Military tyre chains

[Santos]

Has anyone run heavy duy tyre trains when wheeling for traction?

i know most people think of snow chains but they are useful in mud (and possibly dig in for cgrip on other surfurces?)

What sparked his idea is i run stockies and was trying to thinking outside the box.

That and i was thinking about buying some snow chains or making a custom set. been searching the web and the most basic design resembles a chain ladder, the next step is zigzaging the chain then:


then he full blown diagonal crosshatch



i think repoducing the third one wouldnt be to hard but not sure how i would link the chain ( i was thining caribiners for the 1st and 2nd options to test it out)

Also i know `nada`about chain, i guess i would need something that wont rust, durable and generally longer than its width

any insight would be apprecited

just while i was searching for an image i came across this CHain Tread!

now if only i could get a smaller scale

[cj]

That would be a real big NO due to damage to tracks and it might cost you some $$ to if caught using them in some areas I believe.

[Zook_Fan]

That would be a real big NO due to damage to tracks and it might cost you some $$ to if caught using them in some areas I believe.

x2. Four wheel drivers are constantly getting shut out of areas because we are harming the tracks and the environment. Chains would kill an environment from just one user.

[Santos]

enviomental objection aside, would it get me out of strife?

(no i wasnt thinking about runnng them 100% of the time)

[ofr57]

I've seen similar chain setups for mine trucks

[PJ.zook]

Chains will get you out of almost anything grip wise if thats what youre asking.

[ajsr]

I use chains on four cherry pickers I have. they are used in paddocks in up to four to five inches of mud and you can not get traction on the the bear claw tyres that they run for summer. the only thing you can get that will give better traction is tracks.They are nearly unbeatable and self clean a treat as the mud just shakes off.

I can't see why they would be illegal (im nearly sure its perfectly legal) as there is virtually no wheel spin with chains. No one should have a problem with you running them as you nearly cannot wreck a track with chains on.

Ive seen a 2wd hilux with chains out drive a 4wd version in the same paddock.

the trick would be to buy chains that fit your tyres and then add to them or modify them from there.

[mike_nofx]

I reckon they would suck on rock tho!

But some real tyres you cheapskate... hahah seriously who still runs stockies on a 4x4 that actually goes off-road?

[Santos]

Don`t get me wrong, if enough people vouch for the path of destruction it leaves with first hand exerience then i will leave it for last resort but spraying mud everywhere, skidding and sliding across, endlessly sticking rocks and debris under tyres for traction with my sumitomo all-terraincould have a similar effect.

A pair of good chains made in austria and germany seem to pretty expensive and the few charts i see don`t really have anything for 205/70/15 profile, most tart at 235/70, havent looked at larger pssenger vehicle tyres though. To make a simple ladder or zigzag chain i would only need like 10m, i dunno $50-$100 bucks? add some d-clips...to quote jeremy clarkson.. `how hard could it be`

ofr157: i am pretty sure that what that tyre is from, check out the guy in the bckground with

pj.zook/ajsr:
what i was hoping to hear,
i figured it may be a little old school and had been trying to work out why they went out of fashion.

[Santos]

I reckon they would suck on rock tho!

But some real tyres you cheapskate... hahah seriously who still runs stockies on a 4x4 that actually goes off-road?

me

its 90% daily driver, and when you work out the added fuel consumption, longer stopping distances and other drawbacks of larger tyres its not that stupid

(i also proudly still sport my swaybar )

do agree on the rock, but i feel off-roading and EXTREME-rockcrawling are two distinct things, i see countless videos and shots of people mounting rocks and obsticles for the sake of it, rather than driving around it. not into it but i appreciate
shots of zooks riding up rockfaces, getting traction on the lip and pulling itself up.

[ajsr]

you will get them for a 205 75 15 tyre, any good tyre retailer should be able to help you.They may not be as large as you want on that tyre size but you can add bigger chain sections to them to beef then up. when I have to run my machinery in real narrow areas I use 2wd hilux wheels with 185 75 14's they are only a small chain but but wow its amazing where little chain will get you.

