplied my gasket kit at wholesale cost. I reckon repco or bursons would have 'em, ask for the graphite jobbies (can't remember brand and have thrown away packaging)

Just for anyone reading this thread later, prices on a VRS kit as follows:

Nissan: $372
Repco: $192, type of head gasket unknown
Autobarn: $100, monotorque or similar gasket
Pistons Auto Spares (Bayswater): $140, graphite gasket
Burson's: $190, graphite gasket

Pistons is a good price, but I'll probably just see if the head guy can get a kit from Burson's at a trade price since it's a lot closer to where I'll be working. I'd rather pay a touch more than drive to Bayswater.

chimpboy wrote:type of head gasket unknown.

There are 3 different thickness gaskets too...

bogged wrote:

chimpboy wrote:type of head gasket unknown.

There are 3 different thickness gaskets too...

Since all indicators would appear that I'm going to have to go this same route as soon as the tax return arrives, what thickness would I be wanting for a Diesel Ti GQ (after market turbo if it makes any difference).

Zook

bogged wrote:

chimpboy wrote:type of head gasket unknown.

There are 3 different thickness gaskets too...

On the diesel one Bruce yes. For the petrol TB42, no.

Well, I got time to go visit my car at my gf's parents' place, where I dumped it after it broke down, put some water in and it became very obvious what had happened - massive failure of a hose hidden under the inlet manifold.

The hole blown in the hose was so big that I know I must have stopped right after it blew, which means it got hot but not for long.

Sooooo.... cut a long story short, I pulled off the inlet manifold and replaced all the hoses that had clearly not been replaced for a long, long time.

I've driven a good few hours since, still looks okay - no lost water, oil looks clean.

So, I dunno! It definitely dripped some oil when it overheated but there's been no further sign of that. I'm going to wait and see, maybe the head will still have to come off but for now I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

Keep an eye on it, Jas. And you might aswell replace as many other hoses as you can, especially the hard to get at one's. Once one goes they all start going untill they do cook your head.

Turn a/c on and see if it gets hot under load, imagine in a few mths time stuck in traffic on a 40 degree day.

Check for water in oil (very thin oil), oil in water (obvious foaming), exhaust gases in water (litmus paper test). Also bubbles forming with radiator cap removed usually indicates gasket, and excessive steam from exhaust.

You might be lucky!!