top ten 4wd

[RaginRover]

That is not what you said, you said " Took Nissan & Toyota till the mid eighties to get some of those features" refering to Nam's previous post "who else had an all coil, v8, power-steering beast in the early 70s?".
L/Cruisers had solid axle coils all round with power steering in the early 80's.
Peter.

Ok well I am saying it now ... what was the first Land Cruiser to have coils all round, disc brakes all round and full time 4x4 that the Range Rover had in 1970 ?

I was pretty sure it was the 80 series ... 1989, 60 series had leaves and drums, 70 series had leaves, I am sure it was the 80 series ??

Toyota history site http://tlc.toyota-europe.com/main_frame.html
shows the tech specs of those cars ....

Tom

[RaginRover]

Stock for Stock as far as capability goes I was pretty sure there was an
80 series released with factory lockers front and rear, that one would have to have gone pretty well !

Tom

[droopypete]

That is not what you said, you said " Took Nissan & Toyota till the mid eighties to get some of those features" refering to Nam's previous post "who else had an all coil, v8, power-steering beast in the early 70s?".
L/Cruisers had solid axle coils all round with power steering in the early 80's.
Peter.

Ok well I am saying it now ... what was the first Land Cruiser to have coils all round, disc brakes all round and full time 4x4 that the Range Rover had in 1970 ?

I was pretty sure it was the 80 series ... 1989, 60 series had leaves and drums, 70 series had leaves, I am sure it was the 80 series ??

Toyota history site http://tlc.toyota-europe.com/main_frame.html
shows the tech specs of those cars ....

Tom

Land Cruiser bundera, solid axles, power steer, started in late 84 and thats early 80's in my book.
Peter.
ps how could you wait so long to bite? I almost posted for you

[grimbo]

Stock for Stock as far as capability goes I was pretty sure there was an
80 series released with factory lockers front and rear, that one would have to have gone pretty well !

Tom

There were limited numbers of Suzuki LJ80s sold with factory front & rear lockers too in the mid 70s

[RaginRover]

That is not what you said, you said " Took Nissan & Toyota till the mid eighties to get some of those features" refering to Nam's previous post "who else had an all coil, v8, power-steering beast in the early 70s?".
L/Cruisers had solid axle coils all round with power steering in the early 80's.
Peter.

Ok well I am saying it now ... what was the first Land Cruiser to have coils all round, disc brakes all round and full time 4x4 that the Range Rover had in 1970 ?

I was pretty sure it was the 80 series ... 1989, 60 series had leaves and drums, 70 series had leaves, I am sure it was the 80 series ??

Toyota history site http://tlc.toyota-europe.com/main_frame.html
shows the tech specs of those cars ....

Tom

Land Cruiser bundera, solid axles, power steer, started in late 84 and thats early 80's in my book.
Peter.
ps how could you wait so long to bite? I almost posted for you

You have been pipped at the post unless you can show me a spec elsewhere, she has drums on the back mate

Toyota Bundera 1984 - 1989
2 door, soft top or hardtop, 2+3 seats
loa: 346mm, width: 1690mm, wheelbase: 2310mm (90") track: 1425mm/1420mm, grnd clearance: 230mm turning radius: 6.5m (kerb)
petrol: (RJ70...)
22R 2367cc petrol 4cyls 2-valves/cyl sohc
bore: 92mm, stroke: 89mm, c.r.: 9.0:1
power: 105 HP at 4800rpm, torque: 136 Ft-Lb at 2800rpm
diesel: (LJ70...)
2L 2446cc diesel 4cyls 2-valves/cyl sohc
bore: 92mm, stroke: 92mm, c.r.: 22.3:1
power: 72 HP at 4000rpm, torque: 115 Ft-Lb at 2200rpm
and
2L-T 2446cc turbo diesel 4cyls 2-valves/cyl sohc
bore: 92mm, stroke: 92mm, c.r.: 20.0:1
power: 86 HP at 4000rpm, torque: 139 Ft-Lb at 2400rpm
transmission: 5m (G52 or R150F in turbo model) gearbox, part-time 4WD, 2-speed transfer case.
suspension: live-coil/live-coil, brakes: disc/drum
tyres: 7.50R16 or 265/65r15, fuel-tank: 90L
Note: dimensions given for hard-top

[droopypete]

That is not what you said, you said " Took Nissan & Toyota till the mid eighties to get some of those features" refering to Nam's previous post "who else had an all coil, v8, power-steering beast in the early 70s?".
L/Cruisers had solid axle coils all round with power steering in the early 80's.
Peter.

