Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Just come back from a trip out west and saw some pretty nasty tracks (was on the verge of rolling a couple of times ).

Couple of mods I decided I need are a rear diff lock and possibly some gearing in the future (transfer) ++ tyres.

Was reading up on the welded diff (ie searched ).

Questions are:

1 - Lockrites etc lock the diff on corners (ie causing tyre wear) like a welded diff (full time lock) does?

2 - Can anyone fill me in on how to weld the diff centre (I think ) as the link in the bible is missing pictures and isn't really clear.

Cheers,

Ado

best bet is to take your diff to a diff and gear box place and they should be able to weld it up for under 50 bucks

the lockright lockers i understand are sorta like an overly tight lsd

Auto lockers stay locked when going straight and unlock when cornering...

i used to have lockrights, they are rather querky to drive, especialy if your backlash is out. i really enjoy giving my car a hard time and as a result i kept on busting the shear pins in the lockright- and got sick of replacing them. i welded my diffs up and have had no dramas since. there are goods and bad. goods are your locked and will love it, bads are you'll develop poppie arms (you get used to it) and you out drive all your mates . if you dont want to afect you road driving weld the front only, if you want to pump crazy donuts in the rain weld them both.
most people who carry on about welded diffs being dangerous and crapy to drive have never had them. i bearly notice they are there til i get off road- respect the car and the car will respect you, like anything in life. you also have to remember that having lockers will at some stage drive you onto your side if you dont pay attention to your suroundings. good luck and have fun.

this should help you
http://www.island4x4.com/4x4tech/axle/weldeddiff1/
got pics and tech writeup

Hi GQ,

Yeah I saw that link in the bible but the pictures are missing, and for the life of me I can't make out what they are talking about. It seems the most important pics are the ones that are gone

I have read guys talking about "welded centres" in the bible, but im not sure if it's the centres that are being welded or other?

I own a MIG and stick welder and am pretty competent in welding so I could probably get it done myself. I also, like most other people on here, love being able to say "I did this mod"

If anyone has a pic of the welded bits or could direct me to the parts/sections that need to be welded that would be great. I can look the diff components over in my FSM and make out what needs to be done with a little direction.

Cheers,

Ado

well if your good at welding
just weld the side gears like this

then install the spider gears like this

then install the second side gear like this that is welded like the first one

the only thing is setting backlash and all the right settings for the ring and pinion. Maybe its not that important in a zook. This method gives a little more movement then welding the sidegears to the spider gears but it is still locked.

does this make much noise when turning on the street? or in a zook is it barely noticeable?. how badly does this affect tyre wear?

its driving with a locked diff. Tyre wear suffers and the steering feels heavier. As far as i know, they dont make noises as autolockers.

i mean tyre sliding noise. does every corner sound like your spinning a wheel or is it quiet enough to go unnoticed?

depends on the tyre mate some squeel some dont

i have a welded rear and the tyre wear is pritty bad in 3 months since i have done it i lost around 3-4 mm of rubber!!!

as for corners its noticab;e in say servos as slow turning and get pritty wiered looks from people as they think your ripping a skid.....


insane off road and really can tell that you have both wheels locked.....

I've had welded rear fer over 6 years, and I love it.
Welded front was in for over 2 years.
I now have a lock right front, and altho this is better than my welded front, I would happily go back to welded if it breaks.
The more aggressive the off road tyre, the less squealing you get.
Road tyres squeal like a pig, but this improves if you run higher pressures.
My mongrels only notice the diff weld when aired right down and on tarmac.
My rear tires have worn faster, naturally, but not a worrying amount, and mines a daily driver, also.
You do need to adjust your driving style, so be gentle while you get used to it.

christover

I can't weld, a mate did it for me.
So won't comment on best ways, etc.
This is how mine are done, and no failures so far.
christover

i just welded mine, and im fine with driving it onroad, i find it harder to get sideways around corners as you have to give it alot more.

i did it like both pictures, welded every second 2 on the side gears
and then tried to fill up the whole carrier with weld. and it drives a treat. setting backlash was easy once you knew how it all works. took me 2 hours to install.


be carefull as its easy to do this

christover1 wrote:

welding to the side cover is the strongest byfar. That will neverbreak. though the pics i posted apparently give a little, making it just a little easier to turn, thats what the article said nyway

i was thinking about that, and wouldnt it only move a little and then lock up anyway? making it just at hard to turn after about half a wheel turn

1 of my early welded diffs had a little slop, me also thinking it could be good. The slack slowly got worse, then broke 1 weld.
It took over 3 years to break, but the cause was the slop, it was banging around and slowly shook the side plate bolts loose, and kaboom.
This is probably a good reason to use thread lock on all diff bolts

No idea if that was the reason, just a theory.

