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Did a search and didn't find much so started a new thread instead.
I've put IFS rears into the hilux with new bushes and 200mm e2e shackles.
The IFS rears went well and when I spoke to guys at the suspension shop it almost sounded like I knew what I was talking about cos I got so much info from this site.
Now I need some help with the A frame setup.
I'm not an extreme wheeler as I don't even have lockers yet but would like a decent amount of flex in the rear. I do alot of road driving aswell so don't want the thing swaying everywhere.
I was thinking more like a 15 degree a frame so I can fit longer shocks but nothing stupid. Whats the story to do this?? Is the fuel tank going to get into the way?? Plus what parts do you need to buy etc.. Any tips photos etc would be great.
Last edited by BadLux on Thu Apr 21, 2005 11:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
you dont want a a-frame setup , that is what is used in a 3link suspension setup.
to mount my shoucks like that i have a piece of 50x50x5 shs mounted across the chassis rails with a few diff holes drilled in it at equal distances from the center, thenk the shocks get bolted to it and the bottom is attached with the rancho pins welded to the diff housing, or the bigballs mounts will be even better
shocks work best straight up and down the more they are layed over the less efficent they work
refering to the BBM shock mounts, i have had mine for about 2 years, no problems what so ever, they weld on to the diff asclose as u can to the leaf packs and then the top part to the tube cross member above
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There ya go changed the topic title, Yeh meant a framing the shocks not having a 3 link setup. So peoples opinions are get the bbo shock mounts and attach the top of them to the tubular bar. How do you do the mounts at the top??
Ive actually seen Drop Bears install using the BBM/Snake mounts. If you had adjustable shocks it would prolly be ok. But maybe having the shock so stiff would not be very good for the life of the dampers. I dont know. But that setup cant get much simpler/cheaper. Especially if your after more flex and not so worried about road holding.
Yeah I looked at the upper shock mount but isn't that mount where the 2 shocks are pretty much touching at the top?? Having a 45 degree angle for each shock. Is it possible to keep the stock shock mounting postions and put in longer shocks?? Or do you loose to much up travel?? I defiinitly don't want them almost horizontal because it would be swaying all over the road. Ideally I want to have them come in on a 15 degree angle so I can fit longer shocks in but still have a nice ride on the road. You know what perth is like.. NAZI cops!!
I just set up the snake racing mounts shown above from bbm. You can alter the angle by changing where you mount the lower mounts, i put the lower mounts on the outside of the seam weld on the diff (about 6 inches back from the hub). The angle seems ok (looks about 25-30 degrees) and i have been told that it will work well, ill be wheelin all weekend to give it a thourough test. But ive also been told/read that mounting shocks at too much of an angle is no good too, depends on who you want to believe. Ill just see how it goes like this and alter it to my tastes if need be. If you want to put longer shocks in youll need to make or buy a new cross member. The cross member set up spazbot talked about sounds like a good option.
BadLux wrote:Yeah I looked at the upper shock mount but isn't that mount where the 2 shocks are pretty much touching at the top?? Having a 45 degree angle for each shock. Is it possible to keep the stock shock mounting postions and put in longer shocks?? Or do you loose to much up travel?? I defiinitly don't want them almost horizontal because it would be swaying all over the road. Ideally I want to have them come in on a 15 degree angle so I can fit longer shocks in but still have a nice ride on the road. You know what perth is like.. NAZI cops!!
Well, picture this.
The standard shock mountings are perpenticular (right angles) to the roll centre of the diff. When the diff flexes the shock stresses these mounts out because its bending on the wrong axis. This is multiplied when you have extra travel, as you will with IFS leaves. Its basically a resistance you can well do without.
Second. When you move the shocks to a /\ style setup, you can run a much longer shock. This would have the same effect as lifting up the top mount on the chassis rail.
15 degrees will be fine, and probably just about where you want them anyway for a healthy balance of flex and ride quality. Quite alot of standard utes and 4x4 have their shocks mounted at roughly that angle.
Is it possible to space the top shock mounts (stock) higher to fit longer shocks on?? I have a 3" Bodylift so plenty of room to play with.
Like chopping the mounts of the chassis and spacing them with metal blocks then welding them back on?? about 2-3 higher??
Because I was looking at my exhaust and fuel tank before and they would definitly be in the way if I wanted to bring the shocks in on an angle and mount them of the crossmember.
Also I don't mind if I limit the up travel as I have a single cab ute tub and with the diff being moved back an inch with the IFS rears in, it would probably hit the tub If I allowed them to flew right up into the guards.. What do you guys think??
