Hi Guys,
I put on my 40mm OME leaf and shock kit today that i organized from ARB....
I got back home in the shed and started pulling one part of at a time. All good, put the new leaf on, good and then went to put the shocks on.
Well my Sierra is an 85 NT, they supplied my with 2 x N43's and 2 x OME34 shocks. They are both bolt top shocks "nuts on thread style" where as my back is a rubber push on a bolt like the bottom part, perpendicular mount.
I hope this makes sense.
So have i got the wrong shocks, and which ones go on the front?
My invoice said that the N43's front, but we tried putting them on and they seemed tight around the top of the shock to the chassis?
Any help would be great?
Cheers
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OME Lift Shocks?
Van-tastic!
Posts: 6107
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2007 5:22 pm
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2007 5:22 pm
Location: .."I MIGHT NOT AGREE WITH WHAT YOU SAY, BUT ILL DEFEND YOUR RIGHT TO SAY IT".
Shocks
Thanks for that guys.
Yeah i will ask them tomorrow.
It took them 4 days to get the last lot in so i might have to wait a while.
I have been doing my normal 1km trips in the bus just with the original shocks and emu springs. Let me say they are worth the money!
Cheers again.
Yeah i will ask them tomorrow.
It took them 4 days to get the last lot in so i might have to wait a while.
I have been doing my normal 1km trips in the bus just with the original shocks and emu springs. Let me say they are worth the money!
Cheers again.
Shocks
Hi,
I found out today that i need the OME013 shocks for the rear and the OME031's for the front.
What do people think of upgrading the steering damper to an OME with bigger tyres? Will you notice any difference? If so what will you notice?
I noticed heaps with the Springs changed, but a steering damper will that change steering bounce back or something?
Cheers
I found out today that i need the OME013 shocks for the rear and the OME031's for the front.
What do people think of upgrading the steering damper to an OME with bigger tyres? Will you notice any difference? If so what will you notice?
I noticed heaps with the Springs changed, but a steering damper will that change steering bounce back or something?
Cheers
Steering dampers are a waste of money. If you steering is "right" there is no need for one.
If your stock damper is shot, maybe replace it, but really, they only mask a problem they don't fix anything.
Steve.
If your stock damper is shot, maybe replace it, but really, they only mask a problem they don't fix anything.
Steve.
[quote="greg"] some say he is a man without happy dreams, or that he sees silver linings on clouds and wonders why they are not platinum... all we know, is he's called the stevie.[/quote]
I agree with Gwagensteve, abloody expensive band aid!
If it steers properly great if it doesn't than fix the cause not cover the problem.
If you ever get your hands on a genuine suzuki manual read up on the front axle section and it explains what the rubber seals do in the swival hubs this is why coilys or jimny's never had a dampner as those rubber rings did the job If you got a wobble and everything else seamed ok good chance by changing them would be the fix.
If it steers properly great if it doesn't than fix the cause not cover the problem.
If you ever get your hands on a genuine suzuki manual read up on the front axle section and it explains what the rubber seals do in the swival hubs this is why coilys or jimny's never had a dampner as those rubber rings did the job If you got a wobble and everything else seamed ok good chance by changing them would be the fix.
Shocks and clearance..
Hi Again,
Thanks for the info. I have got on my OME 40mm with new shocks and the suzi is riding really nicely now.
Are the front springs with this lift supposed to be as high lifted as the rear?
I have about an extra 1.5 inch lift at the rear of the car.
This is making a real problem with my 30 x 9.5.... yes only 30's today i was doing some interesting flex tests and i was constantly getting stuck with the front tyre eating away at my guard in the front around the wheel.
I have cut of the bullbar mount out on the edge as this was rubbing initially.
I want to avoid a bodylift, but how else do you recommend i gain some clearance, will a small shakle lift help? Bigger springs? Or will i just need to bodylift?
