2LTE fuel pump to 2LT fuel pump

[bulldogy]

Has any1 changed there EFI fuel pump from the surf 2.4turbo diesel to a mechanical fuel pump?
I need more power down low and cant get the EFI 1 to do it so was thinking go for a mechanical pump and crank the fuel up.
Any ideas
Also need a 1ct turbo form a 1ct engine does any1 know of a wrekker or importer who may have 1.
Thanks
Dave

[toyrex]

replace the electronic pump with a 3L 2.8 litre pump it is a bit richer to suit the turbo

Adrian

[bulldogy]

So adrian do you think this will help with lower end power?
Thanks Dave

[dumbdunce]

it will imporve bottom end power no end. you can also get the 2L-TII pump from wreckers for not too much which is better as it has boost compensation.

get away from the gat toyota turbos and get a garrett or mitsubishi or almost any other brand of turbo on there, the toyota turbos are pretty weak in performance terms, they are generally undersized for the motor and work ok in a very narrow rev range. bumping up your fuel and fitting a slightly better breating turbo will do a lot for you.

[bulldogy]

hey dumbdance thanks mate
Thats why i was looking at the 1ct turbo it has a smaler exhaust vane and boost will come in around 1000rpm where the 1 i have now is at 2200rpm way to late when trying to climb hills and rocks without flying and breaking stuff.
I have an auto so it makes things even worse with no power!!
Dave

[dumbdunce]

hey dumbdance thanks mate
Thats why i was looking at the 1ct turbo it has a smaler exhaust vane and boost will come in around 1000rpm where the 1 i have now is at 2200rpm way to late when trying to climb hills and rocks without flying and breaking stuff.
I have an auto so it makes things even worse with no power!!
Dave

Dave,

the reason your turbo comes on boost so late is because of emissions control - to make a diesel come on boost early you need to overfuel it slightly to get the turbine spooled up, and this creats a little puff of black smoke - the ECU on the 2L-TE prevents this by underfuelling until the turbo is on boost, which creates this unreasonable lag. if you get the fully mechanical pump, it's all adjustable - I had my early 2L-T making 4psi@1200rpm and 10psi@1600rpm - 3000rpm buy fiddling the fuelling and timing, so you don't need to change your turbo. If you put a smaller turbine on there, it will boost right off idle, but will be completely out of breath by 2000rpm, great if you only use it off road but no good for a daily driver.

alternatively if you're clever you could probably "trick" the ECU into supplying more fuel, by altering the signal from the MAP or air temp sensors, to make the engine think it has higher air pressure or lower temperature inlet air and thus supply more fuel for a "correct" mixture.

oh yeah and if it has EGR, you want to ditch all that shizzle off it too.

cheers

Brian

[bulldogy]

Hey Brian
Thanks mate we are going to try tricking the computer first and if that dont work im goin to the manual pump.
Also have blocked the EGR shite long ago.
I found out today that the stall speed in low range 4wd on the flat was 1500rpm so i dont have a chance on severe climbs etc so hopefully fueling it up to get more power down low will help .
Rang a race torque converter specialist and he said he can alter the stall speed to 2000rpm for me so that she gets into more of her power band ,but im not sure if tis would work?
Would lowering the transfer gears help get the wheels turning as i am now? without the extra fuel ? lower gearing means more torque to turn the wheels works on manuals but not sure if it would do the same for my auto.Eg marlin dual cases or 4.7 low range
Any ideas and thanks for your help.
By the way the mechanical pump from the 2LTII did this come out in the surf and did it have the coolant running thru it as i can get 1 of these pumps cheap it has the boost compensator on it aswell .
I can also get the intake manifold to go with it do you think this manifold would work better with the mechanical pump rather than my efi manifold?
Cheers Dave
You have started to make me feel better lol

[dumbdunce]

Hey Brian
Thanks mate we are going to try tricking the computer first and if that dont work im goin to the manual pump.

good plan. do you know what you are doing?

I found out today that the stall speed in low range 4wd on the flat was 1500rpm so i dont have a chance on severe climbs etc so hopefully fueling it up to get more power down low will help .
Rang a race torque converter specialist and he said he can alter the stall speed to 2000rpm for me so that she gets into more of her power band ,but im not sure if tis would work?

keep the stall speed low. it keeps the truck more controllable and avoids shock loading the drivetrain - with the boost coming on lower you won't need higher stall.

