would it be worth it or not, i have a old set of extractors i could use (engine flange side)
if its worth it, what size turbo?
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turbo 1ltr
turbo 1ltr
1993 Gq lwb with added xtra's :) sold
fj60,lifted,35s,33s for daily, 3f power!
fj60,lifted,35s,33s for daily, 3f power!
Turboing a 25 year old carby motor with points ignition isn't ever going to be a great idea.
Also, bear in mind these motors were designed to run on leaded, which had fairly high octane (from memory, around 96-97) so trying to run boost with "less than perfect" timing control and crap spark with only a point of octane up your sleeve - it's going to be fraught.
Is it possible? Yes, I'm sure it is. Is it going to be costly to make reliable- certainly.
I'm sure for less than $1K you could make it show boost on a gauge and make a bit more power. However, it would take far more than $1K to make the package reliable or drivable. Even finding a small enough turbo isn't easy - Charade being one option, or Toyota CT12 from a 1GGTE being another.
IMHO, the best way to turbo a 1.0 is to put a 660cc turbo in it. Mine was $1200 and came with a whole car attached to it, a very late model (1997) K6A (all alloy) was recently purchased complete, with a full loom, radiator and fan for $1200=shipping from NZ and a cappuccino front cut runs about $2K, but has a difficult to work with gearbox, although it can work.
Of course, there's wiring, a fuel tank/pump etc, VSS dash mods, exhaust, and other stuff to go with the bare engine cost, but you're dealing with all of that with the 1.0 turbo anyway, even if you keep it carby, however, at least the 660 drops in on stock 1.0 mounts.
That's my 2C. I put about 3000km on my 1.0 motor and for what it was they are pretty good, but I'd never bother trying to boost one.
PS - don't get hung up on the parts you need - sure, a CT12 turbo is fairly cheap, and you have a manifold flange. all the heartache is in getting the tuning right. You really really don't want a car that's a dog to drive, overheats unless it's under 20˚ or you're doing over 60km/h, needs such cold plugs it won't start in the morning, or has to run octane booster and 98 octane to not ping its guts out. This is the hard part of a turbo conversion on an old, low tech motor - not the hard parts like turbos and manifolds.
Steve.
Also, bear in mind these motors were designed to run on leaded, which had fairly high octane (from memory, around 96-97) so trying to run boost with "less than perfect" timing control and crap spark with only a point of octane up your sleeve - it's going to be fraught.
Is it possible? Yes, I'm sure it is. Is it going to be costly to make reliable- certainly.
I'm sure for less than $1K you could make it show boost on a gauge and make a bit more power. However, it would take far more than $1K to make the package reliable or drivable. Even finding a small enough turbo isn't easy - Charade being one option, or Toyota CT12 from a 1GGTE being another.
IMHO, the best way to turbo a 1.0 is to put a 660cc turbo in it. Mine was $1200 and came with a whole car attached to it, a very late model (1997) K6A (all alloy) was recently purchased complete, with a full loom, radiator and fan for $1200=shipping from NZ and a cappuccino front cut runs about $2K, but has a difficult to work with gearbox, although it can work.
Of course, there's wiring, a fuel tank/pump etc, VSS dash mods, exhaust, and other stuff to go with the bare engine cost, but you're dealing with all of that with the 1.0 turbo anyway, even if you keep it carby, however, at least the 660 drops in on stock 1.0 mounts.
That's my 2C. I put about 3000km on my 1.0 motor and for what it was they are pretty good, but I'd never bother trying to boost one.
PS - don't get hung up on the parts you need - sure, a CT12 turbo is fairly cheap, and you have a manifold flange. all the heartache is in getting the tuning right. You really really don't want a car that's a dog to drive, overheats unless it's under 20˚ or you're doing over 60km/h, needs such cold plugs it won't start in the morning, or has to run octane booster and 98 octane to not ping its guts out. This is the hard part of a turbo conversion on an old, low tech motor - not the hard parts like turbos and manifolds.
