When will the first KOH style event be here in Australia?

[SIM79]

When will the first KOH style event be here in Australia? Is there any plans in works or will it be to hard to organise?

[big38l]

I know there has been plenty of discussion about it but the lack of funds is a major issue! A lot of money involved in getting it up and running! Dave Camp was talking to me and throwing around ideas of the possibility. Believe me, if it gets up and running i'd love to give it a go! Actually i'd like to see alot of the rockcrawling events back on the calender here!!

Maybe if a few people are willing to get together and organise etc it might happen, it is alot of work though.

[napsta]

I'm still keen to make this happen, little bit busy right now, but once things calm down I will be investigating it further. I'm hoping to bring my KOH car to Aus next winter, and I'll be wanting to race it against someone!

[POS]

Not to put a downer on things, but i can't see it happening solely due to the lack of terrain like johnson valley here in OZ.

Maybe somewhere like Mannar would be a OK place but it would be nothing like the hammers.

I would be saving my $$$ for a trip to the states.

[1MadEngineer]

Not to put a downer on things, but i can't see it happening solely due to the lack of terrain like johnson valley here in OZ.

Maybe somewhere like Mannar would be a OK place but it would be nothing like the hammers.

I would be saving my $$$ for a trip to the states.

We have chatted to MMM (sorta) about this. Manar is ideal! some of the areas we found years ago would be ideal for technical stages and the enduro tracks with the jumps would be ideal for the speed stages. The biggest problem is getting competitors IMO. Honestly list the guys that would ACTUALLY make the effort to turn up? regardless of prize money. And who would bring a vehicle that could take the punishment. There are a few teams i con think of that would do extremely well, but i don't think they would show.

The other place would be the TT site at milbrodale, as it has an offroad racing course side-by-side with the TT stuff. This would be mad to watch! some rigs blasting over the jumps, then crawling through the devils marballs or up rocky horror.

thoughts????
I would gladly setup and run an event ot Manar, but we would need some commitment from a few drivers. Hopefully a group of us are going up there nov/dec to map out a course, anyone interested let me know. My initial thoughts would be to have the first event - sorta invitational only depending on response.

[bru21]

Good idea.

Manar is a dual purpose park - it would get dangerous to gps drive a dual use park - but I am sure they can get around that.

[1MadEngineer]

Good idea.

Manar is a dual purpose park - it would get dangerous to gps drive a dual use park - but I am sure they can get around that.

This is one of the BIG advantages out there! Speaking to Dave the owner ages ago, he suggested we could 'use' the whole bike/enduro side for a 1day event if required. This would work great as there is ~100km of 1way enduro loops on 1side of the property, and there are at least 4 areas that i can remember that would challenge any buggy/winch truck.

POS and i found some wicked terrain out there, definately some of the best terrain I have ever seen.

[bru21]

The terrain is awesome - its very tight in places though.

The motorcross track would be a laugh in a buggy.

I'm all for this event - not that I will compete anymore with the change in direction i have made with my junk

[RUFF]

Not to put a downer on things, but i can't see it happening solely due to the lack of terrain like johnson valley here in OZ.

Maybe somewhere like Mannar would be a OK place but it would be nothing like the hammers.

I would be saving my $$$ for a trip to the states.

We have chatted to MMM (sorta) about this. Manar is ideal! some of the areas we found years ago would be ideal for technical stages and the enduro tracks with the jumps would be ideal for the speed stages. The biggest problem is getting competitors IMO. Honestly list the guys that would ACTUALLY make the effort to turn up? regardless of prize money. And who would bring a vehicle that could take the punishment. There are a few teams i con think of that would do extremely well, but i don't think they would show.

The other place would be the TT site at milbrodale, as it has an offroad racing course side-by-side with the TT stuff. This would be mad to watch! some rigs blasting over the jumps, then crawling through the devils marballs or up rocky horror.

thoughts????
I would gladly setup and run an event ot Manar, but we would need some commitment from a few drivers. Hopefully a group of us are going up there nov/dec to map out a course, anyone interested let me know. My initial thoughts would be to have the first event - sorta invitational only depending on response.

