King Spring tech and other bits (WARNING:long)

[Santos]

ok so after 3 months sitting in my garage i finally installed the Kingsprings and it wasn't as quick as hoped.

Bit of background...
When i bought my car the rear saged more on the rdriver side rear. this was over a year ago. So i thought it may have been shocks and finally desided it was springs. Wanted ARB but every time i rang ppl told me i needed this and it only works like that (scary as i rang the same place twice and another place once... three different answers and inflated prices) Decided to go with kingsprings and well... it's not as smooth as i hoped (though very impressed with the quality of the peddder's bushes)

Using 3 jacks i lifted the car with 2 on the same side and one under the diff This was after the first side dropped so i remebered on the other side.

The bolt that holds the leaves together had a size 14 nut on it... the factory ones i took off had a size 12... may not sound like much but after almost being done on the first side i relised the nut would not fit in the hole in the plate underneath.. solution was easy... just take swap the bolts off the old one onto new leaves.. had to waste time pulling the spring out (halfway) to do this)

The springs sit unbeliverly high (measured 82cm from ground to flare lip centre) i asked for standard height but i think this is a lifted.. anyone here with stock tyres check the height against there kingsprings i had to get three 20 year girls to stand on the back so it would compress enough for me to put the shocks in... is this a hint?

The back is now level and the springs are.. err.. springy (not quite jolting over every bump but not bouncy either... much more noticible then the old ones) is this just a breaking in thing over the next few weeks or is this pernament?)

Now that the rears in in i will have to put fronts as the car slants slightly forward.. i was thinking a bolt on RUF and using standard height springs from Dakkar (i hope they are available in more places than ARB)

Assuming that the kingsprings are standard height should i movee them up the front to be 'load bearing' and have the dakkars in the rear?
(í will be getting rid of them cheap if they are indeed lifts.. i want stock height for less body roll and as i run stock 27" i keep speedo's correct etc)

Finally once i get the spring sitiuation sorted i'm hoping for some good shocks... i keep swapping my mind from plain gas to ARB nitro's

do the nitro's fit in the front and back or only the back (or was it the front?) as one Artarmon ARB rep was telling me?

All input is considered, unless it's ranting on about how i should go for lift.

[muppet_man67]

Dakars are arb manufactured springs. you wont buy them elsewhere. it sounds like you shocks are way too short they. should have at least a few inches of downtravel in them when the car is unladen. if your driving round like this its going to make your suspension feel weird.

[Santos]

funny thing is they are suzuki original...

[SiKiD_01]

ok so after 3 months sitting in my garage i finally installed the Kingsprings and it wasn't as quick as hoped.



The springs sit unbeliverly high (measured 82cm from ground to flare lip centre) i asked for standard height but i think this is a lifted.. anyone here with stock tyres check the height against there kingsprings i had to get three 20 year (old) girls to stand on the back so it would compress enough for me to put the shocks in... is this a hint?



All input is considered, unless it's ranting on about how i should go for lift.

any pics?

[Santos]

come to think about it that would of been a good idea hey?


Still i take pics of the suspension and post it up tommorow

Oh and i put the right spring on the left and vice versa... shouldn't matter on rears trhough huh?

[nicbeer]

I think it does as all the springs are cambered.

But this should only effect side to side heights and not front back

cheers

[Santos]

err... explain.. english has failed me today

[Santos]

never mind .. dictionary to the rescue... i'll swap em round friday... if the camber is in the wrong direction it would prob cause it to get lift as it pushed in the wrong way

[CHOPS1]

Hi santos, it sounds like they are lifted if its that high and also heavy duty!
How many leaves are there? mine which are beltons have 6 which is to many(i'm gonna take out the short 2) they are light weight and its overkill!plus its rough.

And they are meant to be on the right side of car, the one that is marked for the drivers is for the suzuki lean! bcoz the fuel tank, transfer and battery and driver are on that side. if you were to put the 2 new ones side by side the drivers side has a lot more arc to compensate.

Chop

[Santos]

makes sense... now just to clarify things... from a mechanic point of view is the Driver side the right or left?


by the way they are 4 leaves

[CHOPS1]

maybe yours arent heavy duty then! i'm pretty sure mine had an R stamped on it and that was the one with more arc(sat higher) when laid next to the other!

It was a while ago so dont hold me to that!

Chop

[Zute]

Umm . I'm pretty sure on mine, the drivers side had slightly less height. Compensates for road camber.
When I fitted my springs, I had very harsh ride in the front because the shocks where fully extended. every time they dropped in a hole it sounded like metal on metal. Now the springs have settled its OK.
Still need new longer shocks.
Lesson 1. Don't mix brands.

[zookimal]

from a mechanic point of view is the Driver side the right or left?

The way you said that concerns me...

Rear has the spare on the right hand side to contend with as well. They may not be lifted, just heavy duty causing the vehicle to sit higher. Not to mention that compared to the sagged old springs in there before the difference could be enough to notice.

Get all four new springs in and assess the situation then.

[Sirzooky]

Hi santos, how did you go with the springs? Did you get new shocks also?
Good luck either way.

