The rear has been chopped and the tank lifted 3".
Now chopped the front in line with the bell housing and working on lifting the engine and front cut 3".
Have stripped out all the front IFS crud I think I will have to weld in a temporary Xmember to hold her together as the engine mounts are allowing the rails to flex a bit.
J Top
Notice: We request that you don't just set up a new account at this time if you are a previous user.
If you used to be one of our moderators, please feel free to reach out to Chris via the facebook Outerlimits4x4 group and he will get you set back up with access should he need you.
If you used to be one of our moderators, please feel free to reach out to Chris via the facebook Outerlimits4x4 group and he will get you set back up with access should he need you.
Recovery:If you cannot access your old email address and don't remember your password, please click here to log a change of email address so you can do a password reset.
SAS STARTED
Moderator: -Scott-
Excellent another live axle Jabber 
Make sure you post plenty of progress pics Carl.................
You will find that the 3.0 V6 has very good sump clearance and sits a fair way back compared to a Toyo/Nissan.
The issue is the steering box location with the rear swing pitman arm (we used a resplined 60 Series pitman for mine on the standard box) does limit up travel a bit.
You can get good flex with this set up but if you want serious/extreme up travel some major shit has to be done.
The old IFS crossmember is cut out (hangs down 2" past the chassis rails) and Cheezy replaced it with a tube one.
This gives 2-3" extra clearance.
So what are the plans for the front and rear ??
Make sure you post plenty of progress pics Carl.................
You will find that the 3.0 V6 has very good sump clearance and sits a fair way back compared to a Toyo/Nissan.
The issue is the steering box location with the rear swing pitman arm (we used a resplined 60 Series pitman for mine on the standard box) does limit up travel a bit.
You can get good flex with this set up but if you want serious/extreme up travel some major shit has to be done.
The old IFS crossmember is cut out (hangs down 2" past the chassis rails) and Cheezy replaced it with a tube one.
This gives 2-3" extra clearance.
So what are the plans for the front and rear ??
I just luv my "clacker Jabber"
How does one post pics?
I have finished plating the front chassis cut now , it's good to see the
stg column to stg box angle reduced back to std,it looked a bit extream with the 3" body lift, also I have heard of a few and seen 1 paj with lifts and torn out floor mounts ,possibly something to do with leverage caused by the body spacers , so I plated all the body holes with 3mm.
A few hours on the 9" tomorrow, cleaning up, then start on the new raised g/box Xmember.
J Top
I have finished plating the front chassis cut now , it's good to see the
stg column to stg box angle reduced back to std,it looked a bit extream with the 3" body lift, also I have heard of a few and seen 1 paj with lifts and torn out floor mounts ,possibly something to do with leverage caused by the body spacers , so I plated all the body holes with 3mm.
A few hours on the 9" tomorrow, cleaning up, then start on the new raised g/box Xmember.
J Top
J Top
I think a lot of the floor problems with lifts are from using lift blocks which are too narrow. The factory bushes are around 65mm in diameter, so if you use 50mm lift blocks you've reduced your surface area by 40%. Alternatively, consider that a 65mm diameter block has 70% more area than a 50mm block.
But strengthening the floor is good either way!
Cheers,
Scott
I think a lot of the floor problems with lifts are from using lift blocks which are too narrow. The factory bushes are around 65mm in diameter, so if you use 50mm lift blocks you've reduced your surface area by 40%. Alternatively, consider that a 65mm diameter block has 70% more area than a 50mm block.
But strengthening the floor is good either way!
Cheers,
Scott
I have bitten the bullet and given myself another days work.I am cutting off the 4 remaining body mounts with spacers one at a time and fabbing up new mounts with no spacer so it sits on the factory rubber again.
I will have a go at blowing the dents out of the fuel tank with comp air later ,I have heard of it working but have also heard of tanks coming out like footballs so fingers crossed.The new front Xmember is in,the silly japs use 18mm bolts to locate the bundy arms to the chassis so off to a machine shop wednesday to have some spun up.