Cheers From Sam
Thanks for the info. I have got on my OME 40mm with new shocks and the suzi is riding really nicely now.
Are the front springs with this lift supposed to be as high lifted as the rear?
I have about an extra 1.5 inch lift at the rear of the car.
This is making a real problem with my 30 x 9.5.... yes only 30's today i was doing some interesting flex tests and i was constantly getting stuck with the front tyre eating away at my guard in the front around the wheel.
I have cut of the bullbar mount out on the edge as this was rubbing initially.
I want to avoid a bodylift, but how else do you recommend i gain some clearance, will a small shakle lift help? Bigger springs? Or will i just need to bodylift?
Cheers From Sam
OME do put some "rake" into the car (i.e the front sits lower than the rear.) When you bought the springs, you would hve had some sort of conversation with the ARB sales guy about the use of the vehicle. Odds are you have heavy duty rear springs, which will only allow about 1" of droop travel in an unladen car- they are designed to work with a load.
Also, the design of the front suspension will not allow as much lift as is possible in the rear with an acceptable ride.
If you never load the car up and the rake is getting to you, you can always pull some leaves out of the rear (the overloads to start with) to lower the rear. Lifting the front more will just turn the car into a pig and open up a whole can of worms related to shackle length, position and shock length.
You have just discovered one of the great truths about suspension lifts. THEY DON"T LET YOU FIT A BIGGER TYRE!! In fact, sometimes, the added travel they permit will actually make scrubbing worse.
A body lift is one way around the problem, but the other way would be some small spacers on the front bumpstops, about 25mm should do the trick.
Steve.
Also, the design of the front suspension will not allow as much lift as is possible in the rear with an acceptable ride.
If you never load the car up and the rake is getting to you, you can always pull some leaves out of the rear (the overloads to start with) to lower the rear. Lifting the front more will just turn the car into a pig and open up a whole can of worms related to shackle length, position and shock length.
You have just discovered one of the great truths about suspension lifts. THEY DON"T LET YOU FIT A BIGGER TYRE!! In fact, sometimes, the added travel they permit will actually make scrubbing worse.
A body lift is one way around the problem, but the other way would be some small spacers on the front bumpstops, about 25mm should do the trick.
Steve.
[quote="greg"] some say he is a man without happy dreams, or that he sees silver linings on clouds and wonders why they are not platinum... all we know, is he's called the stevie.[/quote]
Unloaded and on level ground the car should sit close to level, maybe a little higher in the rear. 1.5" higher at one end is rather stupid. It should never sit higher at the front, that would definitaley be wrong
Thanks guys for the quick bit on steering dampers, I noticed mine leaking last week when I was crawling around under the car; the car never had any steering issues. I ended up getting a free 2nd hand one from the neighbour; but if it dies I might not bother with replacing it.
Thanks guys for the quick bit on steering dampers, I noticed mine leaking last week when I was crawling around under the car; the car never had any steering issues. I ended up getting a free 2nd hand one from the neighbour; but if it dies I might not bother with replacing it.
Wheeling on completely wicked angles, without even looking stable.
bear in mind that rear spring rate on Sierras is about 155lb/" so 1.5" of compression on the rear equals 211kg of load, which includes the driver. Packed for camping, you'd easily exceed that figure. that's the problem with llight cars and low pring rates- there is lots of variation in ride height with load.Highway-Star wrote:Unloaded and on level ground the car should sit close to level, maybe a little higher in the rear. 1.5" higher at one end is rather stupid. It should never sit higher at the front, that would definitaley be wrong
If the car sat level unladen, then loaded it would have to site say 1.5" low in the rear, which isn't really ideal.
As an aside, why is it universally wrong to have the car nose high? desert race trucks tend to be run a bit nose high because they want to run plenty of compression in the front end to take big hits and lots of droop in the rear to keep the tyres hooked up. (I agree there is no good reason in a Sierra though)
Steve.