[mud4b]

you will find with king springs in std height that on most zooks it will lift it anywhere from a inch to two inches if the original springs have never been swapped before. this is because they sag more than that in a life time. look under most zooks and the springs will form a upward arch.


kings std or lifted do need time to settle down.usually its anywhere from 2 weeks to a month and a half depending on how often the vehicle is driven.

they are also marked rhs and lhs/ front and rear.

if your sitting in the car on the drivers side facing foward (just like you are driving) it is considered the rhs.

[Santos]

thanks MUD4b... it occured to me that they may no be wrong if you where facing the car from the front it wouldn't be wrong.

i'll catch the bus to work today and swap 'em over tomorrow... i have only travelled 26km's on them so i'm guessing it hasn't done any major damage

[mud4b]

it will not do any damage at all..

[Gwagensteve]

Santos,

THere is no such thing as a longer shock for a stock sierra mount. TYou can lengthen the bumpstops, (reducing the compression travel) or fit longer mounts to fit a longer shock.

It sounds to me like for your application, your springs are far too lifted and heavy duty. ARB OME/Dakar medium duty springs would have been the go IMHO. these will run around 30-40mm lift in your application and a nice ride.

If you specifically asked for stock height springs and your rear springs had to be compressed to fit the stock length shocks it doesn't sound like you got what you asked for.

If your springs are this tall, they will be slapping up against the full extent of teh shock absorbers travel and IMHO this is really dangerous not only undesirable becuse it leads to some really poor handling.

Just my 0.2c worth.

[Santos]

thanks, i have decided t swap the springs round tommorow, check height and shock and give it till next tuesday (tuesday,friday days off) if in te time i don't notice a drastic improvement i'm driving down to pedders and seeing how they would like to help me with my problem

I bought them just under r3 months ago but i did say standard height, and light duty so if it means they need to get new ones i'm fine with that.

Any chance if i post up the part number on the springs ppl can confirm what they definitely are?

I think i am going for the basic Dakar front and back and sell the kingsprings, should be good for decembers paycheck.

Any Bolt on RUF kit's anyone can recommend? As i don't know if i should :
-buy dakar rears and put them in the front and decide if the Ruf suits me then buy another dakar rears for the back or if not buy fronts and switch
-Buy two sets of rears and be done with it
-forget the RUF and just go a full set of front and back dakars

I don't want longer shocks but would like to knwo if i can get ARB nitro's on all 4, cause if not i'm not going to bother and will just get 4 regular gas. This will have to wait till i get back from Brazil early next year.

[Zute]

How much extreme off roading in this zook are you planning
Because from the sounds of what you've said before, not a lot if any. I find the front springs let me get good travel. More than my OME shocks can handle. ( part num' OME015)
For my 2c worth, forget the RUF.

[derelict_frog]

I just put 2" springs in my car.. on all 4 corners the shocks just reach i need new ones asap..

Dunno what brand they are, dont say but they seem nice and high, the rear is about an 1" higher though, suppose cause there is no weight and the front ones have the whole engine.

Also couldn't find R or L written on any of the springs snd the F and R were both the same sizes so duno which one went on the drivers side but i put all 4 under and it sits perfectly flat so i must of got it right.

Apart from that the made the ride much better as my stock suzuki springs were dead flat and with long shackles made the ride bad, new springs and shorter shackles is mmmmmmmuch better.


Ah also the bolts and nuts in my springs were a size bigger then the stock ones so on the front they wouldnt fit through the plate hole so we just oxy torched out bigger holes and the rear ones just squezed through the original holes.

[przooker]

if u want a cheap alternative for the rear shocks, just get some rear early model hilux shocks for about $20 a pair and some recent model VS commadore wagon Rear shocks, Eye to Pin. only about $30 to 40 a pair. cheers.

[CHOPS1]

what brand are they coz that is cheap!!!!!!!!
i paid $35 each.

chop

[Santos]

Swapped the springs this afternoon and i must say it was a lot quicker and less work.

Yesteday infested on to car stands for 30 bucks and must say it was stupid doing it with three jacks as this time it was alot more stable, i will probably invest in another set of stands so i don't need to stik a wheel ramp under the diff so i can have both springs out at the same time.

Bolts came out a lot easier this time round and everything lined up perfectly.. last time i had to tug abit this way and that to get the bolts to line up.

Drove it to surry hills tonight and back. The ride is better but it does sort of bob over dimples in the ground... hopefully this is just a settling in thing. Shocks are still fully extended so 5 25kg bags of pool salt weighed it down so i could get them in ( no girls home today).

Recommendations and expected prices on places to get Dakars in Sydney welcome, i'll have a search for part numbers later but if you knw the non heavy duty ones post them up

Still not sure if i should rule the RUF out yet... will this improve my roard ride too? I'm not really a rocky track offroader, but i love to get out on the dunes and cruise on sand.

[Gwagensteve]

santos,

don't bother with RUF for your application.
There is no such thing as "bolt on" RUF. There are some brackets sold by principally USA based suppliers that allow the springs to physically fit, but they do not counter all of the little problems that RUF raises. This I really a modification you nned to have a pretty detailed understanding of haw the car works, be able to do at least some fabrication yourself, and really need the extra wheelbase and travel in ordfer to justify.

For your stated use, Dakar springs and OME shocks will be fine - you will quite happy with how the car behaves.

PS yes, the road ride is better with RUF, but it is too much work to do mostly for that reason IMHO.

Steve.