Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Had a bit of an incident on the M1 on the weekend.



Decided that it's best to replace all the tyres.

Would love some feedback on some recommendations.

I am an odd weekender 4x4er with majority driving done on sealed roads. I don't really want to get straight HT tyres as I still want some decent 4x4 ability.

I'm currently looking at the Desert Duelers 604 (has anyone got any feedback about the new 693's?) or the BF Goodridge A/T.

Has anyone had any issues with these or should can you suggest other ones to look at?

I drive a '93 SC Hilux and run 31x10.5

If anyone knows estimated costs that would also be great.

Thansk

Mate, before you waste money on new tyres, be sure you know WHY that happened - Simex don't normally do that!

If that was caused by something YOU did, new tyres won't save you.

Looks like you need to run more pressure in your tyres dude as running any tyre at low pressure on the hwy will do that!

I'll be the first to say it......




MT/R's (beat you Brucey)

If anyone knows any theories as to why it would have happened I'd like to know.

The situation was I was driving from Bris > Gold Coast. About 10km about of Bris I could feel the ute pulling to the left a bit. Thought it was odd and was going to stop at a servo on the way to check the pressure.

About another 10-15km's down the road started to get some shaking in the steering, then it stopped, the about another 5km's it started to shake more. Though I should pull over to check it out. I was going past an exit and tossing up between making it to a servo or pulling over. Took the exit and as I started to slow it blew. I figure me slowing and teh pressure starting to go back on the tyres is what caused the it to blow.

The tyre pressure was 40psi.

i should also note my priorities when looking at tyres.

1. fuel efficency
2. noise

it sounds like it had got a puncture, probably when you first noticed it pulling a bit and it just took that long to wear right out.

muppet_man67 wrote:it sounds like it had got a puncture, probably when you first noticed it pulling a bit and it just took that long to wear right out.

That would be my guess - which can happen to any tyre.

If fuel effiiciency is your priority, you want a less aggressive passenger construction tyre.

But passenger construction tyres suck for puncture resistance, so sacrifice a little fuel for a tougher tyre.

Bridgestone Duellers have a good reputation, but I think they're better suited to desert country (dry, stony) than SEQ conditions.

BFG have had a good reputation for a long time, but I believe the market has overtaken them.

Cooper AT/Rs have a reasonable offroad reputation, but I've heard a few disturbing reports about on-road performance.

Pirelli Scorpion A/Ts did well in the last 4wd Monthly comparo, and are worth looking at.

If you're willing to sacrifice a little more fuel and noise, then the MT/R, STT, MTZ type tyres are worth looking at.

In 31" I think the market tops out under $250 a tyre. Many good tyres are available under $200 each, with careful shopping I reckon you could get some decent tyres for not much more than $150/tyre. But I'm probably wrong.

HotFourOk wrote:I'll be the first to say it......




MT/R's (beat you Brucey)

I concur!

MTR

31" wranglers are cheap as chips at the moment, too (at my work anyways, heh)

chops wrote:

HotFourOk wrote:I'll be the first to say it......




MT/R's (beat you Brucey)

I concur!

MTR

31" wranglers are cheap as chips at the moment, too (at my work anyways, heh)

are the MTR's going to go against wanting fuel efficency and noisey tyres?

tumoit wrote:

chops wrote:

HotFourOk wrote:I'll be the first to say it......




MT/R's (beat you Brucey)

I concur!

MTR

31" wranglers are cheap as chips at the moment, too (at my work anyways, heh)

are the MTR's going to go against wanting fuel efficency and noisey tyres?

You will find tyres which are quieter and more fuel-efficient.

tumoit wrote:

chops wrote:

HotFourOk wrote:I'll be the first to say it......




MT/R's (beat you Brucey)

I concur!

MTR

31" wranglers are cheap as chips at the moment, too (at my work anyways, heh)

are the MTR's going to go against wanting fuel efficency and noisey tyres?

