auto vs manual gearbox

Post by **germo** » Sun Apr 20, 2008 8:38 am

another brake upgrade which I used and will use again when I go to hilux diffs, id to use a GQ master cylinder! you need the 2 bolt gq one, and it bolts straight to the 1.3l boosster.
you will need to make a longer push rod, which from memory is a 6 mm thread, so a long 6mm bolt and cut it to suit, then scew the brake lines in and bleed!
this setup locked up the brakes on my suzuki with 37"

I took the zook to a brake place when it had stock master and booster to get them to blled / check the bakes.
they said due to the brake piston increase, fron the hilux brakes the suzuki master cyl could not pump the required amount of brake fluid fast enough, I had nearly half brake travel before the car stoped! but with the GQ the brakes where straight on!

just a thought on brake upgrades.

and I just had normal lines.
and slotted fronts, but the heat produced rock crawling in not an issue so I don't see the need / benefit of them. but maybe there is another benefit I'm not aware of, I thought it was just heat dissipation!

ashley

oh and another thing just an idea
have you looked into a c4 auto, it is only a three speed but is pretty stong and prob wont need upgrading under a zook unless you start getting alot of hp into it!
check out dellow automotive. they make adaptors for lots and lots of conversions

whatever you do, its best to plumb a cooler, because in the rock your oil is going to get hot when using your torque converter.

Post by **built4thrashing** » Sun Apr 20, 2008 9:50 am

the vit brake upgrade is really simple and the LWB pads do have a bigger contact surface area. even when the rear drums are shagged from mud the fronts will still pull you up quickly. If ya a bit sus on the stock brakes the vit LWB are a simple solution. install time is about 45mins including bleeding .

Post by **joeblow** » Sun Apr 20, 2008 10:21 am

i have a 4 speed auto and 5.1 diffs.....never had a drama braking. i do have 4 wheel discs though. the biggest improvement i have come across out of the brake set-ups i've done is the installation of a master and booster from an h20v6 or late model 1.6 type 2. stops fantastically with little pedal pressure....and i'm 1400kg empty with 33's!.....[ engineered for a gvm uprgrade...]

Post by **pubic** » Sun Apr 20, 2008 10:27 am

running the corolla auto for a couple of reasons.

readily available and therefore cheap. i got a whole setup for $100.

getting adapters is bloody expensive. i was going to run a manual supra box and dellows wanted $500 for the bell housing alone.... plus fork plus thrust bearings...

dellows dont get too many decent write ups either, well not on the housing i was after.

mr built.... the vit upgrade would be great if i was running sierra diffs. but i have hilux diffs for it. thanks for the input anyhow, im sure someone on here will find it useful.

so a bit of recap considering this thread has gone side tracked.

for the application of:

sierra with corolla 4AFE or GE. hilux diffs. 6.5 crawler gears and 35" tyres.

an auto box is more likely to benefit for a rig designed for 90% off road.

the AE71 3 speed corolla box bolts right onto the back of the 4AFE block. if useing a 4AGE you will need a auto pressure plate from a 4age as they have an 8 bolt pattern where as the FE has the 6 which matches the AE71.

must make sure a cooler is used to keep the box cold.

with the gearing of the zook as it will be, i will end up having a ratio of approx 135:1.this is great as long as i have the brakes to allow me to stall up the converter.

to do this there are a number of options:

some of the suggestions were

braided brake lines

slotted discs

disc to rear upgrade

if running sierra diffs the vit lwb calipers bolts stright to old sierra mounts

a 2 bolt gq master cylinder to allow for more pressure to the discs. just need to make an adapter for the push rod.

Post by **joeblow** » Sun Apr 20, 2008 10:34 am

there is an auto that will bolt up to the age....u have to make a crank adaptor is all, use the hilux brakes stock and upgrade master and booster. let me know if u go the age...will try find out what model the auto was.

Post by **pubic** » Sun Apr 20, 2008 11:03 am

the ae71 used a 4Ac block

the 4Age-fe-ze block are all the same. the only thing that differs the FE from the GE in this situation is the crank. GE has 8 bolts and the FE has 6 as does the 4AC.

of course there are huge differences between the GE and FE but they wont make any differences when matching a box to it.

the AE 71 box will bolt to any 4a block. its just the internals of the box that will need to be mucked around with.

i already hava a 4AFE that came out of the donor vehicle i bought (ae92 seca $300) thanks anyway.

Post by **dank** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 1:14 pm

I've got a 20v 4age which I am currently in the process of dropping into my sierra.