Steve.
[quote="greg"] some say he is a man without happy dreams, or that he sees silver linings on clouds and wonders why they are not platinum... all we know, is he's called the stevie.[/quote]
im keen, but not sure how to do itchpd80 wrote:You havent got the turbo bug now from my members thread have ya,
Do it man, may be able to use a fair bit of swift turbo stuff, Give us a hoy if you need a hand with it.
thanks for the info steve
1993 Gq lwb with added xtra's :) sold
fj60,lifted,35s,33s for daily, 3f power!
fj60,lifted,35s,33s for daily, 3f power!
If you're still keen, do lots and lots lots of reading and research about timing control with boosted motors. The ignition is going to need lots of work to work with boost.
If you want to stay carby, look at a draw through- turbo after the carby - that will mean you don't can't run an intercooler, but the cooling effect of the air/fuel mix being compressed should eliminate the need for one. I'm pretty sure you won't really want to run a blow off valve with a draw through turbo either - you'll be venting air fuel mixture - perfectly explosive- into the engine bay.
You'll also want to know your current motor is in really good condition. If it's got blow by now, it's going to have LOTS of blow by under boost.
Unless you tune the motor on a dyno, you'll at the very least want access to a wideband O2 sensor - These can be bought for around $500, and with a carby setup, you might want to own rather than borrow one. If it comes out of tune you're going to melt it.
Really though, it's all about getting the ignition power and timing curve right. It won't be easy. You currently have points ignition and a mechanical advance. Mechanical advance is exactly NOT want you want under boost.
You can try starting with a 1.3 dizzy, but you might want to look at locking out the vaccum advance and adding a ignition module that allows a curve to be programmed.
Just some ideas.
Remember, running and showing boost on a gauge does not equal a successful conversion.
I'm really really not being negative- reliable carby turbo petrol motors are almost impossible to find, never mind starting on a 25 year old, 36 Kw motor.
PS might be worth investigating the AMR300(?) supercharger used on Subaru 660cc motors and trying that as a draw through, so long as that kind of turbo can deal with compressing air/fuel, not just air.
At least superchargers have a linear delivery, so should be easier to tune the distributor for (?)
Steve.
If you want to stay carby, look at a draw through- turbo after the carby - that will mean you don't can't run an intercooler, but the cooling effect of the air/fuel mix being compressed should eliminate the need for one. I'm pretty sure you won't really want to run a blow off valve with a draw through turbo either - you'll be venting air fuel mixture - perfectly explosive- into the engine bay.
You'll also want to know your current motor is in really good condition. If it's got blow by now, it's going to have LOTS of blow by under boost.
Unless you tune the motor on a dyno, you'll at the very least want access to a wideband O2 sensor - These can be bought for around $500, and with a carby setup, you might want to own rather than borrow one. If it comes out of tune you're going to melt it.
Really though, it's all about getting the ignition power and timing curve right. It won't be easy. You currently have points ignition and a mechanical advance. Mechanical advance is exactly NOT want you want under boost.
You can try starting with a 1.3 dizzy, but you might want to look at locking out the vaccum advance and adding a ignition module that allows a curve to be programmed.
Just some ideas.
Remember, running and showing boost on a gauge does not equal a successful conversion.
I'm really really not being negative- reliable carby turbo petrol motors are almost impossible to find, never mind starting on a 25 year old, 36 Kw motor.
PS might be worth investigating the AMR300(?) supercharger used on Subaru 660cc motors and trying that as a draw through, so long as that kind of turbo can deal with compressing air/fuel, not just air.
At least superchargers have a linear delivery, so should be easier to tune the distributor for (?)
Steve.
Last edited by Gwagensteve on Wed Apr 22, 2009 7:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
[quote="greg"] some say he is a man without happy dreams, or that he sees silver linings on clouds and wonders why they are not platinum... all we know, is he's called the stevie.[/quote]
i'll 2nd that.. Ist very hard to maintain reliable fuel mixtures going between vac and boost and at varied loads.