[quote="greg"] some say he is a man without happy dreams, or that he sees silver linings on clouds and wonders why they are not platinum... all we know, is he's called the stevie.[/quote]
OME LIFT SHOCKS
OK Thanks for clearing that up.
I am guessing i am most likely better putting in a bodylift to fix it and just make custom bumper and bullbar brackets.....
I want to get my steering aligned now that i have all the suspension done and new tyres (it was out before) will a bodylift effect the steering afterwards or should i wait?
Thanks.
I am guessing i am most likely better putting in a bodylift to fix it and just make custom bumper and bullbar brackets.....
I want to get my steering aligned now that i have all the suspension done and new tyres (it was out before) will a bodylift effect the steering afterwards or should i wait?
Thanks.
Why do you ant to bodylift the car? If you are happy with a 30" tyre I can't see any need. some light mallet work on the guard lip and some small bumpstop spacers has got to be better than a body lift- you will have a lower COG without one and won't have to stiff around with brackets.
If you are chasing a bigger tyre than a 30 soon then fair enough go with a BL
Suspension lift and body lift both have no effect on alignment. the only adjustment on a sierra is toe in and out. suspension lift will out the steering wheel centre position out because the increase in height affects the drag link. The drag link is not adjustable so the only way of correcting this is to pull off the steering wheel and put it on in the right position, a 5 minute job.
PS the rear bumper is attached to the body no the chassis so you don't need brackets for the rear bumper when you BL.
Steve.
If you are chasing a bigger tyre than a 30 soon then fair enough go with a BL
Suspension lift and body lift both have no effect on alignment. the only adjustment on a sierra is toe in and out. suspension lift will out the steering wheel centre position out because the increase in height affects the drag link. The drag link is not adjustable so the only way of correcting this is to pull off the steering wheel and put it on in the right position, a 5 minute job.
PS the rear bumper is attached to the body no the chassis so you don't need brackets for the rear bumper when you BL.
Steve.
[quote="greg"] some say he is a man without happy dreams, or that he sees silver linings on clouds and wonders why they are not platinum... all we know, is he's called the stevie.[/quote]
OME LIFT SHOCKS
Hi Steve,
Thanks for the reply.
Yes my rear bumper is customed up i made it ages ago tyre swinger job and it is attached to the chassis.
I think i will use the mullet and put some inch spacers in then and see how i go.
I have some rubbing at the back wall of the tyre against the guard, will a hammering + the 25mm spacer fix this? I was stuck yesterday in a hairy culvit where i was trying to turn out and go up and my wheel was getting stuck on my guard and would not turn......
Do you normally just use some 25mm square tube and space the stops?
Thanks for the help... All quite new to me.
Sam
Thanks for the reply.
Yes my rear bumper is customed up i made it ages ago tyre swinger job and it is attached to the chassis.
I think i will use the mullet and put some inch spacers in then and see how i go.
I have some rubbing at the back wall of the tyre against the guard, will a hammering + the 25mm spacer fix this? I was stuck yesterday in a hairy culvit where i was trying to turn out and go up and my wheel was getting stuck on my guard and would not turn......
Do you normally just use some 25mm square tube and space the stops?
Thanks for the help... All quite new to me.
Sam
Can you be a bit more specific about what was touching where? It sounds like you meant the inside of the tyre was hitting the inner guard, which can be a problem with NT cars.
Can you post a pic of your car?
Rim offset can have a big effect on what rubs where, which was why I was asking about the photo.- It is easier to see than try to explain. It sounds like you might have a fair bit of backspacing. 9.5's normally clear OK, 10.5's rub on NT's. Even soIt should be a touch rather than a jam.
Bumpstop spacing will help. A BL will assist, but I woudln't want to BL a narrow track car- it would get spooky.
Steve.
Can you post a pic of your car?
Rim offset can have a big effect on what rubs where, which was why I was asking about the photo.- It is easier to see than try to explain. It sounds like you might have a fair bit of backspacing. 9.5's normally clear OK, 10.5's rub on NT's. Even soIt should be a touch rather than a jam.