I decided to use a jatco 3spd auto out of an ae71 corolla. Its a little bit shorter than the T50 and don't need to worry about electronics. I haven't got the engine and box here but I am interested to read about the different bolt patterns between the box and the engine. i'll post some pics of my engine and gearbox in the next day or two.

Post by **dank** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 1:19 pm

pubic wrote:
the AE 71 box will bolt to any 4a block. its just the internals of the box that will need to be mucked around with.

can you elaborate on this?

I was told that my engine will bolt straight on to the auto box from the 84 model corolla if I had the driveplate from the 4age which i do. is this correct?

Post by **pubic** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 1:42 pm

i've been told the auto flywheel/pressure plate is different from the manual.

all of the 4A series toyota motors have the same block. theyre internals are different. on the back of your crank you should have an 8 bolt pattern i believe where as mine is a 6 bolt pattern. mine is a 4afe-less power and therefore does not need as much strength to hold the flywheel.

the auto box does not need to be modified as far as i know just the plate..

please correct me if im wrong.

i think i have a manual pressure plate at home. i will put it on the block and see if the box fouls on it at all.

any one had experience with these?

Post by **dank** » Tue Apr 22, 2008 9:46 am

someone posted this last night on toymods if you were interested pubic.

regarding the A40 gearbox:

my 4AGE 100kw has 8 bolts, its pre-decessor the 4AFC only had 6.

i used a 20v flexplate (8 bolt) to drive my auto - exact same size and torque convertor hole spacing as the original (6 bolt) 4AFC flex plate

Post by **pubic** » Tue Apr 22, 2008 2:29 pm

cheers but i have the 6 bolt 4afe.. i spoke with a auto box specialist today to get a better idea of it allas i know sfa about autos or manuals for that matter.

but learning as i go.

to finish mine off i just need to get the correct flex plate and centreing bush.

i didnt know it was named the a40 gearbox. that helps thanks

Post by **dank** » Tue Apr 22, 2008 2:39 pm

Yeah it was good news for me because I have all of the components i need to run the a40 behind my 20v bigport 4AGE. THought it was relevant to this thread.

Post by **dank** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 1:44 pm

Well finally got to my car today and have taken some pictures of the AE71 (1984) corolla 3spd auto box I have plus the driveplate that came with my 4age 20v.

You can see that the auto plate is a six hole design as is the engine flywheel although it also shows the 8 bolt crankshaft clearly as well. CVAP in shepparton delivered this engine for me and I asked if I was getting the right flywheel for it but am not sure if that flywheel was standard on the engine as it came from japan or if it was added on by CVAP after my initial inquiry.

Model number for the AE71 3spd Auto

6 bolt design

Auto side profile

Auto front/side profile

4AGE 20v Silvertop Driveplate - possibly a 20v auto driveplate not sure.

4AGE 20v Silvertop engine - was a transverse mounted engine from japan. not exactly sure what car it was out of.

Post by **pubic** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 1:54 pm

if your flywheel mates up your laughing.

i have the 6 stud pattern converter too. i just need the 6 bolt pattern flex plate. well atleast we now know the 4afe and 20v 4age cannot share the same flex plate. (educational

)

did you get a tail shaft with yours?

Post by **dank** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 2:03 pm

yep I got a tail shaft flange you can just see it in the side profile pic and have a good contact down here who will build up my jackshaft to fit the auto flange so it should be sweet.

Man I am

about all this working out. I was stressing there for a while.....

PS I just measured the bolt measurements for the auto flex plate and engine flywheel and its all equal so it should be a nice snug fit.

Post by **dank** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 2:15 pm

According to this website : http://cobratransmission.blogspot.com/2 ... n-tag.html

My auto transmission is an A41.

Post by **j-top paj** » Wed Apr 23, 2008 10:22 pm

dank wrote:
4AGE 20v Silvertop engine - was a transverse mounted engine from japan. not exactly sure what car it was out of.

came out of a corolla probably.
a mate had the 20v blacktop engine in his AE101 levin and fugg me that thing was fast for a NA stock 4banger

Post by **dank** » Thu Apr 24, 2008 10:13 am

j-top paj wrote:
dank wrote:
4AGE 20v Silvertop engine - was a transverse mounted engine from japan. not exactly sure what car it was out of.

came out of a corolla probably.
a mate had the 20v blacktop engine in his AE101 levin and fugg me that thing was fast for a NA stock 4banger

thats why I bought one

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