J Top
I will have a go at blowing the dents out of the fuel tank with comp air later ,I have heard of it working but have also heard of tanks coming out like footballs so fingers crossed.The new front Xmember is in,the silly japs use 18mm bolts to locate the bundy arms to the chassis so off to a machine shop wednesday to have some spun up.
J Top
sounds good Im at Raumati Beach so Im anly an hour or so away are you in any clubs and can I come and have a look some time as Im always keen to see what others are up to and am real keen to ditch the IFS
cheers Don
cheers Don
84 SWB Pajero 3.8 V6 holden motor & 700R4 trans,rear ARB locker,rollcage,32x11.5 simex ex treackers,pto winch,twin snorkles,
Thanks to some technical support from Thor of this forum I hopefully have some pics.
There seems to be a lot of mud present, I think the flash must highlight it.
#1 shows the rear cut
#2 shows a rear view of more mud
#3 shows the reinforcing plates in position, please note that I cut the rails to make them symmetrical but that meant I had to notch the L/H rail to raise the tank.The L/H rail should be cut 75mm further forwards.The R/H rail can't be because of the Panhard bracing.
#4 shows the new front ass on the floor
#5 shows the front cut
#6 shows the reinforcing plates in position
#7 shows the dummy diff insitu
Once again ,thanks Thor
J Top
There seems to be a lot of mud present, I think the flash must highlight it.
#1 shows the rear cut
#2 shows a rear view of more mud
#3 shows the reinforcing plates in position, please note that I cut the rails to make them symmetrical but that meant I had to notch the L/H rail to raise the tank.The L/H rail should be cut 75mm further forwards.The R/H rail can't be because of the Panhard bracing.
#4 shows the new front ass on the floor
#5 shows the front cut
#6 shows the reinforcing plates in position
#7 shows the dummy diff insitu
Once again ,thanks Thor
J Top
Last edited by J Top on Sun Jan 09, 2005 11:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
Bitsamissin wrote:Hey guys I thought I'd make this thread a sticky as a Gen 2 SAS is very rare.
Carl keep the pics and progress coming it may inspire others to tackle similar Jabber projects
Speaking of pics, when are you going to post more Frank. Did you ever take any pics of the whole process while it was being done.
That Gen 2 shorty looks good. At first i thought the frame drop was a little weird, but it does make sense. Good work and good luck. You guys make me jealous
Angelo
ARB-WarnHS9500i-Skids-OME-2"BattleZ-JAOSlateralRod&RearLadder-16"Excell2w/285BFG-H4Challenger Lights-RoofRack2w/backups&Searchlight IPF-33TSL on Steelies-PIAA-Raybrig-OverheadConsole w/CB-Locked
The radius arm mounts are on,the coil mounts are done and the shocks are mounted.
Following on from Franks advice I was down the wreckers this morning and picked up a LJ78 pwr stg box,it's arm swings at the front giving more room for the Panhard rod, so I will play with that this afternoon.
While I was there I spotted the rear diff in the LJ78 had a factory electric locker so I bought that as well.It has a special housing so I may have to have front tubes welded onto a rear banjo to go in my front.
J Top
Following on from Franks advice I was down the wreckers this morning and picked up a LJ78 pwr stg box,it's arm swings at the front giving more room for the Panhard rod, so I will play with that this afternoon.
While I was there I spotted the rear diff in the LJ78 had a factory electric locker so I bought that as well.It has a special housing so I may have to have front tubes welded onto a rear banjo to go in my front.
J Top
Hi Carl,just doing a research &
I was wondering :
1)Is the front diff u r swapping lj78 the same with kzj78(93-94)
one(both h.p & 8")?
2)Can the pajero's h.p. front diff R+P be used in the bunderas front diff center?
3)Is the pumpkin of the lj78's rear diff on the center or on the driver's side?
4)If on the driver's side.....can it also be used on the rear of the pajero
without causing any problems to the gearbox etc?If yes..., what modifications should be done incl. the fact. elec. locker?
Nice job u doing there!!!
Looking forward 4 the next pics!!!
RASPAS
I was wondering :
1)Is the front diff u r swapping lj78 the same with kzj78(93-94)
one(both h.p & 8")?
2)Can the pajero's h.p. front diff R+P be used in the bunderas front diff center?