Would lowering the transfer gears help get the wheels turning as i am now? without the extra fuel ? lower gearing means more torque to turn the wheels works on manuals but not sure if it would do the same for my auto.Eg marlin dual cases or 4.7 low range

of course they will help but they are high $ options. also you need to make sure your truck has the correct gear driven transfer case for either of those options.

the mechanical pump from the 2LTII did this come out in the surf and did it have the coolant running thru it as i can get 1 of these pumps cheap it has the boost compensator on it aswell .

yes, on early surfs and bunderas to about 1990

I can also get the intake manifold to go with it do you think this manifold would work better with the mechanical pump rather than my efi manifold?

it would look tidier - although you can just pull the throttle butterfly out of the efi manifold then functionally they are the same.


cheers

[bulldogy]

Nah Mate i dont know what im doing lol.
But have a mate who is a electronic technician who already gave me power because the resistors in the efi pump died he made his own resistors on the engine comp and bang more power .
He told me he would try tricking the map sensor to fuel it up as though it is boosting so we will try sort it out .
I can go for the dual marlin crawler if i need i intend to buy anyway so if we cant get the power shell be geared for the power.
Thanks again
Dave

[dumbdunce]

He told me he would try tricking the map sensor to fuel it up as though it is boosting so we will try sort it out .

Dave

yeah I reckon that's the way to go, should even be able to a variable setup with dashboard control if the signal from the MAP isn't too difficult do work out.


good luck, let us know how it goes!

cheers

[bulldogy]

hey Dumbdance
Do you rekn with not that much power that i have ,will lower gears in the transfer make the wheels turn better?
Just thinking if i cant get the power wether the transcase gears or duals will help out never seen an auto with the duals or low range .
Especialy with my low stall converter .
My oldlady is gunna buy the gears and adaptor for me from marlin but i wanna make sure they work with autos and such little power and with my low stall .
Any help appreciated .
Dave

[dumbdunce]

hey Dumbdance
Do you rekn with not that much power that i have ,will lower gears in the transfer make the wheels turn better?
Just thinking if i cant get the power wether the transcase gears or duals will help out never seen an auto with the duals or low range .
Especialy with my low stall converter .
My oldlady is gunna buy the gears and adaptor for me from marlin but i wanna make sure they work with autos and such little power and with my low stall .
Any help appreciated .
Dave

of course the gears or duals will make ot go better (slower) off road, but you have to work out whether it's a worthwhile investment on that vehicle. also I am not sure if the gear driven transfer was ever put behind autos?? you might not be able to fit duals/gears unless you convert to manual? not sure.

cheers

Brian

[bulldogy]

Hey Brian
You can put duals behind the surf auto it has a divorceable transcase its the same as the r150/151 manual bolt pattern all the diff is is it needs a special coupler to oil the rear output shaft.They have done them in the US on the A340f autos and they have the same removeable transcase.
As for worthwhile on the vehicle ive got a solid axle swao detroit lockers front and rear run 35 xterrains onroad and summer fun and 34 JT2 winter so why not have duals.lol
Also run 5.7 diff ratios .

But today my Mate messed with the EFI and fark me she can squeel the tyres on the bitumen when taking of around a corner.And only blows a light amount of black smoke when hammerd at take off.
We took it to the place that hung me up the other day and she could be driven in 2wd- 4wd hi evry where, where last week it was all low range .
The actual ledge she couldnt turn the wheels on we went to the same spot same line while goin up the slope to the ledge i was in 1st low proded the pedal and was spinin the tyres easy got to the ledge and nudged it with the front tyres stoped dead put a little throttle on and she climbed the front wheels easy.
Stoped took the rear wheels to the ledge and stopped dead then idled upto 1100rpm and fark me she started climbing it put the power on a bit got the tyres spinning on the ledge and went over piece of piss.
Had too go back down the ledge and do it again just to make sure we wern't dreamin and yep she just made it so easy.
Thanks for all your advice mate .
Ill leave the duals for now and see how she goes at a harder track and if she wont climb then duals it is lol.
Cheers Dave

[dumbdunce]

Hey Brian
...today my Mate messed with the EFI and fark me she can squeel the tyres on the bitumen when taking of around a corner.And only blows a light amount of black smoke when hammerd at take off.
We took it to the place that hung me up the other day and she could be driven in 2wd- 4wd hi evry where, where last week it was all low range .
The actual ledge she couldnt turn the wheels on we went to the same spot same line while goin up the slope to the ledge i was in 1st low proded the pedal and was spinin the tyres easy got to the ledge and nudged it with the front tyres stoped dead put a little throttle on and she climbed the front wheels easy.
Stoped took the rear wheels to the ledge and stopped dead then idled upto 1100rpm and fark me she started climbing it put the power on a bit got the tyres spinning on the ledge and went over piece of piss.
Had too go back down the ledge and do it again just to make sure we wern't dreamin and yep she just made it so easy.
Thanks for all your advice mate .
Ill leave the duals for now and see how she goes at a harder track and if she wont climb then duals it is lol.
Cheers Dave

very cool! can you post what you did to the EFI to crank it up - there will be other people on this board with similar setups who want to squeeze more power out of it.

if you are fiddling with the fuelling it is a good idea to fit an exhaust temperature gauge so you don't blow it up. the 2L-T's are famous for head cracks if the combustion temps get too hot.

something else to consider if you haven't already done it is to replace the exhaust with something more open and flowing, the stocker exhaust on those things is really choking - won't make much difference on the rocks but on the highway the change will be noticable.

cheers

[mtx]

Are there any issues swapping a 2LT-E and putting a 2LT in on an auto?

