Outer Limits 4x4 Board

Shorti wrote:People don't stick around because they can't live off 12 bucks an hour. You can't pay rent, buy food, buy clothes, petrol, medical etc.. on 450 a week after tax. 250 a week atleast for rent. food 60 bucks a week if your lucky... 50 bucks a week petrol. God forbid you get sick...

I do agree though it is hard to get good help. Where I work we had two guys not even make it past morning smoko. Alot of eople are scared of an honest days work, and my job isn't what I consider a hard days work.

450 a week after tax and you can't live off it? my god, i'm only on 450 a week now after 4 years of study and i'm finding it comfortable after the 200 a week i was on in undergrad...

graduated top of my highschool class, always in the top 3 at uni, and got one of the more compeditive scholarships to do my Phd and i'm still on that shit money

what sort of house are you renting for $250 a week? try share accomodation if it's costing too much...

Toli wrote:As said in other post, there is just a lot more choice for young people now. Retail I think is the biggest killer.

A first year apprentice earns what $250 - 300 a week. At 18 you earn more than that a woolies or Macdonalds, throw on top of this management opportunities and the pay goes up as well.

My brother is 20 and a manager at Macdonalds, tried a trade for 6 months did not like so went back to Macdonalds. Pay is better about 40 or a bit under.

I was in the same boat, left school after year 12 and within 4months I was on 40k a year. But in the end Retail sucks and now I have moved in to IT which pays more and have better hours. But try telling that to a young person.

try 60 +k a year once qualified in most trades(and that is just working for a boss),9-5 slot would really get me down.
Not too hard to work for yourself in a trade also and earn 120k+ a year

My Son has just spent 2 years doing his 1st year apprentice mechanic, every 3 months his employer would sack him and hire someone else, I believe it was for the subsidy, after 3 months SUPPOSED TRIAL these bosses would sack him to be able to get the full benefit from the Government subsisies, my son has finally given up and is heading back home (S.Coast NSW) a completely disillusioned kid and bitter about his treatment. After talking to some at Centrelink, this practise by Employers is widespread, hopefully he will get employment down here, Regards Frank.

The trouble is our fu**in government is giving the intelligent highly motivated ones more on the dole than you are going to offer them. wheres the incentive to work?
why would they want to work 40 hours a week for $??? or do fark all and get pretty much a wage.

thats what get me! these lil buggers are getting more a week for doing fark all and they wonder why no one wants to work...

FrankS wrote:My Son has just spent 2 years doing his 1st year apprentice mechanic, every 3 months his employer would sack him and hire someone else, I believe it was for the subsidy, after 3 months SUPPOSED TRIAL these bosses would sack him to be able to get the full benefit from the Government subsisies, my son has finally given up and is heading back home (S.Coast NSW) a completely disillusioned kid and bitter about his treatment. After talking to some at Centrelink, this practise by Employers is widespread, hopefully he will get employment down here, Regards Frank.

these bastards should rot in hell !!!!!!

I did an electronics traineeships straight out of high school. $210/week which I thought was great. 1st year apprentices got $180/week back then. This got me a job with a Telstra company doing exchange installs on about $35k/year. Then I went to a private place that did work for Telstra and got $38k/year and then promoted to $44k/year with car, phone, laptop and all the tools I could ever need. All this by 22. However I soon got bored with it and decided to go to uni at 23. Now I'm 27 and finding it very difficult to get work in my field.

Whoops.

Utemad wrote:I did an electronics traineeships straight out of high school. $210/week which I thought was great. 1st year apprentices got $180/week back then. This got me a job with a Telstra company doing exchange installs on about $35k/year. Then I went to a private place that did work for Telstra and got $38k/year and then promoted to $44k/year with car, phone, laptop and all the tools I could ever need. All this by 22. However I soon got bored with it and decided to go to uni at 23. Now I'm 27 and finding it very difficult to get work in my field.

Whoops.

have friend that is "full time" uni student he is 45 and has done ,teaching,accounting and others ????? faarks me why he has never wanted a job.

dirtyGQ wrote:

Toli wrote:As said in other post, there is just a lot more choice for young people now. Retail I think is the biggest killer.

