MTR's and balancing

[AndrewW]

Hi guys,

First post on here!!

Got some MTR's awhile back, on ROH rims, for my 2002 Hilux. I kept the original tyres for the road. With the MTRs on there is a distinct shaking at much over 80kmh. Would this be normal for this type of tyre. They are only 31's. I would expect them to be worse on the highway than road tyres, but this shaking is enough to drive me mad.

Tyres guys keep saying there muddies there supposed to do that?? Is this true, or is it crap?? I would have though that the tyres should run reasonably smoothly on the highway, at least no shaking.

Also, has anyone got any places in eastern suburbs of Melbourne that do really good balances?? I got the tyres from a tyrepower outlet, and they have been balanced around 6 times. They have also been balanced twice at Bob Jane, but this made it worse. Both places used the six finger thing on the balance machine. Also got the rims balanced separately, and they were all the same, only 10 whatevers on one side.

Any input appreciated.

Thanks

[Timmy]

i use equal in my MTR's n it works great...no vibs at any speed

[bigsteve]

They have done a crap job at your balancing.

I ran 32 inch MTR's for a year with no probs, I recommend Beaurepairs in Rosanna, speak to Gavin

I had my tyres off the rims and back on 3 times, as a rule he alwyas picks the 2 tyres tht balanced up the best for the front, not all tyre fitters do this.

[ORSM45]

thats crap about 'theyre muddies theyre sposed to do that' i had 35s balanced perfect, my bros 37s are doin exactly what you've said, 80km/h+ starts bouncing. except only in the front. the rears seem fine, hes taken it back and theyve balanced them a few times now. still no good, hes even had an alignment, still no luck. so i dunno mate. 31s should balance without any problems.

[bogo]

ive run muddies in bfg and now mtr's for ages on lots of different vehicles they definatly should not shake. bigger tyres do have more chance of shaking but 31's should run sweet (the bigger they r the more out of round they tend to be). if you have had them match mounted which bob jane do as an option (silver balance) and they didnt say they were out of round there is a possible force variation problem with the tyres, try pumping em up to 50-60 psi then take it for a drive. if the shake is gone try letting em down 1 by 1 till u get the shake back, that way u will find which tyre is causing the problem. force variation is a warranty fault

[greg]

If they balance okay on the balancing machine, wouldn't it suggest that there is something wrong with your car? Have you tried another set of rims and tyres on it?

[MKPatrolGuy]

If you are out Bayswater way the Beaurepaires truck place on Cantebury Road in Bayswater did a really good job of Dad's very unbalanced swampers.

[redzook]

If they balance okay on the balancing machine, wouldn't it suggest that there is something wrong with your car? Have you tried another set of rims and tyres on it?

have u tried reading what he posted

Got some MTR's awhile back, on ROH rims, for my 2002 Hilux. I kept the original tyres for the road

[bogged]

Tyres guys keep saying there muddies there supposed to do that??

Code for
"we have no idea how to balance tires"....

go elsewhere for a balance...

one thing i have noticed, it doesnt take much for MTR's to get OUT of balance.

[Bluey]

have bfg muddies, 33". no shake at all, just hum from tread blocks

surely can't be that hard to balance! follow advice of fellow melbournians and go elsewhere

[No Idea]

They should get a shake up - but only under 10km/h. anything over that would be a balance problem.
Try a different tyre shop.
When I balanced my 35" cooper STTs I had to spin them on the rim to get the weights down on the outside.
31s should not have that sort of problem as they are smaller.

[AndrewW]

Guys,

Thanks for the feedback. To be honest, I think that the tyres are dodgy. I am currently trying to pressure Tyrepower into replacing the tyres. Will see what happens. A Goodyear rep is coming out sometime this week to have a look. I reckon I have done around 200km with people test driving the dodgy tyres.

I will try the method bogo suggested of put alot of pressure in the tyres. I was running around 32psi on the highway, upped it to 40 and it handles much better, still got the shakes though

Both tyre places have rotated the tyres on the rim each time it was balanced, but there still is heaps of weight on each wheel, usually around 70 - 90 on the outside and the same in the inside.

The last balance that was done is the best so far. Different types of tarmac reduce the vibrations to almost nothing.

If I can't get them replaced and fixed at the original place, I will go else where. I have already paid Bob Jane $65 for nothing, plus lots of time stuffing about and waiting, so I will exhaust this option first. The truck place in Bayswater sounds alright though, at least they might know how to balance heavier tyres. Unfortunately Rosanna is a fair way from me. Any other recommendations of places around the Dandenong area???

You know its bad when you dream about muddies that don't shake Like everyone said, they are only 31's.

Cheers

Andrew

[Landcruiser Tom]

I had some Bridgestone tyres I bought from the Tyre Factory about 2 years ago. I had them balanced about 8 times at different places (ARB, Tyrepower, Beurepaires, even balanced on the car). Every time they would balance up almost perfectly, but as soon as my car got over 70Km the wheel would shake.

Eventually the problem was found to be a soft spot in the rubber of the tread on one of the tyres - Bridgestone replaced the tyre and I never had a problem again.

[AndrewW]

Landcruiser Tom, and others,

I did an excercise of putting the original Highway tyres on the front only, vibrations were heaps less, but still there. I then put the muddies that were on the front, back on, and put the HTs on the back. Same again, less vibration than normal, but still there. Makes me think all the tyres are dodgy.