3)Is the pumpkin of the lj78's rear diff on the center or on the driver's side?
4)If on the driver's side.....can it also be used on the rear of the pajero
without causing any problems to the gearbox etc?If yes..., what modifications should be done incl. the fact. elec. locker?
Nice job u doing there!!!
Looking forward 4 the next pics!!!
RASPAS
Hi Raspas
The diff is the same but it will be a different ratio, 4.1:1 instead of the
4.8:1 I need to match my 4.9:1 rear.I believe the carrier is different on the 4.1 so you may not just be able to put 4.8 gears on it.
No need to use the Paj R&P as Toyo make close enough ratio's.
The LJ 78 is a L/C so it has an offset rear diff where as the Hilux has a cental pumpkin like a Paj. as Frank told me ,there is no reason to take out the Paj rear as it is stronger than the Hilux anyway, especially in the 2.8/3.5 models. The driveshaft misalignment would be getting quite high with associated short UJ life and vibration problems with an offset diff.
Find a Pajero rear locker or go Arb, simpler options.
The Toyo stg box is mounted and the Panhard brackets are well under way.
Apparently you just cut out a notch in the open diff housing and change some stud positions to accept the elect locker head.
J Top
The diff is the same but it will be a different ratio, 4.1:1 instead of the
4.8:1 I need to match my 4.9:1 rear.I believe the carrier is different on the 4.1 so you may not just be able to put 4.8 gears on it.
No need to use the Paj R&P as Toyo make close enough ratio's.
The LJ 78 is a L/C so it has an offset rear diff where as the Hilux has a cental pumpkin like a Paj. as Frank told me ,there is no reason to take out the Paj rear as it is stronger than the Hilux anyway, especially in the 2.8/3.5 models. The driveshaft misalignment would be getting quite high with associated short UJ life and vibration problems with an offset diff.
Find a Pajero rear locker or go Arb, simpler options.
The Toyo stg box is mounted and the Panhard brackets are well under way.
Apparently you just cut out a notch in the open diff housing and change some stud positions to accept the elect locker head.
J Top
So Carl you have a 2.8/3.5 with factory locker and 4.90 ratio in the back right ??
So you are looking to fit a Bundy HP 4.88 ratio in the front with the factory electric locker ??
The front suspension will be the Bundy standard 3 link ??
The rear suspension will stay Paj (3 link) ??
So you are looking to fit a Bundy HP 4.88 ratio in the front with the factory electric locker ??
The front suspension will be the Bundy standard 3 link ??
The rear suspension will stay Paj (3 link) ??
I just luv my "clacker Jabber"
Hi Frank
Yes a 4.9 factory locker in the rear with rancho air adjustable shocks which I will so be discarding in favor of something with a bit more Quality.
The shocks are mounted upside down and have dented their tubes in the factory mounting position so I am looking at moving them to give more clearance to the rear arms.
The rear suspension has the left arm, rear bolt removed to improve articulation.
The front is a HP 4.88 to which I will be adapting in a factory electric locker.
Factory Bundy 3 link which I will road test to determine if I can remove the right arm front bolt permanintly. I will try and post pics showing the difference this makes to the front flex.
If it needs an anti roll bar I was thinking about using 2 half torsion bars and using an air ram to slid the factory adjuster spline off and on one bar to give me a disconnect in the middle. You can shrink steel plugs onto the torsion bar which you can then safely weld anti-roll-bar arms too.
There are rebuildable self aligning spherical rod ends manufactured over here at very reasonable prices which I used to race with 10 or more years ago, suspensiondevelopments@paradise.co.nz, I will be using one of these on each of my panhards to reduce bind and stress in the rod.
J Top
Yes a 4.9 factory locker in the rear with rancho air adjustable shocks which I will so be discarding in favor of something with a bit more Quality.
The shocks are mounted upside down and have dented their tubes in the factory mounting position so I am looking at moving them to give more clearance to the rear arms.
The rear suspension has the left arm, rear bolt removed to improve articulation.
The front is a HP 4.88 to which I will be adapting in a factory electric locker.
