cem - blown engine

[thehanko]

I bought a bottle of cem Cost effective maintenance oil system cleaner to run through my vehicles, diesel patrol and little getz as a bit of TLC.

Concerningly a week after the treatment my getz lost oil pressure and siezed, about 100km after the treatment on its first run over 5km.

Patrol has done about 4000km since.

I have had no diagnosis work done yet, so don't want to lay blame on the oil treatment, but it has made me frown and wonder a bit.

Has anyone else had any issues after using their products?

All I can think it might have done is dislodge something which then blocked a pickup?

But after the treatment neither vehicle showed any evidence of sludge or deposits being removed - you hear stories of huge sludge and lumpy muck comming out with the oil - but mine looked normal to every other oil change.

[chunks]

Had the Getz been poorly maintained in the past?

[thehanko]

Hard to say, we bought it at 65000km and it has been maintained to or above specs since then to 120,000km, and stamped upto when i bought it - however the dipstick etc had dark stains on them like it had not been cared for. hense the appeal of giving it a cleaning treatment.

Been reading up on oil pumps and read that extremely tine particals like .05mm can stop an oil pump working and snap its drive? seems a little precarious to me.

Seems like a large risk of failure after cleaning?

[chunks]

Pull the rocker cover off and have a look. It may have blocked an oil gallery to the head, run dry and seized a cam. I have found those Hyundai motors need regular oil changes (every 5000-7500km) with a good quality oil otherwise they just sludge up.

[thehanko]

was expecting that the cams would have been where it failed. is now siezed. though was running when stopped.

does excessive pressure make the oil light come on? i thought it was only low pressure?

Plan was to rip the cams off and see how it all looks, expecting to see damaged/hot cam seats - if these are damaged is it generally best to just throw a new head on than try repairs?

entire engines are fairly cheap at under a grand so not worth throwing much at it.

cheers

[Northside 4x4]

Start by pulling the sump off and looking at the pickup.

I will bet there is chunks of gasket/sealant and all kinds of stuff stuck in there as there normally is after using oil treatments.

[chunks]

was expecting that the cams would have been where it failed. is now siezed. though was running when stopped.

does excessive pressure make the oil light come on? i thought it was only low pressure?

Plan was to rip the cams off and see how it all looks, expecting to see damaged/hot cam seats - if these are damaged is it generally best to just throw a new head on than try repairs?

entire engines are fairly cheap at under a grand so not worth throwing much at it.

cheers

Oil light will only come on with low oil pressure.

A second hand engine can be a good option if you can get one with low kays, but you need to be careful that it's not been poorly maintained too.

[RAY185]

I have found those Hyundai motors need regular oil changes (every 5000-7500km) with a good quality oil otherwise they just sludge up.

Me too. Yet Hyundai and the like advise 15K intervals.
Throw the Getz away and buy a new one. That's what Hyundai want you to do.

[GRIMACE]

I never let either of my vehicle's go any more then 7500 on the same oil.
Usually changed a lot sooner then that.

I don't understand why manufacturers state 15000 and upto 30000k intervals, its just rediculous, IMHO of course.

[SCANAS]

I don't understand why manufacturers state 15000 and up to 30000k intervals, its just rediculous, IMHO of course.

It's all part of their running costs which RACQ and companies like that test and compare between models. Thats why manufacturers are changing to capped price servcing. So when there cars get reviewed for fleet costs and press reviews the overall running costs are competitive.

Yeah merc's can go 40k without a service they have an oil level and quality sensor on the pickup. They usually state in the book the oil will need to be topped up between servicing. Trucks are similarly long between oil too!

Interestingly Honda and Toyota are still 6 months.

[oozuk]

man late model trucks go 60'000kms between oil changes, in Europe it's upto 120'000kms on a single oil change

[tweak'e]

check the oil.
local mechanic had one come in and the oil had turned to gell. they put it down to oil additive the stealership put in it at its last service.

[thehanko]

Oil was still in good nic, i had double checked that.

Second hand engines are very cheap, so ill look about for a decent one and run with that.

I was more interested in the feelings as to it being caused / accellerated by the treatment which is supposed to entend engine life...