Ok well I am saying it now ... what was the first Land Cruiser to have coils all round, disc brakes all round and full time 4x4 that the Range Rover had in 1970 ?

I was pretty sure it was the 80 series ... 1989, 60 series had leaves and drums, 70 series had leaves, I am sure it was the 80 series ??

Toyota history site http://tlc.toyota-europe.com/main_frame.html
shows the tech specs of those cars ....

Tom

Land Cruiser bundera, solid axles, power steer, started in late 84 and thats early 80's in my book.
Peter.
ps how could you wait so long to bite? I almost posted for you

You have been pipped at the post unless you can show me a spec elsewhere, she has drums on the back mate

Toyota Bundera 1984 - 1989
2 door, soft top or hardtop, 2+3 seats
loa: 346mm, width: 1690mm, wheelbase: 2310mm (90") track: 1425mm/1420mm, grnd clearance: 230mm turning radius: 6.5m (kerb)
petrol: (RJ70...)
22R 2367cc petrol 4cyls 2-valves/cyl sohc
bore: 92mm, stroke: 89mm, c.r.: 9.0:1
power: 105 HP at 4800rpm, torque: 136 Ft-Lb at 2800rpm
diesel: (LJ70...)
2L 2446cc diesel 4cyls 2-valves/cyl sohc
bore: 92mm, stroke: 92mm, c.r.: 22.3:1
power: 72 HP at 4000rpm, torque: 115 Ft-Lb at 2200rpm
and
2L-T 2446cc turbo diesel 4cyls 2-valves/cyl sohc
bore: 92mm, stroke: 92mm, c.r.: 20.0:1
power: 86 HP at 4000rpm, torque: 139 Ft-Lb at 2400rpm
transmission: 5m (G52 or R150F in turbo model) gearbox, part-time 4WD, 2-speed transfer case.
suspension: live-coil/live-coil, brakes: disc/drum
tyres: 7.50R16 or 265/65r15, fuel-tank: 90L
Note: dimensions given for hard-top

I never metioned rear discs, let me remind you where this debate began,

Nam said, "who else had an all coil, v8, power-steering beast in the early 70s?".

Rainbow warrier said " Took Nissan & Toyota till the mid eighties to get some of those features"

I said early 80's, and I still stand by it (totaly un pipped, I might add )

[tigger]

Stock for stock, nothing can compare to a Rubicon. Jeep invented the go-anywhere, do-anything 4x4, and still wears the crown. And with the ready availability of aftermarket parts, Jeeps enjoy a versatility matched by no other vehicle.

so where did you copy that bit of marketing babble? What a load of coddswallop. If you do a bit of research you'll find that Jeep didn't invent the go-anywhere, do-anything 4x4, but actually worked out how to market it as that. Big difference

Well it's hard to argue with the TJ Rubicon (as the best stocker) - locked at both ends in low range riding on 31's from factory.... shame they aren't released in australia

[grimbo]

Stock for stock, nothing can compare to a Rubicon. Jeep invented the go-anywhere, do-anything 4x4, and still wears the crown. And with the ready availability of aftermarket parts, Jeeps enjoy a versatility matched by no other vehicle.

so where did you copy that bit of marketing babble? What a load of coddswallop. If you do a bit of research you'll find that Jeep didn't invent the go-anywhere, do-anything 4x4, but actually worked out how to market it as that. Big difference

Well it's hard to argue with the TJ Rubicon (as the best stocker) - locked at both ends in low range riding on 31's from factory.... shame they aren't released in australia

Yeah you can. LJ80 locked at both ends with a low range t.case and factory 7.00 x 16s.

[droopypete]

Stock for stock, nothing can compare to a Rubicon. Jeep invented the go-anywhere, do-anything 4x4, and still wears the crown. And with the ready availability of aftermarket parts, Jeeps enjoy a versatility matched by no other vehicle.

so where did you copy that bit of marketing babble? What a load of coddswallop. If you do a bit of research you'll find that Jeep didn't invent the go-anywhere, do-anything 4x4, but actually worked out how to market it as that. Big difference

Well it's hard to argue with the TJ Rubicon (as the best stocker) - locked at both ends in low range riding on 31's from factory.... shame they aren't released in australia

I was not arguing with the cars spec's they are impressive, what I was taking him to task on, was the bullshit he heard from the new car salesman when he bought his first 4x4, a TJ Rubicon,
"the go-anywhere, do-anything 4x4" what a lot of shit!
there is no vehicle made that will "go anywhere" that expression is so wanky and downright dangerous, how often have we seen Mr Joe Public bogged to the sills in an area he should never have been on his own, without a backup car or even recovery gear, compleatly unprepared for his first 4x4 adventure, and after you have pulled him out and given his kids something to eat, he says "but they said it would go anywere"
Thats what was wrong with Perfect Aggression's post, there is nothing wrong with the car.
But while we are talking about the best stock vehicle, what about the Merc G wagon?
Peter.

