Bob's better Buildathon - HJ45 -with 2H doing 4sp -5sp Swap

[Bobathon]

Hey All, Seasons Greetings ., Lucky Bobathon has started a project on the '79 HJ45 it was purchased with a 2H and 4sp with the drum handbrake behind the transfer. Got hold of a complete 1983 60 series diesel to swap the bits over. First, found the rear axles are wider and the spring saddles are narrower on the 45. So rather than change all that, worked out the output shaft/ gearset can be changed over in the transfer and give me the 5spd with the handbrake drum on the back. That was great until it went under the ute and see that getting it in there is going to include some foreign language. Thinking now that the tube brace between the chassis is going to get in the way and looking for some mounting options. This little glitch must have been overcome previously. Would any body have some constructive ideas on this conversion, Santa might cough up some coin but looking at budget build.
All the very best to all for Chrissy, ( better be a better year next year eh!!).
Cheers,
Bobathon

[hj 45]

Most people resort to using 60/75 series rear drums which have the handbrake built into them. Though I've also heard of people cutting that torque tube behind the gearbox and relocating back a bit further. Personally I'm not game enough to do that, so 75 series rear drums is what I have acquired.

[Bobathon]

Thanks HJ , The rear axle on the 60 donor vehicle has a wider spring saddle distance, I would need to move them, and that I guess should be proffessionally welded. The Brake backing plates have a different bolt up to the 45 so cant just bolt up. Moving that chassis brace sounds a bit ext reme, ny budget is limited thats a problem at the mo, any other thoughts are greatly appreciated,
Cheers,
bob

[RAY185]

Redrill the backing plates.

[Bobathon]

Thanks Ray,
Its been done before then? I'll have a look at it tomorrow, need to adapt the cable guides etc . With the centre drum mod to the back of the five speed ,that I have done, it looked like the box would fit up , albeit with only minimal clearance to the tube chassis brace, . as Nissans and many trucks still use that centre drum system, I considered that it was a simple option.
Cheers ,
Bob

[RAY185]

Yeah it's been done. Cable guides are fairly straight forward.

I reckon if you've gone to all the trouble you have to put the transfer handbrake onto a 60 series case, just move that brace. Either move it back just enough or preferably, have a new brace made up with a bigger bend to clear the drum and mount into the same spot.

[Hamo]

, albeit with only minimal clearance to the tube chassis brace,
Cheers ,
Bob

You will still need to dint the tube as the uni will tap it on bumps.
It's a pain to work out where until you fit it all up & you will need an oxy.

For brakes 60 series backing plates & hand brake cable from a 75 series.

Hamo

[Bobathon]

Thanks Hamo, what is the story with the 75 cable, as the 60 series cable fits into the floor mount box the same as the old 45, is it shorter or is there another reason?
Sounds like you have been there with the 5sp and transfer mod, did you use the newer mount system? I am considering using the removable hanging brackets from the 60 and fitting them to the 45 chassis. Not sure of drilling the chassis or making U bolt type brackets over the rails. Im hoping to get the box set up in the tunnel today and see whats needed.
Cheers,
Bob

[hj 45]

Use a 79 series handbrake cable, it's longer and fits between the rear drums just right.

[Hamo]

It only a width thing & just a better fit.
My troopy is a 81 so the gearbox crossmember was the same.
Speedo cable the same just had to pull/reroute it a bit.

Hamo

Edit: Just checked mine,It's a genuine 40 series 5 speed that i have fitted.
& i dont have the brake drum on the back off the box.

[Frankenyota]

Does the chassis tube have to be moved to fit a 5 speed to a SWB?
With the handbrake moved to the rear wheels.

Matt

[hj 45]

Does the chassis tube have to be moved to fit a 5 speed to a SWB?
With the handbrake moved to the rear wheels.

Matt

Nope, '83 and '84 model shorties have a 5 speed standard.

[Bobathon]

And so this is Christmas....
Thanks Hamo, Will post again when I have tried the fit up. At one time my old girl has had two L brackets for mounting a V8 with 4 spd. These brackets used an ugly looking brace that bolted to the transfer, The four speed that came out had suffered from the poor mounting system. I will put a photo of what I get done eventually. Any whooo, Mary Crockmoose and and a Hairy new dear.
Cheers,
Bob

[Bobathon]

Hey All, happy new year!! . The drivetrain is now all bolted up. There is still sufficient clearance to the tube brace, and with a new radiator with a thermo fan, enough clearance up front. The angle required to get the trans into position was near vertical and needed the help of a tranny jack with the box firmly attached, coaxing it up over the pressure plate was the difficult part , but persistance and some different angles, in she went. This ute has had a higher set of springs fitted, so the 60 series rear driveshaft is showing some spline (20mm ..) but I lifted the back off the ground and does not extend very much past its resting position. The transmission tunnel cover got some meat sliced off as the gearshifts are now further back. Easy job. Lots more to do now, I will be looking at the wiring for the edic and glow timer, as the previous set up looked butchered, any one had this wiring scenario??. I am considering a swap of that part of the harness out of the 60, its sure to be a spaghetti feast!!
Santa brought a new camera , so will get around to pasting up some photos soon.
Cheers,
Bob

[RAY185]

If you still have the 60 trans cover you can shape it and fit it over the 40 cover. Holes in the right spot for your levers and will cover the old ones holes.

