shackle Q

Post by **-ZukChiK-** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 3:58 pm

Can anyone tell me the difference between using box tube, flat bar or bolt (or bolt thru round tube) for making the centre's in extended shackles?
Does it really make that much difference? I'm about to draw up a plan for making 25 or 30mm extension length (and no I can't weld but my friends can!)

I've noticed there are plenty of styles to go by, just want a quick definition of what each design is purposely built for?

Anyone got any thoughts? help much appreciated and yes I have searched but not answers Im looking for

Jo

Post by **mudfkr** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 5:21 pm

Theres not alot in it really,
Box section, Flat or tube it all does the same job.
I prefer to use 25x25x3mm box just cause I like they way they look when finished compared to the flat. Heres a pix of the ones I make which are +50mm.

Shane

Edit: If your going to put new bushes in buy them before you design your shackles as I found nolathane have different sized heads compared to OEM ones

Post by **-ZukChiK-** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 5:53 pm

Hi Shane,

Thanks for your info, your shackles look tough

Bit like the Trail Tough's Bones design.... Is there an advantage to the bone shape?

Also, can i ask how thick the steel you used? Do you get much flex or is that gained through the bushes & bolts being loosened up a bit?

Cheeeerz,

Jo

Noted: buy new bushes first!

Post by **Spike_Sierra** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 6:44 pm

300mm long shackles are going to be pretty big. will mess around with the steering quiet a bit.
mine are 50mm longer so they are 120mm long.

Post by **-ZukChiK-** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 7:34 pm

Spike_Sierra wrote:300mm long shackles are going to be pretty big. will mess around with the steering quiet a bit.
mine are 50mm longer so they are 120mm long.

oops

, that was a typo obviously 30mm longer than standard is what i was meant to say

...although 300mm would be pretty funny

Post by **alien** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 7:41 pm

yeah just take a look at the 'project goat' thread =)

Post by **mudfkr** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 7:50 pm

Suzuki Surf Chik wrote:Hi Shane,
Is there an advantage to the bone shape?!

They look more professionally made rather than a chunk of flat bar cut off with two holes punched thru it, thats about all.

Suzuki Surf Chick wrote:Also, can i ask how thick the steel you used? Do you get much flex or is that gained through the bushes & bolts being loosened up a bit?

50x10mm flat bar with 25x25x3mm RHS for the cross bar.
With stock springs and shocks you not going to gain F all extra flex with a longer shackle so I don't bother running them lose. Remember to with 50mm longer shackle you'll only gain 25mm of lift

Just some thing else I remembered as well,
The stock shackle pins are some thing like 13.?mm with the nut end at M12 and you'll find you've ether got to use a 12mm bolt which is sloppy as in the new bushes or go to 14mm and skim the shoulder part of the bolt which will be in contact with the bush down in a lathe so its a nice fit rather than tight fit which will chew the bushes out in next to no time.

The pic below shows the LH front shackle wrenched around as much as we could get it to see it was interfering with flex,you can decide for yourself but I don't think it does

HTH
Shane

Post by **-ZukChiK-** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 7:50 pm

alien wrote:yeah just take a look at the 'project goat' thread =)

i'm not makin' a buggy

I was after shackle designs/info for a "less extreme" zook......

Anyone else got more pics of their own made shackles & suspension setup?

Shane... Thanks heaps!

Post by **derelict_frog** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 11:34 pm

Heres the ones we made for our non registered one cause the springs hang upside down.

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... hp?id=7520

from http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... hp?t=41916

Keeps the front nice and high now! :lol:

Post by **christover1** » Mon Apr 25, 2005 11:49 pm

these are easy to make, cheap, and allow good twist so springs can move easily...I think centre bars limit twist...I dont think centre bar is needed on light trucks and only a small extension..just my opinion. these re-use original shackle pins, have same metal thickness, as the original plates, so therefore same tightness/looseness as original pins..
christover

Post by **Tim D** » Tue Apr 26, 2005 9:13 am

I think you put a centre bolt in extended shackels , so the shackels don't wear out the bolt holes or the bolts, as that is what the bushes are designed for ,to wear and flex. Keeping the shackels stiff will prolong their life, imagine breaking one in the simpson desert or 4hrs drive to the nearest replacement

I personally would not weld between the shackels, rather bolt a piece in there of thick walled tube, my reasoning behind this is once you weld mild steel you could possibly harden the steel ,which makes it brittle and find it cracking from a weld, also depending on how you let them cool down after welding

Having a bolt in the middle helps if you want to interchange or replace warn shackels, also easier to fit them back onn (my opinion )

Post by **derelict_frog** » Tue Apr 26, 2005 9:41 am

I think welding would be alright as long as your not going at 200 over clifs, something else should break before the shackles.

