EFI GU4.5 into 4.2 EFI GQ

[sad001]

Righto, who'se dunnit?. I know there isn't a huge gain and I'm not after one, just looking at replacing my high k 4.2 with something a bit newer and picking up a few ponies at the same time. What would be involved? If I did this and then unichipped it (dual map for Gas) then I should be close to 160kw for not much coin...
any help would be great
Cheers
Scott

[sad001]

C'mon guys, someone must know?

[MyGQ]

Yes it can be done, and its not that hard actually

The engine mounts for the TB42 and TB45 are identical as the block is the same as the TB42, just a few mods get done to it to make it a 4.5L

You will need the engine, wiring loom and the ECU

[cutzook]

hey man, pm hutchos gq off here
his patrol has the conversion

[PGS 4WD]

Ive just done one using a delco 808 vn-vp ecu. Made the distributor out of a GQ one with an EA hall effect only to find the drive gear and shaft were different, have to put GU gear on and shorten the shaft as the GU timing cover dosent have the locator in it. Eveything else fits a gem. Fitted the 65mm Holden V8 throttle body to.
Joel

[j-top paj]

any pics/details bout the 65mm throttle body?
i wouldnt mind getting more power out of my trol while its still N/A
then comes the turbo/s

[bogged]

then comes the turbo/s

if your thinking of sequencial turbos, speak with andy at diesel tech - he has that setup on an 80 and now his GQ (one turbo feeding another)

[j-top paj]

thats what i was thinking, but its still a while away atm, gotta save up for xfer, clutch, trips away and more shyte

[PGS 4WD]

The throttle body had to be as I used the Holden ECU I needed the holden fast idle motor, it won't bolt straight on and work unfortunatly with the Nissan wiring etc

Joel

[CRUSHU]

why did you use the camira computer over the nissan one?

[PGS 4WD]

The Delco 808 I have real time programming soft ware for, the Nissan is less user freindly although there is someone working on it I don't know that the market is big enough to justify, I've got thousands of dollars of tuning software for various vehicles but youve got to get a return. Unfortunatly the GU uses a different ECU, there's no so many people with efi GQ's wanting tuning.
Tuned it today was 80 kw on petrol after a full tune when carby is 110 now, drives very well, same motor (on my dyno) in a GU is good for about 100 kw. This was tuned for regular unleaded, I could probably squeeze another 5 kw if on premium with a bit more timing.
Joel

[CRUSHU]

Fair enough
My brother tunes the Delco as well, very good system, he likes it a lot, and makes good power with it.

so the 4.5 is good for around 100 - 110rwkw?
That is about 10 - 20rwkw +-5 more than my 4.2efi I currently have, thru an auto.

Is your Dyno a Dyno Dynamics?

If that is the case, I won't bother trying to convert one into mine.

[PGS 4WD]

No I use a DTS dyno, harder to fudge the figures and does an accurate drive train loss calculation.
I have used both, and both work well, I dont like the way a dynamics dyno makes more power on a ramp that statically, this is an impossibility due to a ramp having to constantly accelerate the inertia of the rollers. So the math used to caculate the power figures is questionable (I know this will ruffle the feathers of some Dyno Dynamics operators) A static power figure should always be higher at the same load/rpm.
Joel

[CRUSHU]

I have seen my brothers car on one of those dyno's, and it suggested that there was an 11hp loss thru the driveline, on a commodore with a 6 speed!!
Would be nice if it were true!!

So there isn't much to gain by fitting a TB45 to a GQ then.

[CRUSHU]

Also, could you fit a TB45 long motor (rocker cover to sump) in place of a TB42? ie: using the TB42e EFI and exhaust? Would the Nissan ECU be able to cope with the slight increase in capacity? Would the next size up injectors help it cope?

[j-top paj]

why wouldnt u use the 45 ecu aswell?

[PGS 4WD]

I saw a Valiant twin turbo 360 go from an engine dyno where it made 840 engine HP to a DTS chassis dyno where it calculated drive train loss through an auto at 848 HP at the engine which is good enough for me, I'll try a commodore 6 spd next time I get one in though, or my BF XR6T 6 spd auto for interest. Perhaps it wasn't callibrated right??
Most people accept 30% drive train loss where really it varies a lot depending on auto/man, diff size, type compound and make up. I saw an LS2 strocker with AFR heads and solid roller make 592 engine HP on an engine dyno, it make 335 rwkw which is 448 HP at the wheels which is about 25%, thats a Glide and 9" with 3600 stall. I have no doubt our 4b4s have more losses due to transfere cases and large sidewall tyres. Ihave seen differences of 2-5% going from simexes to all terrains on the same vehicle. But its all subjective. Best advice is stick to one dyno for you comparisons.

Joel

[CRUSHU]

why wouldnt u use the 45 ecu aswell?

My GQ is EFI already, why swap out the engine, manifolds, loom, ecu, and make ALL the GU stuff fit, when it is there already. If it were a carby GQ, I wouldn't hessitate.


Sticking to one dyno is great advice, forget the actual numbers, but if you stay on one dyno, if the numbers go up, you are going in the right direction.

[PGS 4WD]

GU intake manifold and distributor are different, the GU has bigger intake ports and the intake manifolds are not interchangeable, also the 4.2 has a different drive gear on the distributor with a longer shaft than the GU.
Joel

[tj81]

So itake it you cant drop in a 4.5 GU motor and use the carby manifold from a 4.2 ? So to do that would be a custom manifold?

[PGS 4WD]

Thats right, use the GU manifold and do efi or gas. They have much bigger runners that are low slung I dont think a carby would adapt very well due to low air speed and fuel puddling issues, poor driveability at low RMP, like a 4v clevo.
Joel

[awill4x4]

Joel, I've got a 4.5 short engine that has been in burnt out vehicle so it needs to be rebuilt. My question is. Will the efi head and injection from the the TB42e I currently have fit on the TB45 block? and if so. Will the extra capacity get close to maxing out the TB42 injectors?
Regards Andrew.

[PGS 4WD]

I havent tried to put a TB42 head and top end onto a TB45, the difference in capacity is minimal and should be an issue, most factory ecu's run rich under load and have closed loop for light throttle, the TB45 camshaft is different and may present some differences in the tune, you could fit an in line chip. ive used the Haltech iterceptor, unichip and chip torque exceed with good success in such application where the tune changes are minimal, you can fine tune fuel and timing OK to optimize it. The other consideration may need to be compression ratio, I'd cc the combustion chambers to make sure you didn't end up with 8.0:1 or 11.0:1 if Nissan made some design changes to piston and head like ford did over the year s with the 4.1

[raptorthumper]

I know the heads are different.

Exh and Inlet valves different. Different and improved cylinder head casting.

The bolt patterns may still be the same.?