Frank,
The marks adaptors web site lists low range gears t osuit all models from 88 on...
http://www.marks4wd.com/Mitsubishi-extr ... -gears.htm
do you know about this ?? or are they an agent for your guys gears. & if so they are not correct about fitting ALL models..
cheers
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Frank, gears
Moderator: -Scott-
Hi Frank,
I have some trouble with the frontdriveline of my Delica. Does anybody have trouble with a 5-speed after assembling the 2.85 gears.
Yesterday I reasmebled the rearshaft to drive only with the front. There were very loud noises (klong klong....) . Then I asemmbled the rearshaft and reasembled the the frontshaft. It was o.k. no noise. I did the test in 4L and 4H. Fronthubs were locked. I opened the lit of the T-case gear. Gears are ok. Then I also opened the frontdiff. It is also o.k.
So what I couldn´t check is the chain and the shaftjoints of the front. They seem to have a lot of play. If I turn the frontdiff I need 20-25 mm to move the wheelshafts.
Maybe the 2.85 gear produces to much torque. So the DOJ joints are not strong enough and get a damage. The first time this noise apeared when I drove down a steep hill.
At present the noise also apeares when I drive on plane ground and changing speed very quick.
wolf
I have some trouble with the frontdriveline of my Delica. Does anybody have trouble with a 5-speed after assembling the 2.85 gears.
Yesterday I reasmebled the rearshaft to drive only with the front. There were very loud noises (klong klong....) . Then I asemmbled the rearshaft and reasembled the the frontshaft. It was o.k. no noise. I did the test in 4L and 4H. Fronthubs were locked. I opened the lit of the T-case gear. Gears are ok. Then I also opened the frontdiff. It is also o.k.
So what I couldn´t check is the chain and the shaftjoints of the front. They seem to have a lot of play. If I turn the frontdiff I need 20-25 mm to move the wheelshafts.
Maybe the 2.85 gear produces to much torque. So the DOJ joints are not strong enough and get a damage. The first time this noise apeared when I drove down a steep hill.
At present the noise also apeares when I drive on plane ground and changing speed very quick.
wolf
L300 2.5TDI 4x4, Space Gear 2.5TDI 4x4
Hmmmm Wolfe I have had no problems with mine (3.0 V6 5sp) the same with Lloyd Swartz (3.0 V6 auto) and another guy in the US (Patrick) with a Gen 1 2.6 auto.
It sounds like the t/case chain maybe be jumping it will sound like a metal ruler being dragged along the spokes of a bicycle wheel. It is more of a "klong" sound than a "clunking" noise.
The best testament to these gears is Lloyd who has had them for 12 months and has done some VERY heavy offroad work and he also runs 5.29 diffs for further gearing reduction.
I would be looking at this area of the t/case maybe there is too much play in the mainshaft or the chain was stretched from before. Certainly the higher torque multiplication of these gears will highlight a fault in the t/case even more than the standard gears. But the evidence suggests these t/cases and drivelines will certainly withstand the 2.85 gears.
We do know that the Mitsu chain drive t/case has to be assembled very carefully with close attention to tolerances particularly with the chain drive assembly and main shaft end float. These are critical and is even more important in a 5sp due to the shockloading compared to the auto.
Alex, the 2.85 gears will fit a Gen 2 3.0 V6 auto t/case..................
It sounds like the t/case chain maybe be jumping it will sound like a metal ruler being dragged along the spokes of a bicycle wheel. It is more of a "klong" sound than a "clunking" noise.
The best testament to these gears is Lloyd who has had them for 12 months and has done some VERY heavy offroad work and he also runs 5.29 diffs for further gearing reduction.
I would be looking at this area of the t/case maybe there is too much play in the mainshaft or the chain was stretched from before. Certainly the higher torque multiplication of these gears will highlight a fault in the t/case even more than the standard gears. But the evidence suggests these t/cases and drivelines will certainly withstand the 2.85 gears.
We do know that the Mitsu chain drive t/case has to be assembled very carefully with close attention to tolerances particularly with the chain drive assembly and main shaft end float. These are critical and is even more important in a 5sp due to the shockloading compared to the auto.
Alex, the 2.85 gears will fit a Gen 2 3.0 V6 auto t/case..................
I just luv my "clacker Jabber"
Hi Frank,
after I disassembled the complete front driveline I couldn´t find a defect. There are no damaged parts or play in the joints. So I guess it´s the chain or the chaingears.
