L28 MORE POWER NEEDED. MQ SWB

[giffo]

Can you mechanically minded wizards tell me how to get as much power out of my L28 petrol motor so as I can tow a boat that weighs 1.2 tonne. I just need more power to get up hills. Struggles a bit.
What is a good way without spending to much bread?
Currently has extractors, what else could i do???? (without doing a Screwy, ??? V8 conversion Etc.)

Giffo

[bogged]

What is a good way without spending to much bread?

There isnt much you can do to get heaps out of the motor...

Power never comes cheap. or should I say good value for money...

EG extractors and complete exhaust gives you phuck all but costs more than comparing it to the value of a turbo...

Is it a turbo jobby? If so, Take to JPC get the turbo worked, but then you put more stress on other parts of engine, which may be worn, and fail.

If not, get a turbo fitted, or a V6 conversion

[giffo]

A shute, Nah standard L28.

Giffo

[Beastmavster]

Plent of power available out of the motor (they used to tune these things up for datto Zed race cars after all)... however the sad thing is usually power out of small motors will make it worse for loads or towing.


not a lot you can do without hairdrier or cubes...... the 2.8 aint a big motor for that much metal even before the boat

[giffo]

Thanks for that.

Anyone got a noose??

Just have to throw some weight out on the way up the hill. Beer, esky, the wife. Nahh keep the beer!!

Giffo

[RMP&O]

extractors/headers - avaiable off the shelf in Aus but will be less torque and more horse power. SHould rev real nice up to and over 4000rpm's with them

electronic ignition will help a lot and is fairly cheap to do

fit a nice carb such as a Weber

fuel injection it, expensive and custom most likely

If you crack the motor open cam it and increase piston size

jet fuel! Will kill it fast

or how about a blower on it!?

of course some of these I am bsin' but others will help a bit if you want to coax that motor a bit for more umph.

[giffo]

Thanks for that,

Any idea what extra power from elec ignition?
Weber, what size and idea of price? $-----
Jet Fuel, good idea. At least I may get up one hill before it blows?

What other fuel motor can i get that will fit straight in to the gap???
(4.2 ltr or similar????)

Giffo

[MQ SWB]

My shorty mq has had the valve timing slightly advanced which gives it a little more power for the hills, example is hitting the big dipper heading north on the F3 where the mt colah turn off is hit the bottom of the hill at 110kmh and by the time i get to the top still doing just over a 100kmh, I know this isn't fully loaded but it is carrying all my 4wd equipment, hope this helps

Dixie

[r0ck_m0nkey]

Weber, what size and idea of price? $-----

I recently stuck a 32/36 DGV Weber on mine. Brand new they are around the $350 mark, (was when i bought it a few years ago for a different car)

When searching for an adaptor plate everywhere said that they didn't make one and the carby was to small for an L28, which surprised me as it's a bigger carb then the standard one, and takes the same adaptor plate as a Holden Gemini, and obvioulsy L24 and L26. But anyway after slapping it on, my MQ now runs really well but i can't really say if any improvement over the standard carby as mine leaked fuel and had vacuum leaks, so anything would have worked better.

My first point for looking for more power as seeing as an MQ is older is getting the motor running in perfect order first, things like mine with a stuffed carby don't help out in anyway.

[RMP&O]

sorry I don't have a Weber carb number for the L28. I just fitted them to the older P40 and P engines which is a bigger six. Yet, more fuel and a bigger throttle chamber will increase the power. How good it is for the motor in a long term I can't say. One thing to note about an adaptor plate to fit a carb. The taller the adaptor the more power you can get. So a 2" tall plate won't give as much as a 6" tall plate. Or so is my understanding of it...you probily want to know why and I am afraid to say without sounding stupid! Adaptor plates are very simple so if you can't find one any good machine shop should be able to fab one up for a reasonable price. Clifford Performance in the USA has a lot fo this stuff, do search for them in google. Not sure what is available in Aus. Most all adaptor I have seen are made from aluminum.

