High Flow CT26 Fitted to 1HD-FT dyno results

[CustomTurbos]

EDITED to include grapgh and more info*

OK, well my "low end response" version of the CT26 upgrade was fitted to a 1HD-FT spec'd for having an inter heater installed on it (yes, another poorly implemented top mount - this one didnt even have the bonnet holes lining up with the cooler at all....).

SO the trim on this turbo is such that its not all about power, but rather response.

UGOTNUFN on this site did the tune. He had recently tuned a 1HDFT with safari cooler to about the best result I've ever seen last week and the comparison of the two is interesting.

Below is before and after for the 1HD-FT done on an interia dyno - so low end only shows transient response - you can see the huige improvement.

When loaded at 1500rpm, the clutch wouldnt hold, so its more than 550nm @ my estimation. When loaded at 3000rpm, it put down 131rwkW

Dashed line = Before
Solid Line = after

Red = Corrected flywheel torque
Green = power in kW @ wheel
Blue = Corrected flywheel power in kW
Dark Blue - my hand written attempt to show where the low end torque is when loaded up - its prodigous

[UGOTNUFN]

This upgrade is the only way to go with the Toyota factory turbo
Combos, simple bolt off and on, basic tuning and your done!

Boost response comparison.
http://m433.photobucket.com/albumview/a ... lhQHgF4%3D" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Dash line is STD boost curve , dotted line is CustomTurbos turbo fitted with no adjustment ,solid line is after tune and boost adjustment.
http://m433.photobucket.com/albumview/a ... lhQHgF4%3D" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Final power figures AFR's mid 14's down low and 17's full load

[MJ80]

Much point in fitting a hiflowed ct26 to a 1HDT no intercooler ?

Due for a replacement turbo in the next year or two says my diesel guy..

Would tune and 3" zuast at the same time.

[80's_delirious]

Much point in fitting a hiflowed ct26 to a 1HDT no intercooler ?

Due for a replacement turbo in the next year or two says my diesel guy..

Would tune and 3" zuast at the same time.

Hi flowed turbo will deliver a greater volume of air at the same boost pressure, so you should see improved performace with lower EGTs not higher.

What justification does your diesel guy give for being nearly due for new turbo? If there is signs of wear suggesting imminent failure, pull it and replace it ASAP, failure of the turbo can be catastrophic for the engine, not just the turbo (don't ask how i know this )

for best results. full 3" zorst, intercooler, and tune from the start

[Northside 4x4]

Should get it on a proper load cell dyno for testing.

Inertia is not good for repeatability with boost response testing.
IE> standard turbo will hit max boost at around 1900rpm on a load cell dyno with tuning.
So your upgrade would be making full boost by around 1000rpm or so on an equivelant dyno.


Also, AFR graphs would be awesome.

[UGOTNUFN]

We do it this way so that we know that our product will work on the street,dynos can be made to do anything!!!!!

[MJ80]

Much point in fitting a hiflowed ct26 to a 1HDT no intercooler ?

Due for a replacement turbo in the next year or two says my diesel guy..

Would tune and 3" zuast at the same time.

Hi flowed turbo will deliver a greater volume of air at the same boost pressure, so you should see improved performace with lower EGTs not higher.

What justification does your diesel guy give for being nearly due for new turbo? If there is signs of wear suggesting imminent failure, pull it and replace it ASAP, failure of the turbo can be catastrophic for the engine, not just the turbo (don't ask how i know this )

for best results. full 3" zorst, intercooler, and tune from the start

He just said he could hear a noise or similar might have been a bit of play or something not sure but he did say nthing was imminent and suggested a year plus.

So what is this hi flowed CT26 worth then ?

[CustomTurbos]

Much point in fitting a hiflowed ct26 to a 1HDT no intercooler ?

Due for a replacement turbo in the next year or two says my diesel guy..

Would tune and 3" zuast at the same time.

Hi MJ, yes definately. The turbo has a higher efficiency generally, so you can push boost a little higher for the same intake air temp.

While I couldnt be more pro intercooler if I tried, the main area where you will see the benefit with intercooler is power post 2000rpm or so and boost can come in earlier. Note, with an intercooler, your engine will feel happier - idle smoother etc etc.

Original testing was done on a 12HT without an intercooler. 12HT in stock trim have a woefull response under 2000rpm. I posted the link on youtube a while back showing a run at 1600rpm @ 16-17psi (1.1 Bar or so). It was pushing 67kW @ wheels which equates to near 450nm. AFR's were excellent too. You can expect dramatic gains in sub 2000rpm response and outright boost. It will be a different car to drive set at ~ 15psi and tuned. High gears can be used at low speeds like never before.

Without an intercooler, it is easier to get *really* hot EGT's, so care must be taken not to get too excited on the tune, but in terms of bang for your buck, changing the turbo would be the first thing I would do faced with the choice - especially since it is an operation you can asily do yourself in your driveway.

Doing nothing at all except light tune, this turbo and ~ 15psi will make driving at low rpm in the bog a completely new experience

[Northside 4x4]

We do it this way so that we know that our product will work on the street,dynos can be made to do anything!!!!!

Sure they can, the point is though to develop a product not make the dyno fudge the figures.
Im sure it couldnt be that hard to find an honest dyno operator willing to help out?
Come to think of it, why would any dyno operator bother to fudge the results if they have no part in the sale/production of the product being tested?