You really do need to visit the Hammers Greg to have any appreciation of how much area and how hard this terrain is on vehicles. I am yet to see any area in Aus that would even have me concidering building a vehicle for this event.

If the TTC site was 20 times the size it is with 20 times the terrain it has it still wouldnt come close to what is offered at KOH. And as has allways been the case Manar is way to far from Civilization to make it worth the effort. You just will not get spectators other than supporters of the competitors. This isnt an event you want to run and loose money on. Even the first time.

Trust me. Ive allready put a lot of time and effort into setting up a KOH style event here in Aus. I have even gone as far as a set of rules and vehicle specs to suit the vehicles we have here in Aus allready. I just can not find a site that could do this style of event justice.

[1MadEngineer]

You really do need to visit the Hammers Greg to have any appreciation of how much area and how hard this terrain is on vehicles. I am yet to see any area in Aus that would even have me concidering building a vehicle for this event.

If the TTC site was 20 times the size it is with 20 times the terrain it has it still wouldnt come close to what is offered at KOH. And as has allways been the case Manar is way to far from Civilization to make it worth the effort. You just will not get spectators other than supporters of the competitors. This isnt an event you want to run and loose money on. Even the first time.

Trust me. Ive allready put a lot of time and effort into setting up a KOH style event here in Aus. I have even gone as far as a set of rules and vehicle specs to suit the vehicles we have here in Aus allready. I just can not find a site that could do this style of event justice.

You are very right! but no point as its all too hard. who would enter?

[RUFF]

You really do need to visit the Hammers Greg to have any appreciation of how much area and how hard this terrain is on vehicles. I am yet to see any area in Aus that would even have me concidering building a vehicle for this event.

If the TTC site was 20 times the size it is with 20 times the terrain it has it still wouldnt come close to what is offered at KOH. And as has allways been the case Manar is way to far from Civilization to make it worth the effort. You just will not get spectators other than supporters of the competitors. This isnt an event you want to run and loose money on. Even the first time.

Trust me. Ive allready put a lot of time and effort into setting up a KOH style event here in Aus. I have even gone as far as a set of rules and vehicle specs to suit the vehicles we have here in Aus allready. I just can not find a site that could do this style of event justice.

You are very right! but no point as its all too hard. who would enter?

Not me. sounds too hard. I might break something

[SIM79]

I have even gone as far as a set of rules and vehicle specs to suit the vehicles we have here in Aus allready.

Why? Hammer rules are great, no tyre size limits, no horse power limits.

Where is Manar?

[RUFF]

I have even gone as far as a set of rules and vehicle specs to suit the vehicles we have here in Aus allready.

Why? Hammer rules are great, no tyre size limits, no horse power limits.

Where is Manar?

Because in Aus we dont have hundreds of Buggies being driven around every day. In Aus it would be impossible to do without a set of rules. We would end up with a couple of vehicles turning up and heaps sitting back saying they can not compete against the ones that have turned up. Tuff Truck has an event with no tyre size limits and no engine size limits. They have struggled every year to get a complete field.

I would imagine to run this event you would need to run more than one class here in Aus. Or your going to be sure to do your ass.

[RUFF]

Manar is approx 5hrs going by google maps NW of Brisbane.

[napsta]

Build it and they will come (hopefully!!)

KOH started with just a few guys...

It doesn't have to be modelled exactly off KOH. The right coast qualifier was completely different terrain and still a great race by all accounts.

Keep me up to date. I'm trying to convince a few others from over there to come visit, so maybe we could make this work. I'm trying for Finke, and maybe Cliffhanger if there are any spots left / enough buggies to run a class / any money left after KOH

[POS]

Ok, I have a place here in WA that is identical to Johnson Valley.

I have sponsors already keen and TV and media are all excited to, i have shown them the KOH Vids.

So now all i need is a list of competitors -

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P.S i bet my left ball that by Monday the above spaces are not filled.

P.P.S Like i said earlier, save your pennys and go to KOH next year.

Or better still do what Napsta has done and offer free blowies from his NAV for a free ride.

[POS]

The motorcross track would be a laugh in a buggy.

Did it in a Truggy does that count?

[Micka]

Ok, I have a place here in WA that is identical to Johnson Valley.