The right hand pin for the muffler mount gets in the way, i just unbolted the exhaust under the cab and took out the whole rear section and grinded off the mount, sounds like a truck now You could avoid this by putting in a new cross member further back and mount the lower mounts on the back of the diff it should be clear of the muffler mount then. Ill be putting in a 3" exhaust anyway soon but will still run it without a muffler and exit just behind the cab.
You could weld some more plate onto the snake racing mount and redrill holes to extend it, i was thinking about this but didnt bother, id put the effort into a new cross member.
this is similar to what i run on my lux atm, except mine is DMS and not Big Balls. however it seems to work just fine, if i could do it again i would put it on about 15 degree's atm mine is about 40 degrees though, mainly so i get more down travel, i am unsure weather i am maxing out my 14" ranchos, i dont believe i am but i think i might be close at full flex though
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The reason that shoks work best vertically is because that is where they get the closest to 1 to 1 travel with the wheel. As you lie the shock down it travels less than the wheel, as it is moving in an Arc as well as compressing, this softens the shock as it is displacing less fluid, but gives more wheel travel for the same shock length.
J Top
its Grimace having your shocks at 45 degrees with the ifs rear set up. i have rancho 9012's. the shocks are much longer than the travel you get out of the ifs set up. i'd stand them up as much as you can, then your shocks might actually work
STUMPY wrote:its Grimace having your shocks at 45 degrees with the ifs rear set up. i have rancho 9012's. the shocks are much longer than the travel you get out of the ifs set up. i'd stand them up as much as you can, then your shocks might actually work
problem with having them vertical is with the longer shocks u r less likely to achieve maximum up travel, that is the whole reason to inver them in the first place, with the ifs set up u do get a bit of up travel and it is not best to have them fully vertical, how ever slightly inverted at about 15 degrees should cover this, i agree mine are abit over kill at 40 degrees however the shockies are working great
98 Xtra Cab Lux.... slowly filling up with the Budscustoms Catalogue : Street, Track & Trail - Parts & Fabrication Budscustoms Facebook Page
STUMPY wrote:its Grimace having your shocks at 45 degrees with the ifs rear set up. i have rancho 9012's. the shocks are much longer than the travel you get out of the ifs set up. i'd stand them up as much as you can, then your shocks might actually work
problem with having them vertical is with the longer shocks u r less likely to achieve maximum up travel, that is the whole reason to inver them in the first place, with the ifs set up u do get a bit of up travel and it is not best to have them fully vertical, how ever slightly inverted at about 15 degrees should cover this, i agree mine are abit over kill at 40 degrees however the shockies are working great
hmm i agree and disagree. with the ifs set up, i'm not getting 16" of wheel travel out of them so vertically would work better. i agree with the slight inversion, say about 10 degrees
well if i'm prepared to loss a bit of up travel i might just stick with them being vertical, Aslong as they work better than whats in there now i'll be happy. To much mucking around to get a 10 degree angle. I'll just c how they go when I can afford the right length shocks.
just lookin under a 75 series, the stocky shock mounts are good on those, about perfect angle and all the top mount consists of is a hole drilled horazontally though the Xmember( tube same as lux one) and a peice of solid rod though it that a shock eye fits over.. like 15 mm or whatevr dia it is.. its just ring welded around both holes and then threaded on the end to tighten a nut up on... looks simple as..!
just an idea??
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The exhaust now exits at the rear as it was needed for engineering. I have also extended the handbrake cable bits that come over the springs and the PCV bracket which were also done after the pic was taken.
STUMPY wrote:its Grimace having your shocks at 45 degrees with the ifs rear set up. i have rancho 9012's. the shocks are much longer than the travel you get out of the ifs set up. i'd stand them up as much as you can, then your shocks might actually work
problem with having them vertical is with the longer shocks u r less likely to achieve maximum up travel, that is the whole reason to inver them in the first place, with the ifs set up u do get a bit of up travel and it is not best to have them fully vertical, how ever slightly inverted at about 15 degrees should cover this, i agree mine are abit over kill at 40 degrees however the shockies are working great
hmm i agree and disagree. with the ifs set up, i'm not getting 16" of wheel travel out of them so vertically would work better. i agree with the slight inversion, say about 10 degrees
Sorry to sound annoying but to invert something is to reverse it or turn it upside down. Just pointing it out to save confusion. People come on and read this stuff and get confused by small mistakes like that. Leads to things like calling this shock set up and A-frame lol. Soon people will be calling it an inverted shock set up.