What is the wide of the chain in a 5 speed auto? The wide of all the gears I have in "stock" is 48mm.
wolf
after I disassembled the complete front driveline I couldn´t find a defect. There are no damaged parts or play in the joints. So I guess it´s the chain or the chaingears.
What is the wide of the chain in a 5 speed auto? The wide of all the gears I have in "stock" is 48mm.
wolf
L300 2.5TDI 4x4, Space Gear 2.5TDI 4x4
I haven't got one to measure but from memory they are about 2" for a Gen 1 and signifigantly wider and chunkier for a Gen 2 t/case (super select). Unfortunately I think you will have to remove the case and inspect the chain drive for slop. If the front and rear output shafts have not been shimmed properly there can be a slight misalignment between the cogs which can cause chain stretch and or jumping. It is not an uncommon problem with early Mitsu t/cases 
I just luv my "clacker Jabber"
Hi Frank,
I´m just back from my garage. Unfortunetly it is the chain. It is very wide.
When I push chain in the midle of the two chaingears I can push it 20mm. There are smal marks on the top of the chaingears caused by the chain.
Also the 3 outputbearings have suffered a lot. They very much play and that afetre only 3000km. I´m not very happy with this. Cause taht means that T-case ( chain) ist not strong enough to stand the torque. What would you recomend.
When I change the bearing I will look for stronger types maybe I replace the upper ballbearing with a rolltype. In my opinion it should work cause the rearshaft doesnt produce axial power.
Maybe I also should replace the chain to brand new (I stil have used chain )?
Wolf
I´m just back from my garage. Unfortunetly it is the chain. It is very wide.
When I push chain in the midle of the two chaingears I can push it 20mm. There are smal marks on the top of the chaingears caused by the chain.
Also the 3 outputbearings have suffered a lot. They very much play and that afetre only 3000km. I´m not very happy with this. Cause taht means that T-case ( chain) ist not strong enough to stand the torque. What would you recomend.
When I change the bearing I will look for stronger types maybe I replace the upper ballbearing with a rolltype. In my opinion it should work cause the rearshaft doesnt produce axial power.
Maybe I also should replace the chain to brand new (I stil have used chain )?
Wolf
L300 2.5TDI 4x4, Space Gear 2.5TDI 4x4
I think what happens Wolfe is the chain jumping causes massive load on the output bearings. I would either fit a new chain or a very good used one, replace the output bearings and re-assemble to the factory spec.
My feeling is a properly assembled case (in good condition) will take the extra torque.
The same thing happened to a friends 3.5 V6 the chain started jumping and stuffed the output bearings the vehicle had only done 110,000K's
My feeling is a properly assembled case (in good condition) will take the extra torque.
The same thing happened to a friends 3.5 V6 the chain started jumping and stuffed the output bearings the vehicle had only done 110,000K's
I just luv my "clacker Jabber"
Hallo Frank,
25mm are definateliy to much. What do you think about different bearings.
Especially at frontwheelshaft is
is one ballbearing enough the bearing under the lit t could be replaced by a rollbearing cause it is stronger. There should be not very much axial power so one Ballbearing is sufficient.
At the Rearshaft I´going to replace the singlerow bearing to twop row type.
Unfortunetly a new chain is very expensive it costs 397 euros
Wolf
25mm are definateliy to much. What do you think about different bearings.
Especially at frontwheelshaft is
is one ballbearing enough the bearing under the lit t could be replaced by a rollbearing cause it is stronger. There should be not very much axial power so one Ballbearing is sufficient.
At the Rearshaft I´going to replace the singlerow bearing to twop row type.
Unfortunetly a new chain is very expensive it costs 397 euros
Wolf
L300 2.5TDI 4x4, Space Gear 2.5TDI 4x4
Hi Frank
do you have any information how much the chain could hang to provide full function of the gear? My workshop manual says nothing about this point . Further more there no information which direction to asemble.
At present I am looking for an alternative chain sorce cause it seem to be a standard 3/8" chain. One of the producer is( www.ramsaychain.com) and one is bosch-rexroth.
Maybe they have a better price.
Do you think a missing clip (part no.31 of the sketch) could have caused the damage?
Wolf
do you have any information how much the chain could hang to provide full function of the gear? My workshop manual says nothing about this point . Further more there no information which direction to asemble.
At present I am looking for an alternative chain sorce cause it seem to be a standard 3/8" chain. One of the producer is( www.ramsaychain.com) and one is bosch-rexroth.
Maybe they have a better price.
Do you think a missing clip (part no.31 of the sketch) could have caused the damage?