Ive never tried it on a suzuki motor however I spent months and thousands of dollars tring to do it on a datsun 2lt before ending up with injection and electronic ignition.
Ive never tried it on a suzuki motor however I spent months and thousands of dollars tring to do it on a datsun 2lt before ending up with injection and electronic ignition.
85 high roof 1.3, 6.5 tc, air lockers,ruf and 34 swampers. yep its an ugly pos.
would this type of charger be allright?
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/AISIN-SUPERCHARG ... 240%3A1318
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/AISIN-SUPERCHARG ... 240%3A1318
1993 Gq lwb with added xtra's :) sold
fj60,lifted,35s,33s for daily, 3f power!
fj60,lifted,35s,33s for daily, 3f power!
I agree about the no aftermarket parts and crap gearbox.
In themselves, I don't think they are a bad motor but they're not a performance motor so making power out of them is a pointless exercise.
Steve.
In themselves, I don't think they are a bad motor but they're not a performance motor so making power out of them is a pointless exercise.
Steve.
[quote="greg"] some say he is a man without happy dreams, or that he sees silver linings on clouds and wonders why they are not platinum... all we know, is he's called the stevie.[/quote]
A) do a search. Christover has done and well documented the 1.3 into 1.0 swap. It's quite a big job.
B) Yes, a 1.3 will require engineering (not hard) , but a 1.0 turbo/supercharged would NEVER be legal.
C)The 1.3 has a massively better gearbox/clutch. a 1.6 clutch is eleventy times better than the 1.3 clutch. If you are going to go down that road, go 1.6 engine and vitara gearbox. You'll almost double your torque. Doing that with a turbo 1.0 would be very hard.
I'ts no harder to put a 1.6 in a 1.0 than a 1.3. that's the engine you want.
Steve.
B) Yes, a 1.3 will require engineering (not hard) , but a 1.0 turbo/supercharged would NEVER be legal.
C)The 1.3 has a massively better gearbox/clutch. a 1.6 clutch is eleventy times better than the 1.3 clutch. If you are going to go down that road, go 1.6 engine and vitara gearbox. You'll almost double your torque. Doing that with a turbo 1.0 would be very hard.
I'ts no harder to put a 1.6 in a 1.0 than a 1.3. that's the engine you want.
Steve.
[quote="greg"] some say he is a man without happy dreams, or that he sees silver linings on clouds and wonders why they are not platinum... all we know, is he's called the stevie.[/quote]
Posts: 172
Joined: Sat Jul 10, 2004 6:47 pm
Joined: Sat Jul 10, 2004 6:47 pm
Location: sitting on the back seat of the bus licking your sisters hairy minge
I beg to differ mrrocky. Suzuki made a performance version of this engine in a car called a SC100. it had a larger carb higher compression and wasn't ghay.mrRocky wrote:1ltrs just plain suck and are ghay motors that dont rev, come with shittty gearboxs, no aftermarket parts. If you want something different pick a better motor and swap it over.
Engine: 47 bhp at 5,000 rpm; 62lb/ft torque at 2,800 rpm. for a 1 litre engine made in 1979 in the factory thats pretty good.
source:-
http://www.suzuki-sc100.demon.co.uk/
so best bet is a SU carby, increase compresion, good cam and that will increase your power first.
Turboing the engine is TONS OF WORK too.
[quote="sheps"]
When was the last time you correctly spelled a motor into a car? The people that should stay away from spanners are pedantic English teachers & keyboard spelling nazi's.[/quote]
When was the last time you correctly spelled a motor into a car? The people that should stay away from spanners are pedantic English teachers & keyboard spelling nazi's.[/quote]
I looked at various options for the 1.0 before deciding to swap it. There was a turbo kit developed many years ago in the UK but even that wasn't that great imho. There was someone from W.A. selling a supercharger setup for one last year on ebay. They hadn't fully sorted it and it was their second attempt that I know of.