I have heard the 2LT will have issues with the auto due to no crank angle sensor.

Thoughts? experience?

I know someone who has a 2LTE that is dying (it is auto) and can get a cheap 2LT to replace it.

[dumbdunce]

Are there any issues swapping a 2LT-E and putting a 2LT in on an auto?

I have heard the 2LT will have issues with the auto due to no crank angle sensor.

Thoughts? experience?

I know someone who has a 2LTE that is dying (it is auto) and can get a cheap 2LT to replace it.

thoughts only:

if the trans is electronically controlled, it could have issues.

possible to swap all the electronics over to make the 2L-T into a 2L-TE ?(only possible if the 2L-T is 2L-TII).

possible to fit only the necessary sensors etc to make the auto work?

possible to swap in a decent engine and auto combo out of a prado/later surf? 1KZ-TE is a far nicer motor than the 2L-T but the electronics could be a headache.

cheers

[mtx]

How do you tell if it is a 2ltII?

It is out of a 1990 Surf

[dumbdunce]

How do you tell if it is a 2ltII?

It is out of a 1990 Surf

easiest way to tell is, early 2L-T has a cast alloy rocker cover like L, 2L hilux engines, later 2L-TII has a pressed steel rocker cover like 3L hilux motor. mid 1989 was the changeover so a 1990 should be a 2L-TII, which is more or less identical to the 2L-TE except for the sensors and pump etc, though I would have thought a 1990 import surf would be an early 2L-TE?? in which case the swap is straightforward?

[thebrunks]

But today my Mate messed with the EFI and fark me she can squeel the tyres on the bitumen when taking of around a corner.And only blows a light amount of black smoke when hammerd at take off.

What did he modify, I'd be interested to find out???

be careful as too much fuel will create too much heat & the 2L head will stuff up!

If he's changed the boost, then definately don't put it over 10PSI.

If you want longevity then leave the donk alone as the 2L won't last long with fuel & boost increased.

Another option will be if the head does stuff up is to put a 3L head on it, they're pretty cheap (a bare head can be bought for $660 new) which can definately handle heat & boost.

Russ

[bulldogy]

guys already got the 3L head on it as for exhaust i have a 3" dump and 2.5" freelow muffler and pipe.
As to the mod he did it temporary he gunna make a proper plug that will look factory and will last .
Exhasust temp mmmmmmm well shes boostin 11psi and she only lets a little puff of black smoke so shes not realy over fuelling but i may get her dynoed!!
If my mate can he may make a few boxes up and sell them if people want?
its god damn easy setup and he can get me more by changing the ohms?
But for now it is just fine .
Dave
As for the auto question and 2lt eng i believe that the auto has its own computer and when i was going to change to manual fuel pump my mate and a few others couldnt see a problem with the auto .
So unless the auto gets signals from parts of the engine that are diff to the 2lte i rekon it should work i was looking at going the 5L and fitting manual pump and auto would have made it work .
But im lucky my mate is a tech and a magician lol .
Cheers Dave
and thanks Dumbdance for helpin me out

[dumbdunce]

Exhasust temp mmmmmmm well shes boostin 11psi and she only lets a little puff of black smoke so shes not realy over fuelling but i may get her dynoed!!

no need for a dyno, it doesn't really tell you anything useful. an EGT gauge permanently mounted is a better investment. with indirect injected diesels, you come to a point where extra boost creates excessive extra heat due to the pumping inefficiency through the precombustion chamber orifice, which can create very high EGT's even with lean fuelling.

Also the factory CT20 turbo is at the end of its useful efficiency at around 10psi at 2500 rpm (measured at about 50% on my oldschool 2L-T, to my knowledge toyota does not release compressor efficiency maps), so to go much higher than that you need to think about high-flowing the existing turbo, or fitting something bigger and better.

good to hear you're getting some good results anyway!

cheers

[thebrunks]

I'm thinking of putting in a potentiometer in series with the air flow sensor when I get the 1kzte in, should be similar setup to the 2lte with electronic controlled pump

Russ