A Weber kit for the P40 engine in the USA runs near $500!

Electronic ignition can give a bigger, hotter spark and is much more effient. The result is more power but it may not make a huge difference. Like others have said the motor running tops is best and the ignition upgrade will help this alot. Should be able to get a new ignition kit for it for well under $200.

I was kidding (BSin) on the jet fuel. It will tear that motor apart fast. yet, a very very good restoration guy I know reccomends it for breaking in a new motor or rebuilt one. Something about burning cleaner and a little higher compression makes the break in very good for the motor. Result is longer life or so he claims. it illegal to use in the USA though....

Lastly doing searches for motor upgrades to the L28 on google and such should turn up alot. As mentioned in an earlier post this motor was fitted to Datsun sports cars. Yet the sports car L28 will have been tuned differently to give more power than torque. You must find the balance as a huge power increase with a big torque loss is not going to be good for much other than the hwy....IMHO.

[mkpatrol]

extractors/headers - avaiable off the shelf in Aus but will be less torque and more horse power. SHould rev real nice up to and over 4000rpm's with them

electronic ignition will help a lot and is fairly cheap to do

fit a nice carb such as a Weber

fuel injection it, expensive and custom most likely

If you crack the motor open cam it and increase piston size

jet fuel! Will kill it fast

or how about a blower on it!?

of course some of these I am bsin' but others will help a bit if you want to coax that motor a bit for more umph.

Jet fuel? Why would you run kerosine in a petrol engine?

[RMP&O]

I was kidding (BSin) on the jet fuel.

[mkpatrol]

I caught you talking bullshit eh

[ozy1]

the good old L28, all i can say, was when i had mine, i was thinking about a turbo, while this may not be suited to well of road, it will help pull your boat, i would look into findin a factory 280Zx(i think) which came out with factory turbo, swipe the kit and chuck it on, also correct me if im wrong, but they also came out with injection, so it wouldnt be a bad idea to chuck that on too,

for a link there is an injected L28 forsale for $1200
http://www.sssautomotive.com.au/Nissan.htm

[chimpboy]

TOW IN LOW!

[ozy1]

TOW IN LOW!

and what miss the fishing trip

[Big Red Toy]

1. Electronic Ignition Kit.i can now rev above 7000rpm
(This replaces your points, fit it yourself as it takes 10minuts and is easy. Just ask if you need pics / wiring diagrams)
2. Supercharger or Turbo
I am supercharging mine in a few weeks/months will let people know how it goes, with pics of course
3. 2 & 1/2" Free flow exhaust
These engine pump out lots of pressure so a big exhaust helps
4. Snorkel & Less restrictive air filters.
5. New plugs. get some Bosch Super 4's

[Beastmavster]

My datto 240Z had regraphed ignition (Z's have twin point ignition that's much easier than the electronic to find), lightened flywheel, shaved head, port matched, machined and polished, recut valves, polished manifolds with the factory twin SU's, high comp pistons, e88 head, 2 1/2" exhaust, extractors etc etc etc.....

In this form it could show 170kph on the speedo in third (at about 7000rpm) while still wheelspinning with it's 3.7 diff and skyline box.

There is a lot of stuff you can do to one of these engines if you really want to, and up to 300hp is possible.

The other things to consider are: EFI is available on the L28 motors (eg 280ZX in Aus) and the L24 Skyline so there's good source of EFI.

280ZX did come with a turbo option, and if you cant find one of these rare engines there was also a 200ZX Turbo japanese option which you could strip some bits off.

Higher compression and running on premium unleaded works a treat on these engines and will also help offset any sacrifices down low due to cam timing changes.

I've also used a 350 Holley on one of these with an L28 Patrol manifold and that was ok too.

The motor in L28 form is very strangled so anything you can do too free it up is a good thing.


Failing that, start saving up for a RB series engine transplant..... a turbo rb20 is 140-160kw and a halfcut can be had for a grand. rb25 turbos go up to 206kw.