All theory in the world won't beat going for a drive and finding out if you like it.
Zook diffs are dime a dozen (unless using vit r&p) if you hate it, chuck a stocker back in.

christover

thats why chris, i only put mine in when i wrecked my old zook, thus if i didnt like it or it was totally undrivable i can put the unwelded back in, but i like it, and if i had power steering i would weld the front too.

Spike_Sierra wrote:thats why chris, i only put mine in when i wrecked my old zook, thus if i didnt like it or it was totally undrivable i can put the unwelded back in, but i like it, and if i had power steering i would weld the front too.

Power steer with welded front was very driveable, could get away with short runs on hard surfaces, but power steer with lockrite is nicer, though is a little unpredictable in the surging throttle type driving.

I only fitted a welded diff so I could go on 1st Adventure Tour, intending to take it out after...it was still there for years after

christover

all this talk about welded diffs is making me want to weld up an already shattered rear diff!

dammit

Mine's definately on the way to a weld. I got the living S***E scared out of me coming up a steep ridge with my gear in the back on 3 wheels, looking down the face and thinking "F**K I hope we don't end up down there!!!"

Driving the line just doesn't cut it sometimes I reckon. Hopefully I can get hold of a reasonably priced zook rear (or make a swap deal) to give myself some time to work on it .

Ado

when I did mine in my lj80 I welded all the gears together fill the 6 or so little holes with fiberglass then before putting side plate back on centre i fill the whole thing with an industrial apoxy resin I got three years of beating the crap out of it till all the bolts came loose in the crown wheel tearing a hand size hole in the housing i then used the same centre in the new housing 1 year later I sold the car and it went with it I got the idea from being told to fill it with lead Didnt know how at time so I compromised
the only problem was reversing was a real bitch it did not want to turn while reversing just draged it straight but flick it around no worries at all

You also have to be careful not to twist the spline on your axels, my brother done it on his from driveing round the streets when his air locker died and was stuck in, it didnt strip the splines of just twisted them round a
little so i say it wasnt far of striping them.... has anyone else came across this problem..

i think the zooks are to light for this. hav;nt had that problem. cheers ron

I have had a EZ-Lovker for a while in the rear, and yes it will cause spline rotation after a while. Problems can come about from the technique of welding the side gear teeth over. If the spider and side gears are not locked together in full weld, they can try to rotate over the weld and tear the hemisphere apart.


Layto....

lay80n wrote:I have had a EZ-Lovker for a while in the rear, and yes it will cause spline rotation after a while. Problems can come about from the technique of welding the side gear teeth over. If the spider and side gears are not locked together in full weld, they can try to rotate over the weld and tear the hemisphere apart.


Layto....

a few of us here in canberra have had the twisted spline issue eventually they will break (snap) at the end of the splines

as layto said if ya dont weld the spider and side gears together and just weld the one or theother they will eventually fatigue and when the spider gears try to ramp up the weld it will blow your centre making it useless to salvage , i posted pics of mine that i bought with it welded like that (unbeknownst to me ) after it blew out but that was like 3 yr ago , now i weld it altogether and fill it all up with bolts etc before welding all gaps shut , and never have dramas since .

thats why I filled it with an apoxy sesin so there was no movement, movement leads to breakage

i welded my front diff tonight and checked it out im amazed on how much better it is than a rear welded the steering isnt even that heavy,i did mine the way with a bit of movement though.

joshnz1 wrote:i welded my front diff tonight and checked it out im amazed on how much better it is than a rear welded the steering isnt even that heavy,i did mine the way with a bit of movement though.

yep the rear helps in 80% of stuff, but front locker is brilliant for the extra hard core tracks, for sure.

We have often had cars with only front weld/locker on Adventure tour, and other hard trips, and they keep up no probs

christover