[N*A*M]

bunderas were not v8 from the factory. in fact, they are just gutless hiluxes with coils and a short cruiser-esque wagon body. and they are still more than a decade behind the range rover.

[grimbo]

Actualy the G Wagen is pretty amazing stock, front and rear selectable lockers, a great engine, coil sprung live axles and probably the ugliest body shape. Good pickup Pete.

As to the Rubicon being a stock vehicle it is a bit of a grey area. yes it is offered from the factory but it is a limited edition specced up vehicle so does that count. If you did the same to a stock TJ with aftermarket parts you would be ahead $$ wise and performance wise. Still it would be nice to have a factory warranty I suppose

[-Scott-]

Doesn't the Rubicon come standard with 4:1 low range? That's pretty impressive (but only if I remember right )

[droopypete]

bunderas were not v8 from the factory. in fact, they are just gutless hiluxes with coils and a short cruiser-esque wagon body. and they are still more than a decade behind the range rover.

Nam, I never said they did come with a V8 and anyway I don't think mine is gutless, why don't you bring your pos rangie around and we will line them up
Peter.

[Barathrum]

G wagon's are sweet
even the early ones
http://4x4abc.com/G-Class/g5.html

[Dembones]

Doesn't the Rubicon come standard with 4:1 low range? That's pretty impressive (but only if I remember right )

That is correct. Jeeps in general have the lowest stock T-case ratio of any light truck. I'm not going to bash the other brands, I've seen incredible things out of all of them. The reason I stick to Jeeps is their long standing testiment to reliability and rugged off-road construction. I find the shorter wheelbase combined with 4WD an awesome package, throw lockers in there and it's neigh on unstoppable. The Rubicon is without a doubt the most capable stock 4x4 out there. Selectable lockers front and rear, D-44 axles front and rear, stock skidplates everywhere,
4 to 1 T-case, 4:10 R&P, 31"MTRs. All on a below-100 inch wheelbase, very lightweight. The combination of a 100 inch wheelbase and 31 inch tires gives it the break-over angle of a landcruiser on 38's. It's easy to see what manufacturers are going for just by watching the ads, the Lo-Ro ads feature families being hauled to soccer games, Rubicon ads feature 3-wheel balances on boulders.

[roverrat]

GO THE LADAS!!!

[N*A*M]

so the jeep guys rallied every one to join this forum and defend the jeep thing eh? haha pretty insecure behaviour!

nevermind, outerlimits forum membership has shot up heaps.

[chimpboy]

so the jeep guys rallied every one to join this forum and defend the jeep thing eh? haha pretty insecure behaviour!

nevermind, outerlimits forum membership has shot up heaps.

Yeah, exactly.

So.

Welcome to all the new Jeep guys. It's good to have you here and we hope you'll enjoy the forum as much as we do.

Now that you're here, you'll have the opportunity both to share your technical knowledge and expertise, and hopefully to pick up a few tips from our established members too.

If you're really lucky, you may learn enough to CHOOSE A BETTER FOURBY next time... you never know

Jason

[bj56]

yota all the way

[droopypete]

Doesn't the Rubicon come standard with 4:1 low range? That's pretty impressive (but only if I remember right )

That is correct. Jeeps in general have the lowest stock T-case ratio of any light truck. I'm not going to bash the other brands, I've seen incredible things out of all of them. The reason I stick to Jeeps is their long standing testiment to reliability and rugged off-road construction. I find the shorter wheelbase combined with 4WD an awesome package, throw lockers in there and it's neigh on unstoppable. The Rubicon is without a doubt the most capable stock 4x4 out there. Selectable lockers front and rear, D-44 axles front and rear, stock skidplates everywhere,
4 to 1 T-case, 4:10 R&P, 31"MTRs. All on a below-100 inch wheelbase, very lightweight. The combination of a 100 inch wheelbase and 31 inch tires gives it the break-over angle of a landcruiser on 38's. It's easy to see what manufacturers are going for just by watching the ads, the Lo-Ro ads feature families being hauled to soccer games, Rubicon ads feature 3-wheel balances on boulders.