Wolf
L300 2.5TDI 4x4, Space Gear 2.5TDI 4x4
Hi Wolfe, I showed Barry your picture (he has rebuilt 4 Mitsu t/cases with 2.85 gears).
The amount of play in your chain with the housing removed is normal as there is nothing to support the front output shaft from moving sideways allowing the chain to slacken. It's only when the cover is bolted on and torqued up with the correct shims that the chain will tension up and if done correctly there should be less than 5mm chain deflection.
He says it is ABSOLUTELY CRITICAL to shim the housing properly and measure output shaft end float as any chain cog misalignment will cause the chain to jump. I remember he spent most of the rebuild time with this part of the assembly with a dial gauge getting the end float spot on.
His feeling is the install was not done correctly
This has happened to Lloyd Swartz a few times when he had early t/cases incorrectly rebuilt by transmission shops which failed quickly (chain jumping) due to incorrect end float.
He also says the single row bearings are more than adequate for the job and no matter what bearing is there if the end float is not within factory spec they will be destroyed very quickly.
He firmly believes these cases can handle the extra torque of the 2.85 gears.
He suggests using your other chain, replace the 3 output bearings and very carefully shim the rear housing and obtain output shaft end float to factory specs.
If you need anymore help just ask I can email you the factory workshop manual for the t/case if you want it.
Frank.
The amount of play in your chain with the housing removed is normal as there is nothing to support the front output shaft from moving sideways allowing the chain to slacken. It's only when the cover is bolted on and torqued up with the correct shims that the chain will tension up and if done correctly there should be less than 5mm chain deflection.
He says it is ABSOLUTELY CRITICAL to shim the housing properly and measure output shaft end float as any chain cog misalignment will cause the chain to jump. I remember he spent most of the rebuild time with this part of the assembly with a dial gauge getting the end float spot on.
His feeling is the install was not done correctly
This has happened to Lloyd Swartz a few times when he had early t/cases incorrectly rebuilt by transmission shops which failed quickly (chain jumping) due to incorrect end float.
He also says the single row bearings are more than adequate for the job and no matter what bearing is there if the end float is not within factory spec they will be destroyed very quickly.
He firmly believes these cases can handle the extra torque of the 2.85 gears.
He suggests using your other chain, replace the 3 output bearings and very carefully shim the rear housing and obtain output shaft end float to factory specs.
If you need anymore help just ask I can email you the factory workshop manual for the t/case if you want it.
Frank.
I just luv my "clacker Jabber"
Hi Frank,
I cant see a posibilty to assemble the case incorectly. There is nothing to adjust the position of the lit which may influence the outputshaft for the frontdrive.
What do you mean by shims?
There are only a few distance rings behind the bearings. The manual give the distance for the assembly of the bearings. But this was o.k.
All I can check when the shafts including the chain is assembled is the distancece betwen the flank of the upper wheel to the flank of the outputwheel. If it is so critical it also may have influence if I use a papergasket or only a fluidgasket.
The chain you see in the picture is more than 4 mm longer than the other both I have (measured when copletly plane). Before I unscrewed the lit I tested the chain throug the hole for oil filling. The result was that I could thouch the housing wall. This chain also feels much more flexible than te other chains.
To day I got more informatiion of those chains. Maybe I will buy a brand new one cause the used one has also 180 k´s (...of course not offroad).
Do you think a 2.85 t-case with the simple switch 4x4 is more stressed when used with 4x4 on solid ground than a superselect with a centraldiff or viskoclutch?
wolf
I cant see a posibilty to assemble the case incorectly. There is nothing to adjust the position of the lit which may influence the outputshaft for the frontdrive.
What do you mean by shims?
There are only a few distance rings behind the bearings. The manual give the distance for the assembly of the bearings. But this was o.k.
All I can check when the shafts including the chain is assembled is the distancece betwen the flank of the upper wheel to the flank of the outputwheel. If it is so critical it also may have influence if I use a papergasket or only a fluidgasket.
The chain you see in the picture is more than 4 mm longer than the other both I have (measured when copletly plane). Before I unscrewed the lit I tested the chain throug the hole for oil filling. The result was that I could thouch the housing wall. This chain also feels much more flexible than te other chains.
To day I got more informatiion of those chains. Maybe I will buy a brand new one cause the used one has also 180 k´s (...of course not offroad).
Do you think a 2.85 t-case with the simple switch 4x4 is more stressed when used with 4x4 on solid ground than a superselect with a centraldiff or viskoclutch?
wolf
L300 2.5TDI 4x4, Space Gear 2.5TDI 4x4
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