A first year apprentice earns what $250 - 300 a week. At 18 you earn more than that a woolies or Macdonalds, throw on top of this management opportunities and the pay goes up as well.

My brother is 20 and a manager at Macdonalds, tried a trade for 6 months did not like so went back to Macdonalds. Pay is better about 40 or a bit under.

I was in the same boat, left school after year 12 and within 4months I was on 40k a year. But in the end Retail sucks and now I have moved in to IT which pays more and have better hours. But try telling that to a young person.

try 60 +k a year once qualified in most trades(and that is just working for a boss),9-5 slot would really get me down.
Not too hard to work for yourself in a trade also and earn 120k+ a year

Your key word is once qualified. I also assume the 60k + would be including overtime and working construction. I know a lot of trade people who do not earn close to that.

I want to work for myself one day, will get there just have to work towards it

A good mate of mine just landed an apprenticeship, having spent several years since finishing school going from a uni course that didn't suit to a couple of 'dead end' jobs whilst he decided what he wanted to do. Still probably doesn't 100% but he's more than smart enough to realise its a great opportunity.

But the biggest problem/battle he's facing is knowing there's 3 years of earning fark all. So my question to all those apprentices who did the yards and succeeded, what got you through? What mental 'tips' can I give him.

Hard work ain't an issue, its more of the fact he was earning a hell of a lot more doing a crap job (admittedly with no future), and whilst in 3 years time things will look rosy, there's that 'farrrrrk' at the end of the week when you realise you can barely afford to buy a round.

As for finding a good apprentice, I've never been one so I probably don't qualify to talk, and I know all bosses went through the same 'initiation' stage of shit jobs, shit wage, etc, but IMHO if you make someone part of the team, part of the family, really give them advice/direction, share your knowledge and let them know of their future with the company then you'll increase your odds 10 fold of finding and keeping someone good.

matthewK wrote:im an apprentice boiler maker2nd/3rd yr im 24 and one reason im still in my trade is i want my tickets to be quailfied boilie/welder not only that i do really enjoy what i do 98% of the time

i tell ya i ain there for the money cause it suxs dogs $ 15 an hour just gets me by


but the main reason why most younger people dont stay around is money iv herd any where from 6 bucks to 12 an hour
they expect more in a shorter time frame and it dosent work like that
lost of hard work has to be put in

Boilermaker papers if you are good and wana work is a license to print money in WA . You'll earn 3 times as much once qualified This is in Perth. Up north even more

bad_religion_au wrote:

Shorti wrote:People don't stick around because they can't live off 12 bucks an hour. You can't pay rent, buy food, buy clothes, petrol, medical etc.. on 450 a week after tax. 250 a week atleast for rent. food 60 bucks a week if your lucky... 50 bucks a week petrol. God forbid you get sick...

I do agree though it is hard to get good help. Where I work we had two guys not even make it past morning smoko. Alot of eople are scared of an honest days work, and my job isn't what I consider a hard days work.

450 a week after tax and you can't live off it? my god, i'm only on 450 a week now after 4 years of study and i'm finding it comfortable after the 200 a week i was on in undergrad...

graduated top of my highschool class, always in the top 3 at uni, and got one of the more compeditive scholarships to do my Phd and i'm still on that shit money

what sort of house are you renting for $250 a week? try share accomodation if it's costing too much...

Why don't you start teaching a tute class or two, that pays well. What area is your area of study?

I wasn't refering to my exact situation. I'm in my 5th year of uni and have worked in part time jobs that whole time to just get by. When I have my masteres degree I will be getting the good money, but till now I work a shit job. I have put off being able to buy a house and lots of other things to get my education, I know its disheartening looking at all your mates who have bought houses/boats/flash 4wds/ go out all weekend when i stay home and study.
Shared accomodation is terrible, I have lived in 5 differen't share houses and will never do it again.... Average rental price in perth is over 250 dollars.