I agree with most of what you have writen Dembones, But I have to say I have never seen so many brand new usernames on a poll before

I think Jeep performed a master stroke with the rubicon, I wish some of the other brands would follow suit, in ofering a car aimed at us, the people who use them, as they were origionaly intended, not like the curent disco promotion, Les Hiddens must have cringed and re-read his contract when handed that script
As good as I think the rubicon is, I prefer the G wagon as the best standard 4x4, but I voted suzuki (and I only voted once )
Peter.

[Drafty]

Spot the Toyota...

The above pic was taken at the Outback Challenge a few days ago.

No need to say any more in my opinion, the picture sais it all, you can stick your pole and all your new user names where the sun dont shine.

[Drafty]

[Sixty]

I thought there would be more than eleven cars competing.........?

[Drafty]

I thought there would be more than eleven cars competing.........?

Thats a clever reply

[Thor]

as mentioned this really depends on your situation.
i factored in a lot of things when getting my new rig...
and my tj jeep craps all over the 40 i used to have (i only have to start at powersteering )

[Rainbow Warrior]

That is not what you said, you said " Took Nissan & Toyota till the mid eighties to get some of those features" refering to Nam's previous post "who else had an all coil, v8, power-steering beast in the early 70s?".
L/Cruisers had solid axle coils all round with power steering in the early 80's.
Peter.

Ok well I am saying it now ... what was the first Land Cruiser to have coils all round, disc brakes all round and full time 4x4 that the Range Rover had in 1970 ?

I was pretty sure it was the 80 series ... 1989, 60 series had leaves and drums, 70 series had leaves, I am sure it was the 80 series ??

Toyota history site http://tlc.toyota-europe.com/main_frame.html
shows the tech specs of those cars ....

Tom

Land Cruiser bundera, solid axles, power steer, started in late 84 and thats early 80's in my book.
Peter.
ps how could you wait so long to bite? I almost posted for you

Did'n't Bundera's have IFS? And what would be mid 80's then?

[Rainbow Warrior]

[quote="droopypete]

I never metioned rear discs, let me remind you where this debate began,

Nam said, "who else had an all coil, v8, power-steering beast in the early 70s?".

Rainbow warrier said " Took Nissan & Toyota till the mid eighties to get some of those features"

I said early 80's, and I still stand by it (totaly un pipped, I might add )[/quote]

And I said some.

[Rainbow Warrior]

bunderas were not v8 from the factory. in fact, they are just gutless hiluxes with coils and a short cruiser-esque wagon body. and they are still more than a decade behind the range rover.

Nam, I never said they did come with a V8 and anyway I don't think mine is gutless, why don't you bring your pos rangie around and we will line them up
Peter.

I suspect you are slightly deluded as to the power output of a stock Bunderra.

[RaginRover]

That is not what you said, you said " Took Nissan & Toyota till the mid eighties to get some of those features" refering to Nam's previous post "who else had an all coil, v8, power-steering beast in the early 70s?".
L/Cruisers had solid axle coils all round with power steering in the early 80's.
Peter.

Ok well I am saying it now ... what was the first Land Cruiser to have coils all round, disc brakes all round and full time 4x4 that the Range Rover had in 1970 ?

I was pretty sure it was the 80 series ... 1989, 60 series had leaves and drums, 70 series had leaves, I am sure it was the 80 series ??


Toyota history site http://tlc.toyota-europe.com/main_frame.html
shows the tech specs of those cars ....

Tom

I mentioned them ......

[WOLF]

[quote="chimpboy"][quote="N*A*M"]so the jeep guys rallied every one to join this forum and defend the jeep thing eh? haha pretty insecure behaviour!

nevermind, outerlimits forum membership has shot up heaps. [/quote]

Yeah, exactly.

So.

Welcome to all the new Jeep guys. It's good to have you here and we hope you'll enjoy the forum as much as we do.

Now that you're here, you'll have the opportunity both to share your technical knowledge and expertise, and hopefully to pick up a few tips from our established members too.

If you're really lucky, you may learn enough to CHOOSE A BETTER FOURBY next time... you never know

Jason[/quote]

I have made my choice and am very happy with it,as are most of the YOTA drivers we have converted to a MORE capable OFF road vehicle.
I have driven just about every fouby out there and NOTHING can compare to a TJ....NOTHING.