They are a bit noisy... but they are the best

I didn't buy a Diesel 4x4 to be a quiet ride though

HotFourOk wrote:

tumoit wrote:

chops wrote:

HotFourOk wrote:I'll be the first to say it......




MT/R's (beat you Brucey)

I concur!

MTR

31" wranglers are cheap as chips at the moment, too (at my work anyways, heh)

are the MTR's going to go against wanting fuel efficency and noisey tyres?

They are a bit noisy... but they are the best

I didn't buy a Diesel 4x4 to be a quiet ride though

The engine already creates enough "diesel" noise. Need better speakers :/ No way I could run a spearker phone setup for the mobile.

I do like the asthetics of the MTV's, although this wouldn't be a motivation for buying them.

I just want a set of good tyres, I don't mind paying a bit more for quality and somethign that will last. I don't really want to spend more money on fuel because of tyres (I understand taht I will most probably have a slight decrease, but I don't want a dramatic difference) and don't want to all of a sudden double the bd in the cab because of tyres.

I would like to try and get this all sorted by the weekend.

if you want less agressive in a good tyre go the wrangler atr's
the new silent armour's are as they say silent armour

low road noise good handeling but still strong enuf

Just got my Cooper STT2's a week ago and must say they are very quiet for a tire as agressive as MTR. They are about as noisy as my BFG A/T's were and defintely a helluva lot quieter than my mates MTR's. Over here they are a lot cheaper as well.

Freakazoid wrote:Just got my Cooper STT2's a week ago and must say they are very quiet for a tire as agressive as MTR. They are about as noisy as my BFG A/T's were and defintely a helluva lot quieter than my mates MTR's. Over here they are a lot cheaper as well.

http://www.exploroz.com/Forum/View.asp?ForumQID=38890

My final analysis on Cooper STT's is that they certainly don't cut the mustard as far as my 4x4-ing is concerned and having had 10 Coopers over three years it has cost $2375 and I have managed only 50,000km.

My first set of Cooper STT's(old style) sustained 10 punctures in the 30,000km I had them for and then the beads started cracking. Cooper offered me 5 new style STT's at cost and I accepted. These have now done 20,000km and have sustained 12 punctures. The punctures have come from stakes in the deserts and sidewall damage when in rocky terrain. I now have 1 stuffed Cooper, 3 almost totally stuffed ones and one without holes.

tumoit wrote:I do like the asthetics of the MTR's, although this wouldn't be a motivation for buying them.

Was for me They look HAWT!!

Mine are only noisy when turning corners going a bit fast, other than that they are good.

MTR's are the way to go.

Ricky

rixrunner wrote:MTR's are the way to go.

Ricky

What type of MTR's and why would I get these over AT's?

Also, I was informed today by someone that running 31" wheels on my Hilux was illegal, yet when I purchased it it passed safety with no problems. Can anyone shed light on this?

tumoit wrote:

rixrunner wrote:MTR's are the way to go.

Ricky

What type of MTR's and why would I get these over AT's?

Also, I was informed today by someone that running 31" wheels on my Hilux was illegal, yet when I purchased it it passed safety with no problems. Can anyone shed light on this?

There is onlt one type of MTR Goodyear Wrangler MT/R

You would get them as the offroad performance craps all over ATs, and the onroad performance is fantastic, especially in the wet they are great.

Its down to you... when you go offroad do you want a below average tyre, or a tyre that can hold its own in the rough stuff.
Its up to you, and you priorities.

You are allowed something like a 25mm increase in overall diameter from the stock tyre size... most upgraded tyres on 4x4 are 'illegal' but I've never heard of someone being booked for having 31" tyres on.

This is my perception on tyres and please correct me if I'm wrong.

1. HT - most economical/best on sealed roads/less noise/worste for offroad

2. AT - middle of the field with noise, economy and on/off road abilities

3. MT - designed for off road - most noise, not the best with economy

(this isn't the concrete facts, but a rule of thumb)

The tyre dealer said I would have to look at 30" which is the stock to be back to legal, but I don't want to folk out for new wheels.