I have sponsors already keen and TV and media are all excited to, i have shown them the KOH Vids.

So now all i need is a list of competitors -

1. Pete Antunac - Event winner.
2. Adrian Berthelsen - bridesmaid.
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P.S i bet my left ball that by Monday the above spaces are not filled.

P.P.S Like i said earlier, save your pennys and go to KOH next year.

Or better still do what Napsta has done and offer free blowies from his NAV for a free ride.

[SIM79]

Ok, I have a place here in WA that is identical to Johnson Valley.

I have sponsors already keen and TV and media are all excited to, i have shown them the KOH Vids.

Sounds great. Any pics or more info on this area?

[Micka]

Ok, I have a place here in WA that is identical to Johnson Valley.

I have sponsors already keen and TV and media are all excited to, i have shown them the KOH Vids.

Sounds great. Any pics or more info on this area?

POS is simply making a point, not actually offering to run an event.

[SIM79]

Ok, I have a place here in WA that is identical to Johnson Valley.

I have sponsors already keen and TV and media are all excited to, i have shown them the KOH Vids.

Sounds great. Any pics or more info on this area?

POS is simply making a point, not actually offering to run an event.

I realize that, but wouldn't mind seeing some pics of the area.

[tuf045]

We might not have the hammers here but we have to get something going the sport of rock crawling is dead here, so there should be heaps of buggies lying around doing nothing not to mention the unfinished one's. I do agree with the others that there are lack of competitors due to the cars being built to crawl not race at the moment but once you run 1 there will be a line up the next time.
If you want to get the numbers let winch challenge cars race this is the sort of race I’m shore that most of them will want to race in and after competing at cliffhanger this year I think that some stages are not so different to K.O.H.
If this happens I for one will be there if I can't race I will be an official
Cheers

[bru21]

Some of our trials tracks have sweet terrain, Its no Johnstone valley but I am sure there is enough to keep the guys honest.

Would it kill the event to do it OBC style and have transport stages?

I hate this format personally (way more towing then racing) - but it might be a solution to the lack of stages at one event.

The main problem I see is terrain damage - all the trials properties are owned mainly by non - riders and they are happy as the bike do little damage.

What about LCMP? Even as a starting location - they have OOR tracks already etc

[RUFF]

What about LCMP? Even as a starting location - they have OOR tracks already etc

I had thought of LCMP but the entire park would need to be closed for this event to work. You couldn't use just a section of it as you dont want to double up on sections. This isnt an event you could run in short stages. I imagine the course would need to be at least 75-100k long to make it work.


But in the end this is all just talking shit because i sure as shit dont have the money to give an event like this justice and if i did it would still take a lot of convincing and support from everyone to get me to run it.

[RUFF]

I agrea rockcrawling is dead in Aus. And I personaly can not see it ever getting off the ground again. There has only ever been a few guys that were willing to put their balls on the line to run rock crawling events in Aus and non of them are really that keen to do anything again. And the ones that are can not afford to do it again. Untill someone new steps up with a real plan and a real budget and 100% of the competitors actually support them 100% it will never happen again.

There are a shit load of buggies sitting around collecting dust. There are prob just as many half built collecting dust. But everyone (competitors and supporters) that was involved in what was a great sport is still sitting back expecting someone else to do all the hard work and run an event so they can compete or watch.

Im actually really suprised there isnt a heap of events for buggies because at every event i competed in, ran or spectated there were allways heaps of people running around shit canning everything telling everyone how events should be run and how shit the events were that were currently being run and how much better their events will be. Where are all these people now when the sport needs it most? There all standing back doing exactly the same thing! This sport needs 100% support even when things are not going your way or you think you can do better.

The above was not directed at any one individual but if you are reading into it and think im talking about you then obviously you really need to think about why these events are gone and "if" you may have been part of the reason they are gone.

[1MadEngineer]

We might not have the hammers here but we have to get something going the sport of rock crawling is dead here, so there should be heaps of buggies lying around doing nothing not to mention the unfinished one's. I do agree with the others that there are lack of competitors due to the cars being built to crawl not race at the moment but once you run 1 there will be a line up the next time.

