Goin gas only on the 80

[pastorslim]

Anyone know if it's possible to gain your original power back
(from petrol only) by dumpin petrol from the equation altogether
on the 4.5L 80? I have a 2nd gas tank that i reckon would fit in
where the main petrol tank is now. That way i could get a better range
with the 2. (You don't get too far on 90L of gas) and you never use petrol.
But is it worth it and how do you set the timing etc for straight gas?

[stilivn]

personally mate not a good idea, if your planning on ever doing a big trip thats going to need that sort of distances between petrol stations, chances are there not going to have gas at the servo, an with resale in mind you'd loose any attention from people after a touring vehicle.

[pastorslim]

Thanks for the reply mate.
I had thought of that but I don't think it's as bigger issue as it used to be There are websites that show that gas is available all over the place. (Maybe not to the red center without the big distances between)
Where I'm likely to go it's available. (Can even get the fittings to use a gas BBQ bottle for reserve if I'm camping out in the sticks for a while. Bit illegal though I think)

Anyway I'll probably hang onto this car for years so resale isn't the issue.

Want to know who else has done it on a cruiser and if they got the power back that I now miss. I should be able to get 600 - 700 ks out of the two tanks. That gets me most places easily.

[thehanko]

I would not worry too much about going straight gas these days, as who would use petrol by choice, and what % actually use 4wd's for what their capable of, not that many.

The power made by you engine will be effected by a number of things, such as the style of gas unit you have. is it injected or mixer style?

the mixer style is older and more like a carbie - so less efficient and powerful.

some people now claim that with vapor injection you can achieve more power on gas that petrol, but there are licencing laws making it hard to get in aus.

Normally the tune does change for gas v's petrol, and even on a dual fuel car it wont run as well on petrol as origional becuase of the tune change.

Just take it to a gas specialist and get it tuned properly and it should be better than now, though probably not as good as petrol only. but ther is always a trade off.

[pastorslim]

You're makin sense. It is a mixer type, so I probly won't get it all back hey. But the 2nd tank would mean I'm not at the servo every 2nd day, so that would be nice.
The other thing is, they reckon it can be a bugger to start on a cold morning without the petrol clickin in first. Can this be overcome?

[oldmate]

i don't think you can actually gain the power back, likely because lpg doesn't burn as efficiently as petrol (releases more heat than bang)

looking at the ford website the straight 6 on petrol makes 190kw, and the egas version makes about 150.

I would think if lpg could make the power than ford would have done it. Of course it could be a reliability thing. But gas does make more heat, and 1fz are known to do heads...

[craz3d]

Isn't egas ethanol not LPG?

[craz3d]

Isn't egas ethanol not LPG?

[thehanko]

he means the falcon egas motor, the gas only falcon.

Yedah your figures are right, however ford published an artical a while ago saying they were going to release a new all gas engine. vapour injection.

it would make 10% more power than the petrol barracuda with 10% better efficiency.

all sounds so good.

but the issue is some aussie dude down in melbourne invented the technology, which is great, but then he patented it for australia. then a dutch company bought the patent for the rest of the world.

aussie dude sat on his arse and never developed the technology to the point where it could be used.

the dutch got it sweet.

then ford wanted to use it, the dutch could not sell it to aussie land without paying said dude in melbourne more money than made it viable.

so it all fell in a heap.

which sucks cause the technology it self was supposed to be no more expensive than efi t build into a car.

so yes its theoretically posible to have boig power out of gas, but in the real world dont get your hopes up.



Maybe b4 you make the switch get your car tuned purely for gas and see what you think. see how it starts etc.

my gas car started like a pig.

[pastorslim]

Thanks. gonna do that mate. maybe I could have a can of "Start you bastard" built in under the bonnet to give it a squirt on a could day?

[PGS 4WD]

You can get within a couple of kW on straight LPG or Duel fuel with Gasresearch, it does require you to use premium and optimize the ignition timing. The 225 impco most people fit is restrictive at higher rpm and causes a loss around 8-10% which can be whittled down to about 3-5% with Gasresearch. Alternativly vapour injection will return similar results but installation will be a little dearer. You won't get litre for litre in economy due to the energy value in LPG per litre, if you are achieving the same economy on petrol and LPG either the petrol tune is too rich (or faulty) or the LPG too lean. There are fewer joules of energy in a litre of LPG that a litre of petrol. More by weight though.

Cheers

Joel

[pastorslim]

wot's gasresearch? That's a company isn't it? And a 225 impco?
Sounds like you know your stuff but I gonna need some laymans terms bro.
Are you saying I can get within a couple of kW
on straight gas without this technology and within it on dual fuel with it?
Do you have specs on timing for a 4.5 80 series on straight gas?
Are you saying go for it? Dump the petrol and put in a 2nd gas tank?

[want33s]

http://www.gasresearch.com.au/

This is the mob I was talking about the other day.
You will be more than happy with the grunt you CAN get out of straight gas.
You will need to do a bit of headwork and fit a GasResearch carby which may work out a little expensive as you already have gas.
If it were a new setup it would be financially more feasible.

Anyway talk to the experts at GasResearch, they'll set you straight.

Jas.

[pastorslim]

cool thanks fellas.

[PGS 4WD]

80's don't have especially hard valve seats but if you check and adjust your valve clearances regularly, I suggest every 50k klms, then you will get a couple of hundred thousand klms on LPG.
The problem with LPG is that if too lean or rich it burns hot and slow which means aggrivated valve seat wear, the Gasresearch product offers more tuneability than the Impco, as in part throttle, cruise, idle and load are all separatly adjustable. Unfortunatly if not uned correctly you might as well not waste your money on it as it is dearer to buy install, and tune.

Cheers

Joel

[pastorslim]

no worries. In a couple of hunderd k's time I might be able to wack a 4.5 V8 diesel in it. (If the car's still in one piece that is)

[robst]

Hi i gained all my power back and more on Lpg by 5kw buy fitting a Unichip.
Setup with dual mapping.And dyno tuned.about $1200 fitted and Dyno tuned.
As lpg is about 105 octane they can tune the engine much better.
and when you switch to ulp 91 octane, the switch is wired to the unichip and runs on the map for that fuel.
Has been a big improvement all round.

[-Nemesis-]

I've now got vapour injection on my quad cam V8, it runs on gas 99% of the time but I can use petrol need be (starts on petrol.)

The electronically injected LPG is so tuneable my engine has a 3kw difference between LPG and BP Ultimate 98 Octane petrol

Catch is it costs twice as much to install....

[happy]

Nemisis - who set up your system?

[Mattoz]

are you running an upper cylinder lubricant kit with gas to extend the valve and seat life?