And these are my priorities:

1. economy
2. noise
3. off road ability (only basic-int off road, haven't really done anything hardcore yet)

tumoit wrote:This is my perception on tyres and please correct me if I'm wrong.

1. HT - most economical/best on sealed roads/less noise/worste for offroad

2. AT - middle of the field with noise, economy and on/off road abilities

3. MT - designed for off road - most noise, not the best with economy

(this isn't the concrete facts, but a rule of thumb)

The tyre dealer said I would have to look at 30" which is the stock to be back to legal, but I don't want to folk out for new wheels.

And these are my priorities:

1. economy
2. noise
3. off road ability (only basic-int off road, haven't really done anything hardcore yet)

Just go 31's, no one will care especially on a lux (30's might even look too small ) Your 123 rule of thumb list sums it up, but to throw everyone off Goodyear created the MTR (Max Traction Radial), its a inbetween MT/AT, but better than some MT's (allegedly ).

If you are going to go A/T you may as well get MTR as they dont seem to be any noisier (My Bridgestone A/T's are noisy, and suck in all conditions except sand) and fuel economy change will be minimal at worst BUT you will have hugelyu increased your offroad abilities.

I noticed NO fuel economy difference going from M/T's to A/T's so I think there's a bit of hype around it but YMMV and it's probly a bit different for every truck. Once you get 'real' 4x4 tyres you'll never go back [/i]

I have goodyear MTRs... they are noisier than I hoped/expected.

They are also a bit crapper on road than I expected and really surprised me in a bad way on wet asphalt.

I am not bagging them really, just saying that despite their reputation they should not be mistaken for an AT. They are still an aggressive mud tyre and probably compromise their on-road manners more than their off-road manners.

I hear the cooper all-terrains are good for on and off-road, of course as an AT favouring on-road. I have a set of 31s but haven't used them off-road at all (as I swapped the 33" MTRs onto the vehicle as soon as I bought it.)

They are virtually brand new and I'd be happy to sell them at a reasonable price but you're too far away

Jason

Of these tyres which do yuo think is best suited?

Goodyear Wrangler Silent Armor
http://www.goodyear.com.au/showtyregy20 ... 0001392519

Goodyear Wrangler MTR
http://www.goodyear.com.au/showtyregy20 ... 0001378479

Bridgestone Desert Dueler 604 (would most probably go the new 693's)
http://www.bridgestone.com.au/tyres/pro ... s/604v.asp

BF Goodrich A/T
http://www.bfgoodrich.com.au/index.php? ... rain+TA+KO

I will look at other suggestions, I just need to start to narrow down my list.

I do really appreciate all your help guys

Your tyre looks exactly like what happened to my BFG Trac Edge. Was driving back from a trip at night, and must have gotten a slow puncture, as steering started to get heavier, and just when I was about to pullover I had a blowout.

Do not get the 604s - I had them, and when half worn they do not channel water away and are absolute crap on wet bitumen.

I disagree with Chimpboy. I switched from Falken ATs to Goodyear MTRs, and was amazed at how much better they were in all conditions - especially wet roads!! I found that they have very flexible sidewalls though, and if I had less than 40psi in them they felt wallowy on road - especially when cornering. I keep them at about 45psi and they are wearing evenly. BUT - sounds like they would be a bit too agressive for you, and they only last around 40-50k km apparently.

I'm gonna refine my list a bit after reading some more.

Goodyear Wrangler Silent Armor
http://www.goodyear.com.au/showtyregy20 ... 0001392519



Bridgestone Dueler 693
http://www.bridgestone.com.au/tyres/pro ... s/d693.asp



Heard far to many negative comments on the BF AT (strange thing is this is one of the most common tyres I've seen on 4x4's latley) and I've heard a couple of really strong comments for and against the Desert Duelers, in the end I'd rather an good all round tyre when it comes to 4x4 as apposed to one designed for sand.