If you don't want to swap it then these mods can make a difference. Extractors, exhaust, cam regrind, an additional spacer between the carb and manifold and a 1.3 distributor. The compression ratio could also be raised a bit too.
Don't forget to gear it properly too and the 5 speed conversion is really only beneficial if you're doing lots of highway km's
If you don't want to swap it then these mods can make a difference. Extractors, exhaust, cam regrind, an additional spacer between the carb and manifold and a 1.3 distributor. The compression ratio could also be raised a bit too.
Don't forget to gear it properly too and the 5 speed conversion is really only beneficial if you're doing lots of highway km's
[quote="4WD Stuff"]
I haven't quoted Grimbo because nobody takes him seriously :finger: :finger: :finger: :finger: [/quote]
I haven't quoted Grimbo because nobody takes him seriously :finger: :finger: :finger: :finger: [/quote]
Posts: 912
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2004 6:29 pm
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2004 6:29 pm
Location: {Sydney, Australia or Rio, Brazil Ride: Sierra JXi}
or just a single CV motorcycle carb from a big V-twincj wrote:Some have also had good results from swapping in an SU carb too.
All the rage in the states for 1.3l, and you already have a side-draft manifold.
-[b]Santos[/b][img]http://www.teamswift.net/images/smilies/icon_furious.gif[/img]
Suzuki, Jeep & Toyota Soft tops with welded seams for SALE (PM me)
Suzuki, Jeep & Toyota Soft tops with welded seams for SALE (PM me)
Well this may help or hinder i don't quite know but your dream has come true a fully prepped and goin 1ltr turdbo kit fresh from Ebay!!!
What a winner
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/suzuki-sierra-1L ... 240%3A1318
Looks quite successful don't you think
No not being a sm4rtarse thats an obvious example of somebodys $1500.00 gone up in smoke..
I would suggest you grab an old barina/swift motor from a Upullit type wreckers (i payed $89) and convert the cam and dizzy drive to sierra with bits from a blown sierra motor($300 on the outside with gaskets and an old motor) grab a second hand gear box ($100) and a clutch(80-160 depending where u get it ) You could have a 1.3 sierra with a 5 speed for around $800 installed if you put in the work youself...
You could save alot of time and pain if you ask these guys for help
P.s. A g13a motor that was released in the barina and swifts series 1 ( these are old now) had the same dizzzy drive, water pump and quite similar cam (engine mounts and flywheel aside this is almost a bolt in)
$200 at Jollys u pullit in dandenong in melbourne (including alt, dizzy and carby)
Do some research on the forum some of the guys are wizzards with this conversion
ONLY my 2c worth please feel free to correct me Guys!
What a winner
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/suzuki-sierra-1L ... 240%3A1318
Looks quite successful don't you think
No not being a sm4rtarse thats an obvious example of somebodys $1500.00 gone up in smoke..
I would suggest you grab an old barina/swift motor from a Upullit type wreckers (i payed $89) and convert the cam and dizzy drive to sierra with bits from a blown sierra motor($300 on the outside with gaskets and an old motor) grab a second hand gear box ($100) and a clutch(80-160 depending where u get it ) You could have a 1.3 sierra with a 5 speed for around $800 installed if you put in the work youself...
You could save alot of time and pain if you ask these guys for help
P.s. A g13a motor that was released in the barina and swifts series 1 ( these are old now) had the same dizzzy drive, water pump and quite similar cam (engine mounts and flywheel aside this is almost a bolt in)
$200 at Jollys u pullit in dandenong in melbourne (including alt, dizzy and carby)
Do some research on the forum some of the guys are wizzards with this conversion
ONLY my 2c worth please feel free to correct me Guys!
adam you are in luck as i have a spare sierra angle drive and camshaft "i think" floating around at home if you want it.
I think i also have the dizzy cap and rotor if you want that too.
I think i also have the dizzy cap and rotor if you want that too.
Work - KPD4X4.COM - KPD Industries Australian Distributor of Diesel Power Modules - Germany.
Play - dank's zook
Play - dank's zook
how much dank, im sorta battling pretty hard without a job, i will pm youdank wrote:adam you are in luck as i have a spare sierra angle drive and camshaft "i think" floating around at home if you want it.
I think i also have the dizzy cap and rotor if you want that too.
1993 Gq lwb with added xtra's :) sold
fj60,lifted,35s,33s for daily, 3f power!
fj60,lifted,35s,33s for daily, 3f power!
Mine reved plentymrRocky wrote:1ltrs just plain suck and are ghay motors that dont rev, come with shittty gearboxs, no aftermarket parts. If you want something different pick a better motor and swap it over.
They are a Revy motor, they wont rev if your running bigger tyres and no after market gearing, they just dont have enough to get it up to the sweet spot.
Why do you think they dont put Tacho's in 1ltrs,
You dont want to know what there reving at
Mock
My photographic Art http://www.redbubble.com/people/ljxtreem
www.dirtcomp.com.au
Sierrajim wrote:
So hurry up, come back, buy a Lada (can't believe i just said that) and we'll go wheelin'.
www.dirtcomp.com.au
Sierrajim wrote:
So hurry up, come back, buy a Lada (can't believe i just said that) and we'll go wheelin'.
mrRocky
Posted: Wed Apr 22, 2009 10:21 pm
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1ltrs just plain suck and are ghay motors that dont rev, come with shittty gearboxs, no aftermarket parts. If you want something different pick a better motor and swap it over.
Crusing at 5000 rpm at 110kmh, doing 7500rpm (not nessesary but sounds cool) up sand dunes is deemed as very revvy. I got a lumpy cam for so they do have after market parts. 1ltrs do burn outs with 235 75 r15 MTR's Ive proved it
Sorry mate but I think you found some 1ltr lovers I know i am.
Posted: Wed Apr 22, 2009 10:21 pm
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1ltrs just plain suck and are ghay motors that dont rev, come with shittty gearboxs, no aftermarket parts. If you want something different pick a better motor and swap it over.
Crusing at 5000 rpm at 110kmh, doing 7500rpm (not nessesary but sounds cool) up sand dunes is deemed as very revvy. I got a lumpy cam for so they do have after market parts. 1ltrs do burn outs with 235 75 r15 MTR's Ive proved it
Sorry mate but I think you found some 1ltr lovers I know i am.
Posts: 912
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2004 6:29 pm
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2004 6:29 pm
Location: {Sydney, Australia or Rio, Brazil Ride: Sierra JXi}
Posts: 172
Joined: Sat Jul 10, 2004 6:47 pm
Joined: Sat Jul 10, 2004 6:47 pm
Location: sitting on the back seat of the bus licking your sisters hairy minge
Many engines rev hard. If it is able to breathe engines will just keep revving until the valve bounce/disentagrate/or run out of air.mrRocky wrote:either you have your tacho hooked up wrong or you cant read cause 1ltr motors dont rev to 7500rpm, and any car can do a burnout in a puddle of oil. 30kw of 1ltr power cannot do one on bitumen under its own steam.
maybe you have 235 R12's on there
I revved my swift with g13 engine out to 8500 regulary ( 75kph in first gear 130 in second gear) cause I didn't care about it. in the end it would only do 8000 as it was starting to die.
Mr rocky please understand not everyone gets on here blowing their own trumpet about how good they are. They talk from personal experince and are not lying.
If you have nothing of value to add rather than just shooting people down with insults then why bother.....
[quote="sheps"]
When was the last time you correctly spelled a motor into a car? The people that should stay away from spanners are pedantic English teachers & keyboard spelling nazi's.[/quote]
When was the last time you correctly spelled a motor into a car? The people that should stay away from spanners are pedantic English teachers & keyboard spelling nazi's.[/quote]
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