Also, originally I was given Speedy Desert Rat rims. I got them to change them to ROH Trak 2 rims. This was a wasted exercise, as all eight rims required 10 grams (or whatever weight it is) on the inside. Am happier I ended up with the ROH rims though.

Lastly, when at Bob Jane the cocky idiot was positive he knew which wheel it was, so he replaced that tyre. Overall it made it worse, so it appears I have lucked out with two batches of tyres made on Friday

I am on a roll, bought a chrissy pres for myself, DVD burner, it doesn't f**king work either

[MKPatrolGuy]

Another good thing about the Bayswater Beaurepaires is, it is only $8.00 a tyre

[ShortyMQ]

I run 37'' MTR's on mine on road and have had no probs at all
Have you checked wheel bearings and steering dampner

[ozy1]

i got me self a set of second hand 33x12.5 MTRs on 15x8 ROH rims, there is alot less vibration now, than what there was with my 32x11.5 BFG AT's on 15x7 rims, and i havnt balanced them since i got em,

i used to get bad vibes, but im happy now its very slight.

[murcod]

While this story isn't about a 4WD I'm sure the same may apply:

Guy I work with bought a new Hyundai Elantra (top of the range with mags and 15" Korean tyres), anyway it had problems with the steering wheel shaking at highway speeds. He had the tyres balanced mutliple times by different tyre places, had it checked by the Hyundai dealer mulitple times - who at first refused to acknowledge there was a problem!

In the end Hyundai bit the bullet and agreed to put on four new tyres (same brand but more expensive model) and the problem was fixed.

PS: My Cooper A/T's do have a small amount of steering wheel shake at about 55km/h- and they're only 235/70R15.....

[Area54]

Landcruiser Tom, and others,

I did an excercise of putting the original Highway tyres on the front only, vibrations were heaps less, but still there. I then put the muddies that were on the front, back on, and put the HTs on the back. Same again, less vibration than normal, but still there. Makes me think all the tyres are dodgy.

Also, originally I was given Speedy Desert Rat rims. I got them to change them to ROH Trak 2 rims. This was a wasted exercise, as all eight rims required 10 grams (or whatever weight it is) on the inside. Am happier I ended up with the ROH rims though.

Lastly, when at Bob Jane the cocky idiot was positive he knew which wheel it was, so he replaced that tyre. Overall it made it worse, so it appears I have lucked out with two batches of tyres made on Friday

I am on a roll, bought a chrissy pres for myself, DVD burner, it doesn't f**king work either :x

Did you buy a computer case burner or stand alone DVD recorder? A lot of the dvd burners in the computer case will only use DVD+R media, as opposed to the cheaper and more available DVD-R media. DVD-R media is the same media used by most duplication houses to duplicate movies, and is the same format that off the shelf DVDs are recorded in.

What sort of vehicle do you have this shimmy problem with?

Just as a note, I mount all my trail and most road tyres at home, unbalanced without major problems, except on my Maverick. Nissan front ends are a delicate balance, and require all the planets to line up to have no problems. My JT2s will shake the mav apart, whereas when they are on the Camolux it is only slightly noticeable. My point is, it maybe time to start looking at other causes to the problem.

[V8Patrol]

35" BFG's MTRs on 8" steel rims.... no vibes from tyres at all, they are currently on a second set of rims ( 8" also) and were rebalenced when fitted to the new rims !!!

things to try...

fit them up to another 4x4 and test drive, If the vibes are still there its the tyre/rims that are at fault..... if there's no vibes then its your front end thats out.

If possiable borrow another set from some-one else and test drive your rig with their tyres on, if they dont vibe on their rig they shouldnt on yours, if they do ..... again its your front end

would probably pay to get a front end alignment done too as this will eliminate any vehicle fault and place all problems back on the tyre balencing. Check kingpin & wheel bearings, also tierod ends & idlerarm bushes

I have found that the larger tyres do vibrate slightly and a small adjustment in the "toe in" ( a slight reduction of toe in) helps considerably.
Are the tyres any wider then the previous set you had on ?

[AndrewW]

Guys,

The DVD burner is a Pioneer A06, which is internal and does both the + and - formats. Got it replaced yesterday, and is working well now

Vehicle is a 2002 Hilux, don't think there are any issues with the front end, as the normal road tyres run smoothly. The tyres are 10.5 inches wide, the originals are 255/70R15, so roughly 9.5. As previously stated with a mix of the HT and the muddies, I found that there was still shaking. Also got a wheel alignment done not long ago, but before the MTRs were fitted. Also, worth saying, there seems to be a fair bit of vibration from the rear wheels too, not just the front.

I will try fitting the wheels to another lux, luckly my friend is buying one this week, so it should be easy enough to do.

Can a wheel alignment affect the vibrations?? I have noticed that the front of the hilux seems to be like a race car, the wheels are on a bit of an angle, with the top being in further than the bottom when looking from the front. Think this is called camber?? Should it be like this??

The date is set, Friday the Goodyear guy is coming to have a look!!

Thanks for the input.

Andrew

[ausyota]

Yeah the tilt on the tyres is the camber.
On IFS hiluxs it can be a real pain.
You need to find a good wheel alignment place that knows what they are doing, but even with a good wheel alignment it doesnt take much wheeling to throw it out.

Your camber wont be whats making the shakes though. Camber problems will show as exessive wear on the inside edge of your tyres.

I think it sounds as though either your rims are stuffed or you have faulty or out of round tyres. But trying out your tyres on another vehicle is a good way to narrow down where your problems are.
If you find that it is vibrating on the other vehicle maybe then try putting them on different rims and see if they still do it.