At this stage I am edging towards teh Wrangler Silent Armor as I'm keen for a quiet tyre and Goodyear describe the MTR as "Dedicated to Off-Road Driving", where I'm only the odd weekend off roader.


I am keen to here of any others to add to my list

tumoit wrote:I'm gonna refine my list a bit after reading some more.

Goodyear Wrangler Silent Armor
http://www.goodyear.com.au/showtyregy20 ... 0001392519



Goodyear Wrangler MTR
http://www.goodyear.com.au/showtyregy20 ... 0001378479



Bridgestone Dueler 693
http://www.bridgestone.com.au/tyres/pro ... s/d693.asp



Heard far to many negative comments on the BF AT (strange thing is this is one of the most common tyres I've seen on 4x4's latley) and I've heard a couple of really strong comments for and against the Desert Duelers, in the end I'd rather an good all round tyre when it comes to 4x4 as apposed to one designed for sand.

At this stage I am edging towards teh Wrangler Silent Armor as I'm keen for a quiet tyre and Goodyear describe the MTR as "Dedicated to Off-Road Driving", where I'm only the odd weekend off roader.


I am keen to here of any others to add to my list
- now thats dedicated offroad driving, despite what goodyear want to claim about their MTR's

ISUZUROVER wrote:I disagree with Chimpboy. I switched from Falken ATs to Goodyear MTRs, and was amazed at how much better they were in all conditions - especially wet roads!! I found that they have very flexible sidewalls though, and if I had less than 40psi in them they felt wallowy on road - especially when cornering. I keep them at about 45psi and they are wearing evenly. BUT - sounds like they would be a bit too agressive for you, and they only last around 40-50k km apparently.

Fair enough; the situation where the MTRs surprised me was fresh rain after a dry spell, downhill stopping at an intersection, so presumably a pretty slick road.

I just had a little bit of a slide and stopped slightly further forward than I intended, but it never got out of hand.

I guess it's possible that an AT would have done no better, but my gut feeling was that the tyres performed a bit suboptimally. They didn't suck, they were just a bit less grippy than I expected.

ISUZUROVER wrote: I disagree with Chimpboy. I switched from Falken ATs to Goodyear MTRs, and was amazed at how much better they were in all conditions - especially wet roads!! I found that they have very flexible sidewalls though, and if I had less than 40psi in them they felt wallowy on road - especially when cornering. I keep them at about 45psi and they are wearing evenly. BUT - sounds like they would be a bit too agressive for you, and they only last around 40-50k km apparently.

I also have to say my MTRs are awesome on wet roads.. better than say a BFG AT by a looong shot.
I run 40psi in mine or they do get a bit spongey too.

Flexy sidewalls are good for offroad though

They are not quiet, but you can tell that from the voids in the tread.

tumoit wrote:
Also, I was informed today by someone that running 31" wheels on my Hilux was illegal, yet when I purchased it it passed safety with no problems. Can anyone shed light on this?

The legal (and insurance) issues with tyres are with your speed & laod ratings as well as size.

The car manufactures will specify the ratings and it will be indicated by codes. Just check your ratings (inside driver door plaque) to the tyre ratings (tyre web site - 31 MT/R's are 109Q) and see if you are legal. From memory MT/R 31's were legal on my 4runner. I went with 32's which meet the load rating but not the speed rating (miss out by 10k's). I went with them because they are still rated at 160km per hour.


Here is a chart to translate the codes:-

TYRE RATINGS
RATING / SPEED

J 100 KPH Q 160 KPH
K 110 KPH R 170 KPH
L 120 KPH S 180 KPH
M 130 KPH T 190 KPH
N 140 KPH U 200 KPH
P 150 KPH H 210 KPH
INDEX / LOAD

96 710 KGS 106 950 KGS
97 730 KGS 107 975 KGS
98 750 KGS 108 1000 KGS
99 775 KGS 109 1030 KGS
100 800 KGS 110 1060 KGS
101 825 KGS 111 1090 KGS

I hope this helps


Ricky