Bumpstop spacing will help. A BL will assist, but I woudln't want to BL a narrow track car- it would get spooky.
Steve.
[quote="greg"] some say he is a man without happy dreams, or that he sees silver linings on clouds and wonders why they are not platinum... all we know, is he's called the stevie.[/quote]
OME shock lift
I have just put some batteries on charge as i have not taken photos of the new tyres on there yet.
It was hitting to start with on normal road driving on the front bullbar mount out on the edge. I trimmed the corner of this of and now it is fine even when 4wd'ing.
When heavily articulated it will rub against the top of the wheel arch not the inside, or not on the leaf though. It rubs on the firewall side when slightly articulated, i started hammering when out yesterday.....
The main problem is when heavily depressed i can not drive as my wheel is caught nearly all around the back and the top of the gaurd.
I will post photos ASAP.
Sam
Yeah i am not too keen on lifting her anymore atm, rides very nice now.
It was hitting to start with on normal road driving on the front bullbar mount out on the edge. I trimmed the corner of this of and now it is fine even when 4wd'ing.
When heavily articulated it will rub against the top of the wheel arch not the inside, or not on the leaf though. It rubs on the firewall side when slightly articulated, i started hammering when out yesterday.....
The main problem is when heavily depressed i can not drive as my wheel is caught nearly all around the back and the top of the gaurd.
I will post photos ASAP.
Sam
Yeah i am not too keen on lifting her anymore atm, rides very nice now.
Gwagensteve wrote:bear in mind that rear spring rate on Sierras is about 155lb/" so 1.5" of compression on the rear equals 211kg of load, which includes the driver. Packed for camping, you'd easily exceed that figure. that's the problem with llight cars and low pring rates- there is lots of variation in ride height with load.Highway-Star wrote:Unloaded and on level ground the car should sit close to level, maybe a little higher in the rear. 1.5" higher at one end is rather stupid. It should never sit higher at the front, that would definitaley be wrong
If the car sat level unladen, then loaded it would have to site say 1.5" low in the rear, which isn't really ideal.
As an aside, why is it universally wrong to have the car nose high? desert race trucks tend to be run a bit nose high because they want to run plenty of compression in the front end to take big hits and lots of droop in the rear to keep the tyres hooked up. (I agree there is no good reason in a Sierra though)
Steve.
Point taken. But I still think 1.5" difference in any car is off; this is where spring rates become important for load carrying situations.
Universally Wrong high nose? Never thought about it in depth, Its probably partly phycological; as cars that sit low in the rear are often overloaded, and usually end up having too little weight on the front wheels (effects steering and braking). Personally I think it looks wrong as well which doesn't help. This might be pushing it, but it could affect castor, and have detrimental effects on steering? A car sitting high at the front, but low at the back could make for some air-cooling of drive train components...
vk5hks: Try the spacers first (then check if thats adequate), they are completely reversible if you ever need to change things, hammering the firewall is reasonably perminant. Box section works for spacers, advantage of box is it will crush if you 'jump' the car, and this can stop more severe damage. If you use box, check they are still in shape before and after every trip where they may make contact. I'm assuming you have no swaybar on the front? It may be possible to re-install the swaybar to reduce front flex, however this does make the rear suspension work more than the front, and gives 'unbalanced' articulation; it also reduces axle droop which is not a problem to you.
Wheeling on completely wicked angles, without even looking stable.
Having the car low in the rear and high in the front would add caster therefore making the handling better, not that I am advocating it for general use.
1.5" being a bit off? Well, 211kg of payload is less than 1/2 maximum and that would level the car, so if ANY load carrying was planned, you couldn't really expect any less than 1.5" taller in the rear unladen.
At GVM the car would be 1.5" low in the rear
(yes, I know I have ignored the effect of the load on the front, but it is much less than the rear)
Steve.