[grimbo]

as CJ said I think you'll find it is a no for use. The damage they will cause is not worth it. Turn around if you think you are going to be in a situation where you think chains is a good idea. Buy a winch if you are worried about getting stuck or air your tyres down

I have followed a group of 4wds which were basically stock vehicles all running chains in some slippery tracks. They absolutely destroyed the track when all they had to do was turn around and go a different way.

I also hate chains in the snow too. All it odes is dig you down deeper until you find the solid bottom or you diff out which occurs about 9 times out of 10.

[Gwagensteve]

There's plenty of wheelspin with chains.

Yes, they do work.
Yes they are VERY destructive.

They're also not good in every situation. On a muddy paddock, they'd rule. In a track with some mud, some tree roots, and some rock coming through (like most tracks) they aren't all they're cracked up to be.

I've also seen chains used in mud loosen off (possibly due to lower tyre pressures - obviously you can't run low tyre pressures with chains) and cause lots of vehicle damage.

I have seen them used firsthand. IMHO just get some decent tyres. a better outcome in the long run.

I don't even use chains in snow. I sure wouldn't be using them on a track.

Steve.

[Highway-Star]

IMHO just get some decent tyres. a better outcome in the long run.

What decent tyre can be had in a 205/70/15 ?

[spamwell]

http://www.maxxis.com/AutomobileLight-T ... eries.aspx i had these in a 235 and they where quite good.

[Jock]

We used to run heavy duty ladder chains for mud racing on two wheel drives with locked diffs

There were UNBEATABLE in mud, useless in rock, and pretty scary at speed.

Imagine steel on rock, there is no grip.
Imagine if one link breaks then you have one piece flapping about wildly doing NASTY damage to the inside of your gaurds, brake lines etc etc etc


Also imagine the tyre spinning at speed then hitting the ground with chains, instant stop, so all that rotating mass is stopped suddenly and causing MASSIVE loads inside on cvs, axles unis

BEFORE you go any further with this try getting some 20mm rope and wrap that around your wheels and see what that does for grip. Cheaper, but doesn't last s long.

or just get some 215/75R15 tyres in a AT, they come up on here all the time cheap enough

[hillbilliywheelchair]

IMHO just get some decent tyres. a better outcome in the long run.

What decent tyre can be had in a 205/70/15 ?

brigstone vm104 i tink ill check
or sumoto u/l lug radial these things look like tractor tyres (and road legal)
or theirs a good hand cook but unsure of its name

[Santos]

what sort a speeds where you doin jock? i wasnt really thinking of doing highspeed (but then again as snow chain i might) anyone know what chains are llike in the sand (from experience)


looked at my tyres and they are sumitomo htr t4, a touring tyre, they have heaps even after nearly 5 years use on sand dirt and tar. when i bought it the owner had put to new rears for rego, so one off the first things i did waas buy 2 fronts so the tread match (rotate the tyres blah blah)

i checked the sumitomo website and couldnt find the tractor tyres and the only bridgestones on the aus site for stock profile where 684 and 694 a/t.

like i said earlier there are drawbacks to having larger tyres, maybe if i get hold of some wider alloys to offset the weight, i really wouldnt run 225/70 or 215/75 on a stock rim. it can fit but not ideal

the other issues is why invest in a tyre whos task is only fullfielled once every 4-6months. i get away with lowering the tyre pressure on most things, but i`ve been thinking about crossing the desert and exploring the west coast, also `when i get roundto going with the ouer crew'

[cj]

High speeds and chains don't go together.

Chains are no good in sand. Sand has no adhesion and requires compaction to drive on so a shallow tread tends to work well like an A/T although M/T's can work fine too if aired down appropriately.

Chains for use in the snow should be reserved for use on icy roads. Snow sticks best to more snow and although A/T's will work I personally have found M/T's to work better. I haven't tried Swampers or ET's etc in the snow yet so can't comment on them although with a bit of luck that should change shortly.

I don't get why you're thinking about wider alloys. Depending on the alloys and the steels, the difference in weight may not be as much as you think and if you're going wider with the alloys there is the potential for some alloys to actually be heavier than a narrow steel rim. 215's are good for 5.5"-7" wide rims and 225's & 235's are good for 6"- 7" wide rims from a legal standpoint. A/T's are fine to drive on daily and to be honest a good M/T isn't that bad either.