Factory Bundy 3 link which I will road test to determine if I can remove the right arm front bolt permanintly. I will try and post pics showing the difference this makes to the front flex.
If it needs an anti roll bar I was thinking about using 2 half torsion bars and using an air ram to slid the factory adjuster spline off and on one bar to give me a disconnect in the middle. You can shrink steel plugs onto the torsion bar which you can then safely weld anti-roll-bar arms too.
There are rebuildable self aligning spherical rod ends manufactured over here at very reasonable prices which I used to race with 10 or more years ago, suspensiondevelopments@paradise.co.nz, I will be using one of these on each of my panhards to reduce bind and stress in the rod.
J Top
There is more variation in tyre sizes then the difference in the diff ratios.
Remeber you only engage 4wd when there is low traction so wheel
slippage will also be present.
No the rear C/W & P are 9.5 inch and the front is only 8 inch.
The diff is in bouncing,steering etc. The housing needs modifying for the locking head and rechecking for straightness after all the welding.
I am looking at mounting calipers on IFS discs on it at present.The stg column also needs adapting to the toyo box.
I have located an early T/Case without super select which is the next project, lower T/C gears and increased driveshaft length to allow full diff droop in the rear without binding the front U/J in the rear shaft, probably not a LWB problem.
J Top
Remeber you only engage 4wd when there is low traction so wheel
slippage will also be present.
No the rear C/W & P are 9.5 inch and the front is only 8 inch.
The diff is in bouncing,steering etc. The housing needs modifying for the locking head and rechecking for straightness after all the welding.
I am looking at mounting calipers on IFS discs on it at present.The stg column also needs adapting to the toyo box.
I have located an early T/Case without super select which is the next project, lower T/C gears and increased driveshaft length to allow full diff droop in the rear without binding the front U/J in the rear shaft, probably not a LWB problem.
J Top
Carl, 2 things to be mindfull of with the super select system is that you will have constantly flashing dash lights (top 2 green ones) when selecting 4x4 as the diff sensor is no longer connected.
I just had this fixed by an electrician who had to wire in a relay from the 4x4 selector detent switch to the old diff sensor wires. Now as soon as 4x4 is selected the lights come straight on and stay on until I go back to 2wd. If your using a non super select t/case it may take a bit of creative wiring to bypass this. It will drive you mad if you leave it.
The other thing is to plug the vacuum lines from the solenoids that open & close the front diff CAD (located on drivers side wheel arch) otherwise you loose too much brake booster vacuum (power assistance) and pedal effort increases a lot to stop the car.
I just had this fixed by an electrician who had to wire in a relay from the 4x4 selector detent switch to the old diff sensor wires. Now as soon as 4x4 is selected the lights come straight on and stay on until I go back to 2wd. If your using a non super select t/case it may take a bit of creative wiring to bypass this. It will drive you mad if you leave it.
The other thing is to plug the vacuum lines from the solenoids that open & close the front diff CAD (located on drivers side wheel arch) otherwise you loose too much brake booster vacuum (power assistance) and pedal effort increases a lot to stop the car.
I just luv my "clacker Jabber"
Finished lifting the body mounts on the chassis.
Have connected the stg box to the stg wheel.
Started running the twin pipe exh system, you Aussie's have probably never seen a MK 4 Ford Zodiac, had a 3 litre V6 with a twin pipe system back in the late sixties and had a lovely note, unfortunately rather unreliable.
This shot clearly shows the stg box. The front lower bolt on the box goes through the old paj rear lower bolt hole. The box runs 12mm bolts and the hole is 10mm but with the other 3 at 12mm I don't believe it matters.
Running a std toyo U/J and had the toyo spline cut onto the mitsi stg shaft
I had to relieve the inner guard to access the box.
This and the next shots show the chassis brace to support the panhard and how parrallel the panhard and draglink are. The longer and closer to parrallel these 2 are the less effect bump steer will have.
The panhard is temporary, I haven't fitted the rebuildable joint yet.
The cross members both have 5mm plate on the ends to help prevent them from punching through the chassis under load.
The new coil mount from another angle, plus a shot of the new body mount.