1.5" being a bit off? Well, 211kg of payload is less than 1/2 maximum and that would level the car, so if ANY load carrying was planned, you couldn't really expect any less than 1.5" taller in the rear unladen.
At GVM the car would be 1.5" low in the rear
(yes, I know I have ignored the effect of the load on the front, but it is much less than the rear)
Steve.
[quote="greg"] some say he is a man without happy dreams, or that he sees silver linings on clouds and wonders why they are not platinum... all we know, is he's called the stevie.[/quote]
pics of car
Hi here are some pics of the car. Let me know if these help at all, or if you need me to post some more.
Thanks From Sam
Thanks From Sam
OME LIFT SHOCKS
I was just measuring the gap between the bumbstop and the axle compared to the tyre and the guard.
It will need at least 25mm of spacer, any thoughts?
Sam
It will need at least 25mm of spacer, any thoughts?
Sam
A picture is woth 1000 words! - This makes it heaps easier. Nice car by the way.
OK, you have "speedy" wheels. These have less backspacing (more offset) than either ROH Trak 2 wheels or stock sierra wheels.
This is making your track wider, which is good for stability and room around the chassis and spring, but bad for clearance at the guard. In a car with more backspacing on the wheels, the tyres will move up nto the guard on compression. Obviously, in your case, the tyre will catch the top of the guard rather than move up into the inner guard like suzuki intended.
Yes, I would try a 25mm bumpstop spacer. This should do the trick.
PS the rake front to rear is pretty normal, in fact I have seen plenty that are much higher in the rear than that - soft tops in particular.
steve.
OK, you have "speedy" wheels. These have less backspacing (more offset) than either ROH Trak 2 wheels or stock sierra wheels.
This is making your track wider, which is good for stability and room around the chassis and spring, but bad for clearance at the guard. In a car with more backspacing on the wheels, the tyres will move up nto the guard on compression. Obviously, in your case, the tyre will catch the top of the guard rather than move up into the inner guard like suzuki intended.
Yes, I would try a 25mm bumpstop spacer. This should do the trick.
PS the rake front to rear is pretty normal, in fact I have seen plenty that are much higher in the rear than that - soft tops in particular.
steve.
[quote="greg"] some say he is a man without happy dreams, or that he sees silver linings on clouds and wonders why they are not platinum... all we know, is he's called the stevie.[/quote]
OME LIFT SHOCKS
Thanks Steve,
I will try spacers. Yes i have a much wider track, and i felt it the other day when i was driving on some nasty angles, felt a lot more comfortable.
I will let you know how i get on.
Sam
I will try spacers. Yes i have a much wider track, and i felt it the other day when i was driving on some nasty angles, felt a lot more comfortable.
I will let you know how i get on.
Sam
That castor altering would improve handling. I need to do some reading on this stuff, I thought it would make it worse.
I just reckon 1.5" difference on such a SWB vehicle, would be too much of an anlge; but if that is the difference on vk5hks 's car then its not too bad really.
WRT to total travel in the rear of 3" for standard springs I assume, and rated load carrying, fair enough, I've never put the ~450kg load in my car to try it, I've had four people and 50kg on the towball, and I know I've got to go very slow over bumps, or else she hits the bump stops on the back. My car doens't have 3" travel in the rear to compress; unladen its 45mm on drivers side, and 55mm on passenger. Thank goodness load carrying is somewhat of a rarity!
I just reckon 1.5" difference on such a SWB vehicle, would be too much of an anlge; but if that is the difference on vk5hks 's car then its not too bad really.
WRT to total travel in the rear of 3" for standard springs I assume, and rated load carrying, fair enough, I've never put the ~450kg load in my car to try it, I've had four people and 50kg on the towball, and I know I've got to go very slow over bumps, or else she hits the bump stops on the back. My car doens't have 3" travel in the rear to compress; unladen its 45mm on drivers side, and 55mm on passenger. Thank goodness load carrying is somewhat of a rarity!