BTW christover1 i see your fuel tank is not in that photo, where else do you store it?

Post by **christover1** » Tue Apr 26, 2005 9:58 am

derelict_frog wrote: BTW christover1 i see your fuel tank is not in that photo, where else do you store it?

see this post
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... light=260c

Post by **-ZukChiK-** » Tue Apr 26, 2005 2:31 pm

So, 'mild steel' in the thickness of 5-10mm for shackles is a good start?

I know there are a lot of grades & qualities of metals out there... Can anyone recommend any particular type of steel or other types of metals they have used or think would be better for any particualr reason? I know its not crucial, its only shackles, but I like exploring ideas & materials & designs!

I've seen the new aluminium shackles by Spidertrax but only has install guide on iZook's site. The Spidertrax website don't have any tech/info on them as far as i couldn't find anyway. Anyone know the benefits of using aluminium? I'm guessing it would have to be a harder grade, and its trickier to weld but thats not a huge problem... The angled back shackles seem to be getting around too http://www.izook.com/reviews/st_shackle ... ackles.htm

Anyway, just fishing for every bit of info

Jo

Post by **alien** » Tue Apr 26, 2005 3:08 pm

my drop shackles (home made) use 3mm mild steel... in over 2years they aint broken at all! and they have super twist when flexing cos of the middle pin... no need to go 10mm steel =) thats even thicker than f100s and cruisers use! haha

Post by **sierrajim** » Tue Apr 26, 2005 3:26 pm

Stick with steel shackles. Steel being a harder compound than most alloys will be more resistant to elongating the pin holes.

The C section shackles as on Chris' car protect the nuts and bolts used to keep them together.

If you're doing an extended trip across the simpson desert i'm sure that you could carry a spare shackle if you were worried.

A bridged shackle should provide better onroad handling as will the urethane bushes however a non bridged shackle with rubber bushes will give you better wheel travel. So you'll need to work out what you want out of the car before you build the shackles.

If you do end up using bridged shackles let them cool down naturally after welding them, resist the urge to pour water over them to cool them quicker as this will weaken the weld and the steel.

Post by **-ZukChiK-** » Tue Apr 26, 2005 3:42 pm

thanks guys

.... i wasn't sure how thick mudfkr's were but they look pretty chunky if they are 10mm.... I was thinking 5mm at the most.

I did wonder why originals & chris' were C shaped, so it protects the nuts & bolts, cool.

"bridged'? obviously means the cross bar in the middle, whether its tube or flat... I notice some are off centre too?

Oh and there's no way any of us would pour water onto a weld... That would be silly, thou i guess some ppl would do this out of impatience!

I will weigh up the options with the off & onroad purposes I have in mind...

Cheers

Post by **christover1** » Tue Apr 26, 2005 9:47 pm

Suzuki Surf Chik wrote:I did wonder why originals & chris' were C shaped, so it protects the nuts & bolts, cool.

The originals are probably pressed into shape, and the C shape gives them strength without undue weight. So I guessed that a deeper C shape would keep similar strength with the extra length using same thickness metal...as well as protecting my, oops the shackles nuts... I like to keep mods as close as possible to the original engineering, especially when I ain't sure why it is so

christover

Post by **spamwell** » Tue Apr 26, 2005 11:31 pm

Tim D wrote: Keeping the shackels stiff will prolong their life, imagine breaking one in the simpson desert or 4hrs drive to the nearest replacement

when i first got my car the rear right shackle had no bolt in it at all!! and he drove it like that for 10 years , without damaging anything, so i wouldn't be so worried about that!. looked funny when he took corners

Post by **christover1** » Sat May 14, 2005 9:24 pm

my mate joeys new extended and anti-inversion shackles pix added to this thread. christover

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... c&start=90

Post by **redzook** » Sun May 15, 2005 7:00 am

mudfkr wrote:
Suzuki Surf Chik wrote:Hi Shane,
Is there an advantage to the bone shape?!

They look more professionally made rather than a chunk of flat bar cut off with two holes punched thru it, thats about all.

actually they are bone shaped so on the rear u can get more flex

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