[Bobathon]

Cheers Ray, I'll give that a go. The sparky forum..... is that the right road to ask for advice on the engine wiring?

[Clanky]

Does the chassis tube have to be moved to fit a 5 speed to a SWB?
With the handbrake moved to the rear wheels.

Matt

Nope, '83 and '84 model shorties have a 5 speed standard.

I have a 77 SWB with a Dyna 5 speed and original 40 t/case with rear handbrake,original mounts, and it has the tube still in it albeit with a bit of a dent. Bought it that way, but have had it out to do the clutch with no real dramas. Of course without the tube brace things would be a lot easier.

[Bobathon]

Hey Clanky, yep I can see that this tube brace is the bug bear, doing the conversion to wheel handbrake would be much better as it seems that the centre drum works for forward travel but not much grab backwards. I might get round to that another day, for the time being I'm getting the old girl on the road.
Sorting out the wiring now - oooh how I love spaghetti.
Cheers,
Bob

[Clanky]

I never had any real drama with the tailshaft handbrake and it works ok in both directions. You can buy every part for them cheap, to bring them back to spec. I think most of the old ones have been turned to 'smoke' at some stage after being accidentally left on and this does them no favours.
I have also had a 60 with the rear drum handbrake and they are ok, but that said when the drums are wet after a water crossing, you have no foot brake or handbrake. Same same when they are full of mud and shite
I have been thinking of fitting a GQ patrol tailshaft brake on the 40 as I have a spare one, and they are pretty good. I think the tube brace would have to be removed for this though as they are much larger than a 40 one

[Frankenyota]

Does the chassis tube have to be moved to fit a 5 speed to a SWB?
With the handbrake moved to the rear wheels.

Matt

Nope, '83 and '84 model shorties have a 5 speed standard.

I have a 77 SWB with a Dyna 5 speed and original 40 t/case with rear handbrake,original mounts, and it has the tube still in it albeit with a bit of a dent. Bought it that way, but have had it out to do the clutch with no real dramas. Of course without the tube brace things would be a lot easier.

What about a 71 model with 3 speed gearbox?

[Clanky]

Dunno about a 71 model. Do they have the 2F?
If you give me a datum point to measure from (say, rear of 2F engine block where it bolts to g/box, I can give you the dimension from there to the tube crossmember on my 77

[Bobathon]

Hey Clanky, where do you source these parts for the trans brake? I found a rubber wiring grommet that fits snugly over the adjuster and slots nicely into the backing plate, as these face forward, I figured it would prolong the life by preventing crap getting in. I had lots of fun re shaping the 60 trans shift stick as it fouled on the handbrake , but now having bent it seriously forward and centre it looks nearly stock. Used a combo of 60 boots to the cover plate,
Cheers,
Bob

[Clanky]

Parts

http://www.4x4world.com.au/FJ40/landcru ... ake-parts/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://stores.ebay.com.au/ROODOGS-4WD-SPARES" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (doesnt have them listed atm but can get them)

Also Terrain Tamer / Don Kyatt

[Frankenyota]

Engine is F155, will check the measurements against the chassis manual i have.

Cheers
Matt

[Bobathon]

Thanks Clanky, I will look into rebuilding it. I posted a thread (Auto Elec)re wiring for the changeover from the 45 loom to the plugs on the 2H , any ideas on this?
Cheers,
Bob

[Clanky]

if you get a genuine chassis manual it will have both engines and cars wiring diagrams in it for you to compare.
I havent done a swap in one of these

[Bobathon]

Thanks Clanky,
I have been surfing around other forums and have some basic info now on wire colours and function, so will be looking at the hook up soon, been so bloody hot in the shed last couple of days hard to get motivated,
Cheers,
Bob

[Clanky]

Hot?!
Its been snowing down in Thredbo today!
0.6degC!!!

Now get back in the shed....

[Bobathon]

Thanks for the pep talk Clanky, it was only 40c what kind of a woos am I, what was I thinking?? This wiring dilema is continuing, no one wanted to add any thing on the auto elec page, so its back to the books ......
Cheers,
Bob

[Clanky]

Thanks for the pep talk Clanky, it was only 40c what kind of a woos am I, what was I thinking?? This wiring dilema is continuing, no one wanted to add any thing on the auto elec page, so its back to the books ......
Cheers,
Bob

Hahah, yeah thats the way.
Cant be too hard with the wiring. probably the hardest being the EDIC control and maybe the alternator if its different.
Glow system you might have to fabricate if you dont have one, but you can get aftermarket ones off Ebait if that helps

What I can think of off the top of my head:
temp gauge - same as old engine?
oil pressure - same as old engine - although the 2H has a shutdown after a few seconds if oil pressure doesnt rise
alternator - much he same as the old motor or get an internal reg one to simplify things.
Glow system - new
EDIC - new
tacho - new
Injection pump fuel cut solenoid? - cant remember if the 2H has one or if its in the EDIC
Starter - much the same as the old