Wheeling on completely wicked angles, without even looking stable.
Highway-Star - that woudl indicate to me your springs are pretty sagged - stock you should have around 75mm to the bumpstop in the rear, and about 50mm in the front.
It is not uncommon for the front to run at 25mm of compression too.
(front is 5"/125mm travel stock, rear is 6" 150mm stock)
vk5hks - this is the trade off between track width and tyre clearance. Once the tyre can no longer travel up inside the guard there is a restriction on tyre size.
I run 34's on my NT with 2" bumpstop and 2" BL (and basically flat springs) all because of the 16x4.5 rims with stock offset. Yes, it wants to fall over all the time.
Steve.
It is not uncommon for the front to run at 25mm of compression too.
(front is 5"/125mm travel stock, rear is 6" 150mm stock)
vk5hks - this is the trade off between track width and tyre clearance. Once the tyre can no longer travel up inside the guard there is a restriction on tyre size.
I run 34's on my NT with 2" bumpstop and 2" BL (and basically flat springs) all because of the 16x4.5 rims with stock offset. Yes, it wants to fall over all the time.
Steve.
[quote="greg"] some say he is a man without happy dreams, or that he sees silver linings on clouds and wonders why they are not platinum... all we know, is he's called the stevie.[/quote]
Gwagensteve wrote:Highway-Star - that woudl indicate to me your springs are pretty sagged - stock you should have around 75mm to the bumpstop in the rear, and about 50mm in the front.
It is not uncommon for the front to run at 25mm of compression too.
(front is 5"/125mm travel stock, rear is 6" 150mm stock)
Sagged, really...
Fronts not quite that bad, its about 30mm. Wait till I install 30kg of steel on the front, then my front springs will have something worth winging about
.One day I'll replace the whole suspension, theres more than sagged springs thats wrong with it.
Speaking of which, vk5hks, have you noticed any comfort improvement with the aftermarket shockies? I reckon some decent aftermarket shock absorbers could smooth out the ride a bit on patched up bitumen roads, and corugations.
Wheeling on completely wicked angles, without even looking stable.
OME LIFT SHOCKS
Hey,
I noticed heaps of ride improvement with the new springs, and some extra from the shocks. I was very impressed with how i used to drive through drains in the road and so-forth and the car would bounce me through the roof, now it just softly rides through...
The new tyres made it even nicer in regards to ride, a little bit heavier on the steering (more workout
bit slower and runs a bit faster in low range.
I am very happy with the overall finish of the springs and shocks though.
Sam
P.S I managed to get mass amounts of flex out of the rear and front the other day, heaps more stable with four claws on the ground!
I noticed heaps of ride improvement with the new springs, and some extra from the shocks. I was very impressed with how i used to drive through drains in the road and so-forth and the car would bounce me through the roof, now it just softly rides through...
The new tyres made it even nicer in regards to ride, a little bit heavier on the steering (more workout
bit slower and runs a bit faster in low range.I am very happy with the overall finish of the springs and shocks though.
Sam
P.S I managed to get mass amounts of flex out of the rear and front the other day, heaps more stable with four claws on the ground!
Re: OME LIFT SHOCKS
vk5hks wrote:Hey,
I noticed heaps of ride improvement with the new springs, and some extra from the shocks. I was very impressed with how i used to drive through drains in the road and so-forth and the car would bounce me through the roof, now it just softly rides through...
The new tyres made it even nicer in regards to ride, a little bit heavier on the steering (more workout
I am very happy with the overall finish of the springs and shocks though.
Sam
P.S I managed to get mass amounts of flex out of the rear and front the other day, heaps more stable with four claws on the ground!
Cool, thats what I was hoping you'd say. Heavy steering can be fixed by building arm muscles
; or PAS. Bit fast in LR can be fixed by gears.Wheeling on completely wicked angles, without even looking stable.
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