But i think you will find most of them couldn't be bothered to show up! unless its for big prize money. Gone are the days of guys wanting to compete for a $5 trophy and bragging rights. Seriously who would show? who would drive 15-30hrs for FUN. ( I can count them on 1 hand) And who would turn up with a rig that could take 5-12hrs of constant pounding at warp speed?

I would soooooo love to run / compete in this type of event. The reason for consideration of MANAR as a good site, is: terrain, site logistics, park insurance and running costs. Thats why the likes of cliffhanger cost mega bucks to enter. I would gladly put in all the time and effort for free, and make no money at all, keeping the entry fee as low as possible so entered teams can save $$'s. Any serious competitors please pm me, and maybe as a group we could all get this to happen.

If you want to get the numbers let winch challenge cars race this is the sort of race I’m shore that most of them will want to race in and after competing at cliffhanger this year I think that some stages are not so different to K.O.H.

ATM there are 4-5 winch trucks that IMO would spank the buggies in there current form. But for reasons unknown you will never see them compete in anything harder than a winch challenge (there is a thread here - where I mentioned making the courses harder and they all cried). A few of these trucks and teams would be just about unbeatable!

If i get at least 6 interested teams we may run an 'invitational' event.

If this happens I for one will be there if I can't race I will be an official
Cheers

sadly if only others had your enthuisiasm

[bru21]

Greg I for one will be there to drink a couple of quiet beers and perv on the action. Might lend a hand too.

Trials format is such a good method to run events

entry is stuff all $25, there are nothing but 1-3rd trophys (no money), everybody helps setup for events, marks sections, cooks bbqs etc.

They are the nicest crowd of folk joined by a common interest.
There is a rapidly growing thought - "what can I get out of it"
getting around.

YOU GET TO DRIVE YOUR WEAPON AT SPEED / OVER SECTIONS AND HAVE FUN

Seriously what more is needed.

You can get prize money lawn bowling or playing pool, darts etc
Its about the racing, its about the beers afterwards, the sport.

Out of interest what does it cost to run an event?

[tuf045]

bru i couldn't agree more.

YOU GET TO DRIVE YOUR WEAPON AT SPEED / OVER SECTIONS AND HAVE FUN

Seriously what more is needed.



maybe I'm thick but isn't this sport that we do for fun?

1MadEngineer I agree that there would only be a handful of teams at the first event just like any event the first time. word of mouth from experience had by previous competitors is what brings the new competitors in so yes there probably won't be as many winch cars there as there could be but maybe that’s a good thing but I’m shore there will be a long list the second time.

[RUFF]

Out of interest what does it cost to run an event?

The last event I ran at Milbrodale(TTC site) from memory not including lost wages for 2 guys(myself and Bowlsey) from Haultech for a week and a half or accomodation and meals for that week and a half. Was around $8000. So it could have easily been $10,000. We may have made a couple of hundered on this event not including the wages, traveling, accomodation or food. This was still a very basic event but prob the best one to have been run and we defianatly spent a lot more money on this than any other event.

From memory the event at Colo Park cost $4000. We "Just" made our money back on this event. Again not including wages ,traveling,accomodation or food for 2 guys.

Im pretty sure every other event that we ran lost money. And a lot of it.

Its easy to say "but we all should be doing it for fun". From a promotors point of view this only lasts a short time before you realise you are suffereing both financialy and personaly. It needs to be a business and it needs to make money.

I only ever competed for fun. I never gave a shit if i won or lost if there was prize money or not, if there were spectators or not or if the media was going to be there. I built a buggy to have fun in and stop destroying full bodied rigs. I didn't build it to win prize money at every event i went to.

[RUFF]

Here is as close as we have had in Aus to a KOH style event. Its only a very short course but it "should" have attracted the vehicles that would be needed to run this style of event. It has been run 3 years in a row so far-

First year- http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/ftopic918 ... ght=canyon 7 vehicles turned up.

Second Year- http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/ftopic108 ... ght=canyon 6 Vehicles Turned up.

Third year- http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/ftopic150129-0-asc-0.php 3 Vehicles turned up.

Now this event was not open to Buggies. But i imagine had enough intrest been shown i beleive they would have opened a class for them.