Im tempted to pull the engine down for personal interests sake, but i just have too much on my plate - much as it grates me to do so it will be a drive in drive out jobby.

Pity apart from this its been the most reliable car ive ever owned - including new ones lol. still looks like only costing about a grand fitted, so peanuts by comparison to the what it would cost if the patrol didnt like the TLC!

[bru21]

I have let every falcon I have owned go 20k between services, and they love it. The oil is still clean. Oil is way better then in the past where the 5000 figures came from. I serviced my 76 yesterday and had close to 0 oil consumption and its done every ten. I think actually doing it and changing the filter is the go, only takes one long distance between changes to damage / build sludge. You hear plenty of fleet guys never service the cars before exchange etc.. A mate worked for the local toyota dealer and he said they only do oil / filter and just tick everything else - doesn't surprise me. Hence I decide to service my own - and I know its done right!

[SCANAS]

Hence I decide to service my own - and I know its done right!

i'd be too scared to not let Yota do it BRU. If something goes wrong Toyota will blame you and getting warranty will be a massive PITA. I think your mad not to use Yota especially with capped price servicing. It's not hard (especially for you with a hoist at home) to check what they have or haven't done at the service. With the days of Mega CSI $$$ from the manufacturer I know our guys do everything and if anything will look for more stuff to get get $$$ out of a customer.

[bru21]

Thanks Scanas,

I spoke to the servive department at toyota and as long as I buy toyota oil and filters its all good. My bro has an abn and services cars so I'll use it if need be.

Each service costs $300 - so $600 a year. I save $150 by DIYing it or $300 a year. We have 5 cars and 2 forks that I sevice, so save $1050 per year. I have been doing it since I started about 9 years ago - so have essentially $9450 in the kitty for warranty should toyota not honour it. Plus I never need to wait (quicker to do it mysel then driving to the dealer, getting a lift back, back to dealer and then home.

Ford do not honour their warranty - I had 5 or so big problems and they were not interested - it was Ford serviced initially then after they would not honour warranty I diy'ed it.

Has anyone here ever been refused warranty due to DIY servicing?

Would be interesting?

[SCANAS]

I can tell you heaps ...

Don't listen to what the service department tell you ... Are they representing Toyota's view ( the warrantor ) ahh no. They are just trying to keep you happy yes mister customer of course you can. If your happy with the the amount in the kitty go for it.

PS Keep all the receipts for oils and parts etc that will definately help..

[chimpboy]

Has anyone here ever been refused warranty due to DIY servicing?

I think they are legally bound to honour the warranty if the vehicle is serviced by a qualified mechanic, but otherwise not. I also think that in the absence of a service history they would just say, "yeah right, prove it" when you said you had serviced it yourself. Dunno for sure though. You might win the battle but it might take a while, or they might be really good about it.

I do my own maintenance usually but I just get the one car we bought new serviced by Honda, it probably costs $400 a year with them and I know I could save a bit, but not a lot.

[Hamo]

man late model trucks go 60'000kms between oil changes, in Europe it's upto 120'000kms on a single oil change

Realy
The 2010 volvo truck i drive is 40'000 ks & i belive thats too long as the small things that dont get looked at in between often let you down.

[thehanko]

Been too busy to look at it yet - its still sitting in a trailer. going in for a new engine on tuesday - if possible ill get the old one back and try to diagnose its failure.

[Northside 4x4]

Has anyone here ever been refused warranty due to DIY servicing?

I think they are legally bound to honour the warranty if the vehicle is serviced by a qualified mechanic, but otherwise not. I also think that in the absence of a service history they would just say, "yeah right, prove it" when you said you had serviced it yourself. Dunno for sure though. You might win the battle but it might take a while, or they might be really good about it.

I do my own maintenance usually but I just get the one car we bought new serviced by Honda, it probably costs $400 a year with them and I know I could save a bit, but not a lot.

That is exactly right. No grey area on the matter what so ever. If its not serviced by a qualified mechanic they have every right to deny a warranty claim. Not saying the will! but they can.

As I have said in past threads. Getting your oil tested is cheap. Why not, even if its just once have 5K old oil tested and read the report on it.