This shot is to show the clean belly without the G/Box X member hanging down. You can just see a lump of 4x4 holding up the transfer on the old
torsion bar adjusters X member. The rear driveshaft is disconnected because on 1 of it's 2 phase's it is 40mm off reaching the pinion flange,
I am hoping to fit a non superselect transfer to increase my D/S length.
Frank, spot the ugly pwr stg cooling pipe hanging down, just something else to improve.
J Top
Have connected the stg box to the stg wheel.
Started running the twin pipe exh system, you Aussie's have probably never seen a MK 4 Ford Zodiac, had a 3 litre V6 with a twin pipe system back in the late sixties and had a lovely note, unfortunately rather unreliable.
This shot clearly shows the stg box. The front lower bolt on the box goes through the old paj rear lower bolt hole. The box runs 12mm bolts and the hole is 10mm but with the other 3 at 12mm I don't believe it matters.
Running a std toyo U/J and had the toyo spline cut onto the mitsi stg shaft
I had to relieve the inner guard to access the box.
This and the next shots show the chassis brace to support the panhard and how parrallel the panhard and draglink are. The longer and closer to parrallel these 2 are the less effect bump steer will have.
The panhard is temporary, I haven't fitted the rebuildable joint yet.
The cross members both have 5mm plate on the ends to help prevent them from punching through the chassis under load.
The new coil mount from another angle, plus a shot of the new body mount.
This shot is to show the clean belly without the G/Box X member hanging down. You can just see a lump of 4x4 holding up the transfer on the old
torsion bar adjusters X member. The rear driveshaft is disconnected because on 1 of it's 2 phase's it is 40mm off reaching the pinion flange,
I am hoping to fit a non superselect transfer to increase my D/S length.
Frank, spot the ugly pwr stg cooling pipe hanging down, just something else to improve.
J Top
Last edited by J Top on Mon Feb 14, 2005 5:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Looking good Carl 
You can see what I mean about the pitman arm/steering box set up you are limited with an inwards facing pitman with up travel.
The Bundy axle runs factory under X over so it's not as much of a problem. The factory low steer Hilux arms are what I'm running but with the standard chassis rails hi steer arms hit the chassis rail big time on compression. With a 5 link there is not enough room behind the axle for an X over with all the links. The most I can do is change the steering box to a foward facing pitman arm to make extra room for the draglink under compression. We are going to lengthen the front shock towers on mine to fit a longer shock to get more up travel there is still more room available before the draglink will touch the pitman arm so I'll probly be ok.
With the Bundy steering box did it clear the radiator ok ?
On mine the power steering line we bent around to line up parallel just behind the new crossmember so I just have to make a bracket for it then a bashplate for the front.
You can see what I mean about the pitman arm/steering box set up you are limited with an inwards facing pitman with up travel.
The Bundy axle runs factory under X over so it's not as much of a problem. The factory low steer Hilux arms are what I'm running but with the standard chassis rails hi steer arms hit the chassis rail big time on compression. With a 5 link there is not enough room behind the axle for an X over with all the links. The most I can do is change the steering box to a foward facing pitman arm to make extra room for the draglink under compression. We are going to lengthen the front shock towers on mine to fit a longer shock to get more up travel there is still more room available before the draglink will touch the pitman arm so I'll probly be ok.
With the Bundy steering box did it clear the radiator ok ?
On mine the power steering line we bent around to line up parallel just behind the new crossmember so I just have to make a bracket for it then a bashplate for the front.
I just luv my "clacker Jabber"
Hi Frank
Yes the stg box was an easy fit with lots of room ,only the inner guard needed a trim. It was out of a post 1990 LJ78 and it has the same bolt pattern as an 80 series box. The front arms also have the same measurments as an 80 although they could possibly be a lighter gauge.?
The main reason I fitted it was to give more room for the panhard to be in close and long.
J Top
Yes the stg box was an easy fit with lots of room ,only the inner guard needed a trim. It was out of a post 1990 LJ78 and it has the same bolt pattern as an 80 series box. The front arms also have the same measurments as an 80 although they could possibly be a lighter gauge.?
The main reason I fitted it was to give more room for the panhard to be in close and long.
J Top
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests