Converting WT Diff into NT sierra

Post by **Mudsierra** » Thu Jul 13, 2006 6:15 pm

I'm looking into changing diffs over this weekend, i've got NT 1.3L holden drover, i've got WT diffs sitting in the shed, i know i have to change the moun ting points on the diff.

Question is.. Is there anything i should be aware of while doing this progress.. such as brake hose, diff ratio etc?

Any tiny details would be great.

I've looked in the suzuki bible, nothing really helpful.

Post by **joshnz1** » Thu Jul 13, 2006 6:17 pm

move the spring purshes in 50mm each pursh and change the diff flanges over and done

Post by **Gwagensteve** » Thu Jul 13, 2006 7:22 pm

Narrow track diffs are 3.9:1 ratio, wide track are 3.7:1. If your centres are in good condition, use the diff centres from the NT.

You will need the U bolt locating hardware and U bolts from the NT.

It can be hard to cleanly remove the spring mount from the driver side of the NT diff and swap it onto the WT diff.

It i not really that bad a job, just time consuming.

I have done a few sets of spring pads over the years.

Steve.

Post by **Mudsierra** » Thu Jul 13, 2006 7:41 pm

okay, how long do you reckon it'd take to do it in backyard on 4 safety stands?

Post by **joshnz1** » Thu Jul 13, 2006 8:39 pm

why dont u just get 2inch more offset rims,as thats how much wider the wt diffs are,its not worth the effort imo

Post by **jtraf** » Thu Jul 13, 2006 9:52 pm

wheel bearings is why you go WT.......

IMHO it will take longer than a weekend to do the job properly......

I would cut the mounts for the front diff off the front NT and not worry about getting rid of them for dollars as NT are worth nothing.

As steve mentioned use your NT centres as they are lower geared.

Add a couple degrees of caster to the front end while you are doing it to compensate for lift. Also levels the drive shaft out a little.

As you will have to pull the diffs apart to anyway you may as well check all bearings and stuff at the time.

As you can see it will take a little more than a couple days to do right.

HTH

James

Post by **joshnz1** » Thu Jul 13, 2006 10:40 pm

depends on how much mechanical know how u have aswell,all nt and wt bearings a weak as when u run bigger tyres that why people go the lux as they a WAY stronger

Post by **JrZook** » Thu Jul 13, 2006 11:15 pm

joshnz1 wrote:depends on how much mechanical know how u have aswell,all nt and wt bearings a weak as when u run bigger tyres that why people go the lux as they a WAY stronger

wt and nt bearings might be weak as with big tyres that why u'd want to minimise the load on them. ie wt with nearly zero offset will put less load on the bearings than a nt with crazy offset to compensate the width of the wt.

Post by **joshnz1** » Fri Jul 14, 2006 7:55 am

yeah buts its the leveredge of a big tyre aswell

Post by **Nev** » Fri Jul 14, 2006 8:41 am

joshnz1 wrote:yeah buts its the leveredge of a big tyre aswell

the leverage of a bigger tyre wearing bearings only really comes into play when your running a large offset. With minimal offset, even with big tyres, there is next to no leverage on the bearings. The extra wear in this case would be due to weight of the tyre more than anything.

Post by **Damo** » Fri Jul 14, 2006 8:44 am

When doing it pay attention to getting the perches correct. The way I have done it is cut ONE perch off, then position the new perch making sure it is level with the pad on the other side. Measure twice, then tack it, and measure it again. Repeat for the other side.

I have heard the brake cylinders maybe different between NT & WT too (eg, dia inside the cylinder). Can anyone confirm that???

Post by **joshnz1** » Fri Jul 14, 2006 2:06 pm

@nev with a bigger tyre there is alot of leverage there with no off set at all,my bearings use to stuff out all the time and i had hardly any offset,its becasue the tyre is high thats what give it the levering effect

Post by **droopypete** » Fri Jul 14, 2006 2:23 pm

Nev wrote: The extra wear in this case would be due to weight of the tyre more than anything.

The weight of the tyre is irrelevant, the tyre bares the weight of the car not the other way around, it is the height that adds the leverage, mostly during side loading (cornering, off camber and similar), and the leverage is exacerbated by offset.
Peter.

Post by **Damo** » Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:21 pm

droopypete wrote:
Nev wrote: The extra wear in this case would be due to weight of the tyre more than anything.
The weight of the tyre is irrelevant, the tyre bares the weight of the car not the other way around, it is the height that adds the leverage, mostly during side loading (cornering, off camber and similar), and the leverage is exacerbated by offset.
Peter.

I think offset would make more difference than the height of the tyre. In reality when we fit a bigger tyre we also fit greater offset rims so that they fit. This only exacerbates the problem. So IMO:

1. Larger tyres puts more strain on wheel bearings
2. Greater offset rims puts more strain on wheel bearings
3. Larger tyres AND greater offset rims puts even MORE strain on wheel bearings

BUT we are talking about NT vs. WT diffs here. So, to keep things on topic, let me say that, given a certain tyre size, I would rather have widetrack diffs and neutral offset rims over narrowtrack diffs and negative offset rims.

Post by **Mudsierra** » Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:43 pm

I did my homework for the last 2 or 3 months. JOSHNZ1, that is the main reason why i don't want to get a massive offset rim. I'm looking into doing this drover, with WT diffs, 15X7 rim with little offset 10mm maybe..running on 30" tyres. along with 2 inch suspension lift later.. no body lift for a long time.

Thanks everyone for the info, I've already started the swap. will let y'all know the outcome on maybe mon or tues with pic if i can

Post by **Mudsierra** » Sun Jul 16, 2006 9:52 am

I'm stumped atm, how do i get the axles out of the diffs? any help?

Do they slide out or something holding them?

Post by **christover1** » Sun Jul 16, 2006 10:13 am

MudRoza wrote:I'm stumped atm, how do i get the axles out of the diffs? any help?

Do they slide out or something holding them?

If you mean the rears, a slide hammer is best. I bolt the drum on backwards loosely, and use that to pull em off.

If you have trouble with fronts, sometimes if the cv won't pull thru the hole, you need to remove one king pin.

christover

Post by **Mudsierra** » Sun Jul 16, 2006 10:14 am

ah got it figured out.

Post by **christover1** » Sun Jul 16, 2006 10:15 am

MudRoza wrote:ah got it figured out.

that was quick

)

Post by **zookjedi** » Sun Jul 16, 2006 10:34 am

what are you doing with the rear brake lines ? nt 2 wt 1 ?

Post by **Mudsierra** » Sun Jul 16, 2006 10:48 am

i haven't gotten to that part, but will look at it once the diffs are under.

Yes the NT has 2 serperate brakehose and the WT has one. will have look at master cylinder to figure it out.

NT no of teeth Ring : 43 teeth, pinion :11 teeth

WT no of teeth Ring : 41 teeth, pinion : 11 teeth

Post by **Mudsierra** » Sun Jul 16, 2006 11:58 am

oshnz1

PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2006 6:17 pm
move the spring purshes in 50mm each pursh and change the diff flanges over and done

50 mm my arse

I've measure and compared both NT and WT rear diff.. they're 81mm difference so i just got to move the peach 40.5mm

Post by **joshnz1** » Sun Jul 16, 2006 10:48 pm

well i done my front 50mm i side and its fine

Post by **lay80n** » Sun Jul 16, 2006 11:34 pm

The front wheel bearings in a zook have a larger inner and a smaller outer. The offset chosen from the factory is designed that the scrub radius is close to zero, and the centre of the tyre (tread width) is positioned to be slightly biased toward loading the inner bearing (larger one) when standard rims and tyres are fitted. Changing the offset will increase the loading on the bearing, esp on the smaller (weaker) outer. The idea between different offset rims is to be able to correct scrub radius changes and keep steering geometry close to correct with different tyres and also clear brake components etc. Different cars use different offset due to differeng front end geometry and set-up. We 4x4 owners have just been able to use the different offsets to widen our track width.

Layto....

Post by **Mudsierra** » Mon Jul 17, 2006 9:52 am

Now i have spare 3.7 centre diff, NT axles. should i keep them just in case or get rid of them as they're different ratio?

Post by **nicbeer** » Mon Jul 17, 2006 12:24 pm

Worth keepin as a spare.

CVs are the same but axles longer in the WT

nic

Post by **Mudsierra** » Fri Jul 28, 2006 5:47 pm

Finally worked out how to do the photos.. this is before the swap

Post by **Aerenandmel** » Thu Aug 10, 2006 9:57 am

No dramas since you did the conversion MudRoza? Im going to start the same conversion on my 4b this weekend,

Post by **Mudsierra** » Thu Aug 10, 2006 5:25 pm

I have got the diffs back in.. i need to do something about the rear brake line, handbrakes.. i got one on the transfer case, and have cables attached to the rear drum for handbrake, i'm gonna leave that for the transfer case and remove the cables from the rear brake. see how i go for RWC when i get it checked out.

Post by **Mudsierra** » Tue Aug 29, 2006 9:29 pm

here's the lastest....

finally Got new camera woot!

Sorry for the large pic and the blur

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Converting WT Diff into NT sierra

Converting WT Diff into NT sierra

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