Any AFR Graphs?

[CustomTurbos]

We do it this way so that we know that our product will work on the street,dynos can be made to do anything!!!!!

Sure they can, the point is though to develop a product not make the dyno fudge the figures.
Im sure it couldnt be that hard to find an honest dyno operator willing to help out?
Come to think of it, why would any dyno operator bother to fudge the results if they have no part in the sale/production of the product being tested?

Any AFR Graphs?

It is fairly common to find fudged results from various vendors or persons. I include intentionally misleading in that category.

I don't intend to ever do it; I make this statement to be held accountable to it, so put it down for the record.

The dyno UGOTNUFN uses is very accurate for what it is and in fact, as accurate as one could hope for in the kw and Torque at flywheel within the bounds of the inertia limiting the bottom end load-up. I am often astonished just how well the dyno back calculates when I compare to theory - very useful!

This dyno reads a bit lower than a DD @ 070 ramp. I did the back to backs on "Mudstorms" 80 series with 1HDFT. Did 141.2kW on DD @ 070 and low 130kW on UGOTNUFN's dyno (shootout mode). When at fixed rpm, it did ~145kW which is close enough for me to be the same result as the DD.

As for the AFR's, I dont know if there is a graph or not. I do know that it was around the mid 17's at full power.

When "Mudstorm" has his 80 back after getting a "strong" auto built, I'll get all the AFR data. I expect over 160rwKw the way it drives - it was a whole lot of speed that thing when it was running (for a 4wd)

[UGOTNUFN]

We do it this way so that we know that our product will work on the street,dynos can be made to do anything!!!!!

Sure they can, the point is though to develop a product not make the dyno fudge the figures.
Im sure it couldnt be that hard to find an honest dyno operator willing to help out?
Come to think of it, why would any dyno operator bother to fudge the results if they have no part in the sale/production of the product being tested?

Any AFR Graphs?

As i dont have the ability to change ramp rates etc, it gives very good back to back testing and cant be messed with.

And when we get awsome results with just an inertia system we know 100% that its gonna smash on the road.

[Northside 4x4]

We do it this way so that we know that our product will work on the street,dynos can be made to do anything!!!!!

Sure they can, the point is though to develop a product not make the dyno fudge the figures.
Im sure it couldnt be that hard to find an honest dyno operator willing to help out?
Come to think of it, why would any dyno operator bother to fudge the results if they have no part in the sale/production of the product being tested?

Any AFR Graphs?

It is fairly common to find fudged results from various vendors or persons. I include intentionally misleading in that category.

I don't intend to ever do it; I make this statement to be held accountable to it, so put it down for the record.

The dyno UGOTNUFN uses is very accurate for what it is and in fact, as accurate as one could hope for in the kw and Torque at flywheel within the bounds of the inertia limiting the bottom end load-up. I am often astonished just how well the dyno back calculates when I compare to theory - very useful!

This dyno reads a bit lower than a DD @ 070 ramp. I did the back to backs on "Mudstorms" 80 series with 1HDFT. Did 141.2kW on DD @ 070 and low 130kW on UGOTNUFN's dyno (shootout mode). When at fixed rpm, it did ~145kW which is close enough for me to be the same result as the DD.

As for the AFR's, I dont know if there is a graph or not. I do know that it was around the mid 17's at full power.

When "Mudstorm" has his 80 back after getting a "strong" auto built, I'll get all the AFR data. I expect over 160rwKw the way it drives - it was a whole lot of speed that thing when it was running (for a 4wd)

Im not questioning the power gains or anything like that.
The only point I was trying to make was that a ramp rate is much closer to real life conditions.
A car doesnt rip through 4th gear in 5seconds flat on the street like it does on an inertia dyno.
And if you believe someone is misleading you just ask for the data sheet print out as the only fudgeable figure being intake air temp is shown there for the duration of the run.

What kind of egt's do you get with the AFR @ 17:1?

[CustomTurbos]

@ Northside

I'll have to ask UGOTNUFN regarding egts, I know it was held at full power for 1 minute to measure. I seem to recall post turbo 550, I may be wrong.... The car needs a good intercooler; would pick up over 10kW for the same fuel and EGT's would improve. AFR's were only 17.5:1 at top revs, I have seen before with this turbo spec over 20 in midrange at full torque. Mudstorm has a pre turbo sensor, I'll ask him whats the highest he has seen, but I know it was acceptable because we had the conversation on that already and I was happy with it.

The Bosch dyno isn't a small inertia dyno, so the runs aren't that quick. Only real problem is low end torque, but the capability is there to load at any rpm. It is consistent and thats useful, I would say that it is a good dyno and reads on the low side, so when you get some nice numbers and an improved transient response, you really know that the effect will be felt on the road especially in thye lower gears. The 4th gear acceleration is probably typical to a second gear run on the road - which is where you want to have a swift response.

At the end of the dy, the dyno tuning methods are a little different between the two dynos - in that on each one you look at different things on the graph in some areas, but the end results are the same and I guess thats the main point. Seeing the response improve in low end on this dyno after a turbo change or tune (or both) represents very nicely a seat of the pants reality :-)

I have access to either a DD or the Inertia and am happy with tuning on either. Especially because it has a retarder :-)