Forget about chains and at least get some decent A/T's, air them down to suit the terrain and avoid driving where you need a more aggressive tyre. If you can't then get a winch. As for driving offroad with H/T's, they aren't called HIGHWAY tyres for no reason

[Jaffa]

Ive seen chains used offroad, it was about 20 years ago before muddies were common or tread lightly had been thought about, they worked extemely well on clay, but really chewwed up the track, one of the cars threw a chain at full noise and it really buggered up the inner guard.

I used to make chains (mud and snow) at Piranha Offroad, the cross links arent just standard chain, I dont know the specifics but they are case hardened and near impossible to cut. I really wouldnt run "standard" chain as scoss links in a set of snow/mud chains, its just asking for trouble.

IMO the only place that chains have a legitimate use is at slow speed on an ice covered bitumen road to break up the ice, not as a traction aid.

[Santos]

CJi get what your saying, i really do.
your explenation of h/t may very well be why i am so happy with my stock sumitomos

when i get the next set of tyres i may upgrade to the bridgestone all-terrains but $500-600 at the moment can be spent on other listed things p/s,winch (plus alt&bat), endless -air,engine etc

as grimbo says i can turn around or find another route, i am the sort of person to, but i am also aware that i could be halfway up a track and out for several days and the route back may have changed because of weather conditions.

i am collecting the information, gathering the experience, weighing it up, i want to work a season in the snow, see where it else works, where it doesnt, the benifits (like it fitting in a sack under the hood) So many there are many factors for me to pursue this ( i brush on a few but dont go in to detail or explain it fully)


if ssome irresponsible wanker gets his info and goes cowboy then he is no differen then the same cowboys who look in the other suzuki threads.

i am leaning towards getting a set, for my `rig`it sems like an ideal option, why it works why it doesnt, jaffras coment is why was asking about the chain itself,
other thing like the damage it can cause if you are wreckless with it. I dont wqant it for mud racing, i dont want it for burnouts, i dont want it to cut 30mins of my drive time, i dont want them to create the latest craze on youtube. Who here carries a first ade kit daily in their car? i do. i like to be self-relient and have no shame asking for help when i need it.


i really dont want to go a 215 tyre, its not a question of legality, i think it safe to say everyone on this thread has at least one questionable mod or other
i know is 205 will be more ridged on a stock rim (which is why mentioned wider allows) and is better for highspeed cornering and wet condiions on zee tarmac.
i am aware we a re talking 1cm width difference.

some may think its stupid, i am big enough not to be bothered by that, everyone has their own car and if there happy or dont think think these things count in consideration, then thats their opinion

it is nice to get off the endless `how do i lift? how do i toyo diff?`though isn`it)

(none of this is directed at cj, just sort of a general

[The Prophet]

Will i get busted by the ranger for having them on my unicycle?

[lump_a_charcoal]

You shouldn't need a chain, isn't your unicycle diff locked?

[Jock]

what sort a speeds where you doin jock?

Up to 80 kph :-)

But the car was very drifty as the car was just riding on steel on a hard dry clay road.

Sand chains will work BUT they will work like sand paddles. You need huge horsepower and millions of RPM to get them to work or you just dig a hole and stay there. So basically in sand with chains you will move about three metres a day Most of that down.....

If you want to work in the snow for a season get some M&S rated tyres ( mud and snow) Simple. Tyres aren't just a one of purchase. Thousands of different things are considered in every design of tyre design

If you are worried about different tyre widths and such forth go wider but not taller. 215/65R15 225/60R15 tyres. look around you can get heaps of different ones.

Snow would be best with a snow tytre that will explode in the australian outback cause it isn't designed for that tempurature. You are worried about rim design wodth but don't care about tyre design overall????

Tyres are more than balck things which hold the car up....

and chains for a standard tyre would be pretty useless. you worry about weight then will slap 20 kilos of chain onto the rim when you are punishing the car the hardest three days up a track with no return. HHow much clearance do you have between the tyre and the springs?? is there enough room for a chain? or for a chain which has come loose?