[Big Red Toy]

you can get the electronic ignition kits aftermarket, i got mine from outback 4wd cost about $300

[ozy1]

what is that supercharger off?

[ORSM45]

4agze - toyota. 1.6L 4 cyl.

electric engage (like an air con clutch)

[giffo]

Thanks men,

Sounds like I have some thinking to do.
280ZX or similar, would they fit straight in?
2 1/2 inch sytem sounds good.
EFI off what engine would be easy to fit? What extra wiring etc is needed?
Engine swap????????

Giffo

[V8Patrol]

280ZX motor is the same motor ..... BUT for an ugly differance that stuffs things right up......


The sump is all wrong !
The oil pickup on the 280ZX and other passenger car motors ( given the prefix of L24 ) is at the front of the motor whereas on the L28 its at the rear, doesnt sound like a major drama but there is stuff all diff to oil pan clearance, would clear well with a SOA tho

Belive me I have tried to convert the car type motors to suit and its a shyte load of work to achive it.

more reading @ .....
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... hp?t=10879

and here's a pic of a car type motor, you can clearly se where the problem lies with the sump.
To modify this motor to suit a patrol requires some specialised work like this .......

The swaping of the sumps is straight foward and they do actually bolt straight up, but the oil pickup is the problem...
The location of the rear oil pickup setup is ....
1/
not drilled or tapped for a thread in the L24 >>> solution is obvious and easy to do... drill and tap it !
and the gallery isnt drilled out either so further drilling vertically to pickup the horiziontal part of the gallery is needed
2/
Here's the fugup bit.... the actuall oil gallery runs from the front of the block ( oil pump location ) to the location of the front oil pickup point setup. The problem is that the gallery does NOT go to the rear of the block and therefore has to be drilled ..... finding a 500mm long drillbit to deepen the hole is the first problem, 2nd is getting it to align perfectly, 3rd is not drilling it beyond the rear oil pickup point wich you also have to drill out !!

3/
The oil pickup's themselves are also different in their lengths and the angles they head from the block to the bowl of the sump, be they front or rear pickups. You can only run a front pickup off of the front setup and the same for the rear.
I looked at lengthing the front pickup tube so it could reach the rear bowl setup but the added length becomes the next problem. Over a period of time engine vibration will fracture the tube and it would eventually break off leaving a zero oil pressure situation..... we all know thats a receipe for disaster.
Ofcourse I could have attached the tube to a bigend bearing cap as they do in V8 holden motors but the next problem is the clearance betwen the actual bearing caps and the sump..... not enough room !!! that in turn meant I had to "squash" the tube somewhat where it passes the caps, again this restricts oil flow..... blame the Japannese designers and their close tollerances for that !!!

I'm not sayin it cant be done but as you can see it requires specialist tools and a distinct level of skill to convert the front pickup to a rear setup. The 500mm long drillbit I needed to convert it would have cost $187.00 US .... + shipping + insurance ..... all that just for one hole !!! get outa ere !


Kingy

[V8Patrol]

I forgot something ........

If you want a pic of the clearance issue ( foward sump type engine ) into a MQ let me know ...... I have one here thats getting the shockers removed and solid bars fitted to overcome the problem.... dont blame me it is the owners wishes to do it this way !
Cheapskate tightwad wouldnt buy a L28 would he !




then again why not fit a V8

Kingy

[Beastmavster]

No no no.... use the L28 injection on your L28...... why bother taking out your bottom end if it's good?


Anyway the oil galleys should be there in the block anyway if you really wanna work it out... we are talking L28 versus L28, not L24 v L28 as per V8 Patrol's thread.

The L24/L26 are almost identical (but not quite as he points out), the L28 is a bit different to them although once again most stuff does fit. The oil pump clearance issue has been discussed before as per the link just supplied.... these were close fitting in Zeds to steering as well.

However heads and manifolds are interchangedable so efi manifold off and L24 on yours is no problem.

Remember the L28 was the first one used in the Patrols, and it's the same as in the 280Zx.