Also, being a psychology student with a special interest in organisational psychology, and having worked many jobs where employers complain about high staff turnover I believe that people don't know how to treat others. People needs to be given incentives to stay at a job struggling from week to week isn't going to keep an apprentice on. Setting an apprentice goals and rewards in addition to working with them closely to achieve these would be beneficial to keeping someone on. There are so many jobs out there right now, employers have to do more to keep their employees. It took me 10 minutes to find my current job, one email a call 10 minutes later and I was hired, not even an interview. I started the next morning and had to turn down two other jobs offered to me.

im in my 1st year qualified light duty mechanic, the money isnt too good $24/hr and a company car. but you get what your worth, alot of techs at my work have been in the trade all their lives and dont get what im on. you just can be afraid to ask for a rise, be prepared to move on and you have to be better than the rest. if you get a chance to have better qualifications, a chance to move into another line of the bussiness, extra training you will go further than the average.

i have noticed in just the years i have been where i am alot of the people coming into to trades are the lower achivers from school and are spoon fed there entrie trade. they get to their 4th year or become qualified then people stop doing their work for them they get stuck and drop out, or they become the monkeys that get peanuts to change oil all their lives.

its getting harder now to get the pay rises you want/deserve with the massive influx of impot workers. if your at the same grade as them you have no chance of getting good money, why would any boss pay someone twice the wage when he can get an import to do the same job. this would be a problem for boillies and glaziers as i hear there are alot of good import welders and glaziers. Mechanics have it better cos the work shops their used to in the phillapeens/affrica are far more dodgy than most over here, and they will never move up the ladder and become a seniour tech.

just my 2c's and ramblings

Patchy wrote:im in my 1st year qualified light duty mechanic, the money isnt too good $24/hr and a company car.

are you for real ???? that equates to about $960 a week or say $800 after tax plus a car...that puts you on 40 grand a year take home plus a car which works out around another 30 grand a year....yep 70 grand a year is really crap pay

dave

TEAMRPM wrote:The trouble is our fu**in government is giving the intelligent highly motivated ones more on the dole than you are going to offer them. wheres the incentive to work?
why would they want to work 40 hours a week for $??? or do fark all and get pretty much a wage.

thats what get me! these lil buggers are getting more a week for doing fark all and they wonder why no one wants to work...

who are you trying to fool? the dole is 200 a week IF you qualify for all the rent assistance etc. apprenticeships offer more than this, not to mention the opportunity for overtime.

Shorti wrote:
Why don't you start teaching a tute class or two, that pays well. What area is your area of study?

I wasn't refering to my exact situation. I'm in my 5th year of uni and have worked in part time jobs that whole time to just get by. When I have my masteres degree I will be getting the good money, but till now I work a shit job. I have put off being able to buy a house and lots of other things to get my education, I know its disheartening looking at all your mates who have bought houses/boats/flash 4wds/ go out all weekend when i stay home and study.
Shared accomodation is terrible, I have lived in 5 differen't share houses and will never do it again.... Average rental price in perth is over 250 dollars.


Also, being a psychology student with a special interest in organisational psychology, and having worked many jobs where employers complain about high staff turnover I believe that people don't know how to treat others. People needs to be given incentives to stay at a job struggling from week to week isn't going to keep an apprentice on. Setting an apprentice goals and rewards in addition to working with them closely to achieve these would be beneficial to keeping someone on. There are so many jobs out there right now, employers have to do more to keep their employees. It took me 10 minutes to find my current job, one email a call 10 minutes later and I was hired, not even an interview. I started the next morning and had to turn down two other jobs offered to me.

i do marking to earn a little extra, but as i said, i'm actually comfortable on what i'm earning. i can't teach tutes as my project involves long stints interstate unfortunately, and i can only get the occasional, one off type ones. studying an ecosystem 1000k's from the uni has that effect

but i agree with you, all my mates went into trades, the ones that have finished their apprenticeships are printing money, buying houses, fast cars etc. sometimes you wonder why you bother with the education.

80lsy gq wrote:

Patchy wrote:im in my 1st year qualified light duty mechanic, the money isnt too good $24/hr and a company car.

are you for real ???? that equates to about $960 a week or say $800 after tax plus a car...that puts you on 40 grand a year take home plus a car which works out around another 30 grand a year....yep 70 grand a year is really crap pay

dave

WTF, my pay when i finished my trade was about $15.50 an hour. Stop whinging about your $24 an hour.

Layto....

Layto....

Utemad wrote:I did an electronics traineeships straight out of high school. $210/week which I thought was great. 1st year apprentices got $180/week back then. This got me a job with a Telstra company doing exchange installs on about $35k/year. Then I went to a private place that did work for Telstra and got $38k/year and then promoted to $44k/year with car, phone, laptop and all the tools I could ever need. All this by 22. However I soon got bored with it and decided to go to uni at 23. Now I'm 27 and finding it very difficult to get work in my field.

Whoops.

If you want to move to WA I just saw a couple of jobs which would probably suit you.

Oh and thanks for the DVDs btw...

bad_religion_au wrote: 450 a week after tax and you can't live off it? my god, i'm only on 450 a week now after 4 years of study and i'm finding it comfortable after the 200 a week i was on in undergrad...

graduated top of my highschool class, always in the top 3 at uni, and got one of the more compeditive scholarships to do my Phd and i'm still on that shit money

what sort of house are you renting for $250 a week? try share accomodation if it's costing too much...

Try living in Sydney on that type of money. I was doing it until quite recently and while you can get by, forget about saving or buying anything for your fourby etc. Rent, bills, food, clothes, petrol, rego, a beer with mates (singular), fixing stuff on car etc. rapidly mounts up. And yes, I live in a share household.
Admitedly, I have a substantial debt to repay but even so I reckon $450 a week is far from comfortable.

Oh, and congratulations on doing so well at uni, my GF studies and I am heading into it next year. She is always in the top three in her masters of commerce so I can empathise with how much work it takes to do well. [/hijack]

I am thinking of doing an adult apprentiship,
And i know it will mean a pay cut.
But thats the price i will have to pay for it.

Ian.

i left school 3/4's the way through year 10, by expolsion,

got a job in a panel shop, just rubbing cars back, cleaning up etc,

then got an apprentiship, by the time i was 20, i was a tradesman, still went out every friday and saturday night,

so all youngsters aren't slack arses, just need to find something you want to do,

i would jump at the chance to work in a 4b shop, do you need a painter/ ta

cheers ray

it is funny how much things have gone up ,but not much increase in general wages in the last 6 or so years,not real fair on anyone starting out on an apprenticeship. I have had 3rd year apprentices give up and go on hourly rate just to survive.

ISUZUROVER wrote:If you want to move to WA I just saw a couple of jobs which would probably suit you.

Oh and thanks for the DVDs btw...

No worries.

If you want to PM me the info you have on those jobs it couldn't hurt to look.

I can agree that there is a large amount of young people who are scared of work, I'm 20 and work my ass off in a job thats boring but pays, stacking shelves(aka retail). Ive done a year in a photography course, now I'm trying to save for camera equipment, eg digital camera, lenes, under water housings etc, as I want to get into surf photography. I spend 3-4 days a week at work and the rest surfing, I get shifts offerd to me all the time as when I'm there I work my ass off but the more and more im surfing the less shifts I take extra, as the oceans where I want to be.

I'd like to do a trade in building for something to fall back onto, but can't justify earning less for more work and less surf. taking away from my real ambitions. Also a trade does not give me flexibility to move to the snow and work there like I want to. Also once I get camera gear I will want to travel in seach of surf.

my biggest problem is deciding what it is I really want to do, I really want to do surf photography but unfortunatly there is only a small opening to get into it, I came to surf photography as I've liked taking photos for some time now, and i love surfing.

I finished year 12, and walked out the door with no direction where I wanted to head, took a year off and worked at coles, . spent more than i earned. I didnt want a life at coles so I hunted out a course to do, which I really enjoyed except for the fact I had to work 4 days to pay for a 1 day a week course . Scored good results that I worked hard for, now have got to put it into real world practice.

All in all, I found that the majority of my year level, left school with out any direction, now most that I still talk to are ending there courses and still have no direction or are starting their 3rd course having not finished any of them, It may be that thier is lack of real life subjects in schools, I didn't go so well in my VCE because I hated every subject except media(did well in media). I would have done wood work but 8 was not a big enough class size to run it

anyway enough out of me