Willowglen on hold.

Post by **bogged** » Thu Jul 03, 2003 11:51 am

From offroadrigs.

All,
I have to apologise to all of you who have e-mailed me recently and not
got a reply.

>> The fact is, at the time I did not know what to tell you all. I had

>> little information.

>> Please be aware that the 2003 Willowglen Challenge has been "put on hold"

>> until fairly serious insurance issues have been resolved.

>> I have been instructed to stop mailing of any further correspondence

>> including any information on the events and application forms.

>> We ( the committee) have been instructed to carry on with any site

>> preparations in hopes this will be resolved quickly.

>> Rest assured as soon as I get the word all is OK I am ready to send out

>> applications and rules and conditions and classes.

>> I will endeavor to keep you all informed. Please pass on the Challenge

>> e-mail address to anyone interested.

>> challenge@t... for any of the committee

>> or

>> wendyeadon@o...

Thanks to you all

>>

>> Regards

>>

>> Wendy

Post by **RUFF** » Thu Jul 03, 2003 6:18 pm

Spewing when was this supposed to be run?

Post by **Midget** » Thu Jul 03, 2003 6:24 pm

Ruff
Willowglen challenge is run on the OCT long weekend.
Sounds like most events are having problems with insurance.

Jamie

Post by **RUFF** » Thu Jul 03, 2003 6:26 pm

I love QLD

Post by **POS** » Thu Jul 03, 2003 6:38 pm

What is the biggest issue with the insurance?

Is it the RIGS or Courses or Both!

Maybe its time an affiliation with an organisation like CAMS is looked into!

I know in some ways it will make the regulations for 4WDrives that want to compete a little more strict but i figure if they can get insurance for a 1000 HP drag car powering down a drag strip at god knows what speed than maybe they can organise something for a RIG thats trying to go as slow as possible around a course!

Post by **65Mog** » Thu Jul 03, 2003 7:32 pm

The problem comes down to who is responsible if a wheel or tow hook came off a truck and hit someone in the crowd , the owner of the truck or the event organisers ? You can get insurance to cover someone falling over but getting there head taken off by a recovery point is a different story.

Post by **bazooked** » Thu Jul 03, 2003 7:42 pm

PUBLIC LIABILITY its happenin here in the west as well now we have to do a swerve test at 110kmh if ur car is lifted more than 50mm including tyre lift :bad-words:

. even insurance companies ar pullin out of 4x4 insurance makin it hard to insure ur prized rig!! i think its about time the government stepped in and sorted it all out as its goin to get pretty out of hand in the near future!!

Post by JK » Fri Jul 04, 2003 8:28 am

To quote our company Insurance guru:

People seldom appreciate the importance of insurance until they can't get it!

Not being able to get insurance has put the stops on a few of our major construction projects already!!! What hope does a recreational group have if whole industries are being shut down due to insurance problems.

Post by **BUNDERA** » Sat Jul 05, 2003 9:32 pm

A little off topic, so could the answer please be emailed/pm'd to me.thx..

bazooked, what is this about a swerve test at 110kmph could you please enlighten me as I think my bundy would collapse.

Regards,
Nick

Post by **bogged** » Sun Jul 06, 2003 1:05 am

BUNDERA wrote: bazooked, what is this about a swerve test at 110kmph could you please enlighten me as I think my bundy would collapse.

Regards,
Nick

Its common, you have to do it in Vic too...

Post by **getdirty** » Tue Jul 08, 2003 9:42 am

bogged wrote:

Its common, you have to do it in Vic too...

No you don't..... I think you need to find a new engineer!

Post by **Shorty40** » Tue Jul 08, 2003 12:10 pm

BUNDERA wrote:A little off topic, so could the answer please be emailed/pm'd to me.thx..

bazooked, what is this about a swerve test at 110kmph could you please enlighten me as I think my bundy would collapse.

Regards,
Nick

Hell, I doubt my rig could do 110kph :oops:

Post by **thaoldman** » Fri Jul 18, 2003 9:15 pm

Has anyone got an update, is Willoglen still going ahead ???

Post by **hypo** » Fri Jul 18, 2003 10:08 pm

cool that means o got more time 2 get my rig dun

Post by **Webbie** » Thu Jul 24, 2003 10:01 am

I dont under stand what the prob is as far as public liability goes , the reason i say this is that with our footy club we also need PLI and as far as i can gather it covers a bloke getting hit buy a footy too getting hit buy a car we are liable so long as he is on our ground/venue so FIIN.. :roll:

Post by **thaoldman** » Thu Aug 07, 2003 8:57 pm

well its officially postponed:
http://www.tlcc.com.au/html/4x4_challenge.HTM

so....bring your zooks to Zukana:
http://zukana.suzuki4wd.com.au/

Website · Post by **XXXL80** » Fri Aug 08, 2003 8:53 am

the TLCC is having probs getting the right insurance to cover the comp. basically if it was run now and someone was injured either in the crowd or as a driver, both the willowglen organizing commitee & TLCC club commitee would be held liable and could be sued which would mean the end of the club and it's delagates. We can't even run our compulsory driver training for new members at the moment due to insurance reasons.

Post by **Singo17** » Sat Aug 09, 2003 9:48 am

XXXL80 wrote:the TLCC is having probs getting the right insurance to cover the comp. basically if it was run now and someone was injured either in the crowd or as a driver, both the willowglen organizing commitee & TLCC club commitee would be held liable and could be sued which would mean the end of the club and it's delagates. We can't even run our compulsory driver training for new members at the moment due to insurance reasons.

This becoming a serious problem for recreational activities and especially community based ones. It is ridiculus that due to an event occuring someone or something has to be accountable for any abnormal occurance that causes damage or injury.

This is pure sheep mentality. I personally would like to see Legislation which allows events to issue legal waivers to spectators. Sign it or leave. The waiver can only be issued if the event or events are cleared for waiver status by a monitoring agency. A waiver would only be issued if a certain amount of criteria had or has been met.

For instance a Risk Assessment has been made and all risk has been reduced by either physical means or event modification.

Risk assessment is seen as tree huggin shyt but the reality is that it is a great tool for making something safe as can be considering the risk. To the laymen the event might look or be a no different experience.

From some of the events I have been too there are quite a few areas that could be improved at next to no cost and offer vast improvements to safety.

Half the problem is identifying the risks. A good one is winching. Ripper the spotter has a number of restrictions that stem from basic safety principles on winch under load. But the onlookers ie Crowd generally are standing no more than a few feet from the winch rope. General rule all onlookers should be 1 and a half times the winch ropes spooled out length from the rope.

This is a reasonable assumption to make a winch rope safe. If I stand further away from the rope than its actual length and it breaks I will probably not get hit by it. The probably is more like unlikely.

Lets put it in to practice. Say the event is one where winching is either encouraged or is a method for movement. During design and drive rehersals you have identified a spot where it is likely that a pull will be needed. Straight up the easy way to mitigate risk is too shorten the pull by rules or at that point make it crowd free or buffered to the desired distance. For me the best is restricted pull lengths. Even if it is 5 short pulls who cares you will see the best teamwork win that stage with the crowd still able to see the action. Of course these mods would have a roll on effect on timings etc but its all part of it.

I actually think that Insurance companies here are deliberately making Aholes out of themselves for profit sakes but something has to be done. Those idiots have risk score calculators so if we do the same and you can convince one of em that you are actively reducing real risk (but maintaining percieved) then premiums should be as such to suit the risk.

Personally I would forego alcohol in the comp area at all events if this helped

Post by **Squik** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 1:39 pm

Hmmm....what about every other firkin' motor sport? Don't people get injured /killed in any of those? :bad-words:

I used to drive rally and the club I was with run events constantly - easier to get hurt thumping a clutch at 80kph on a loose grade 5 than slo-mo rock crawling. :onfire:

Thanks Mrs (insert name here) for reversing your goddam Merc Wannabee 3x3 into Mrs (insert name here)'s Porsche when you went to pick up the kids from Orphelia Snottgrottles School for Petulant Prats. :bad-words:

Insurance, public liability, risk...........tooth fairy.......boogey man......Santa Claus.........the list goes on.
Hey....who insures Santa Claus.....shit...whoever looks after him would cover it :x-mas:

Post by **bogged** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 9:57 pm

XXXL80 wrote:the TLCC is having probs getting the right insurance to cover the comp. .

Cant the association do SOMETHING for our side??? seems to me they do f u c k all but have a nice air cond office and company car + $80k a yr

Christ they could go to an insurance company and say we have the option of recommending you to 50,000+ members (like TCIS had), @ $1000-2000ea That has to have some sort of pull?

Post by **thunder** » Thu Aug 14, 2003 5:26 pm

bogged wrote:
XXXL80 wrote:the TLCC is having probs getting the right insurance to cover the comp. .

Cant the association do SOMETHING for our side??? seems to me they do f u c k all but have a nice air cond office and company car + $80k a yr

Christ they could go to an insurance company and say we have the option of recommending you to 50,000+ members (like TCIS had), @ $1000-2000ea That has to have some sort of pull?

the toyota club isnt in the association....

Website · Post by **XXXL80** » Wed Sep 03, 2003 9:00 am

this has now been confirmed at our monthly meeting on monday night,

"We have also been able to secure suitable insurance cover for our Willowglen Challenge and our next Challenge has been set for the October long weekend in 2004. There will be no 2003 Challenge"

Post by **twinnie** » Tue Sep 16, 2003 7:05 pm

this is weird the events section of 4wd monthly says it's on same time same place wonder who will turn up? :finger:

or has it been changed?

does any one know?!!!

matt

Website · Post by **XXXL80** » Wed Sep 17, 2003 8:52 am

twinnie wrote:this is weird the events section of 4wd monthly says it's on same time same place wonder who will turn up? or has it been changed?

does any one know?!!!

matt

read the post above!! its off.

Post by **grimbo** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:56 am

you have to realise that a magazine takes about 3 months from writing to delivery so it was still being run at the time of writing but has since been cancelled

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