Discovery: TDI vs dual-fuel V8 vs TD5

[chimpboy]

Howdy, just trying to pick some brains and do some homework...

What would the pros and cons of these two options be for a bit of touring? I know the V8 won't exactly be economical but what kind of l/100km do you get from them on gas?

Also, what do you need to do to fit 32-33" tyres on them and still keep everything strong and stable enough?

I'm looking for a comfort upgrade from the Maverick.

Cheers,

Jason

edit added td5 to subject line

[cloughy]

Ahhhh, what year disco would be nice for a start

[... rick]

I just did a 2500km round trip to Broken Hill and back and got 13.8l/p 100km from my 3.9. Not running gas, just regular fuel. I was stoked to get this as my petrol 80 series was averaging close to 30l/p 100km!!! Hope that helps some?

Rick.

[chimpboy]

Ahhhh, what year disco would be nice for a start

Dunno, I am looking to spend up to $15k but less if possible, including necessary upgrades. It seems like anything from 1994-1997 is affordable but newer would be fine too.

I'm not that familiar with what changed when so if you can point to which years are crapper/better that would be helpful

[chimpboy]

I just did a 2500km round trip to Broken Hill and back and got 13.8l/p 100km from my 3.9. Not running gas, just regular fuel. I was stoked to get this as my petrol 80 series was averaging close to 30l/p 100km!!! Hope that helps some?

Rick.

It does, a LWB GQ pushes the 30 l/100km mark for gas, a bit better on petrol around 21-22 l/100km on a good day. For a big trip enough this kind of consumption can really affect the holiday budget.

[... rick]

I just did a 2500km round trip to Broken Hill and back and got 13.8l/p 100km from my 3.9. Not running gas, just regular fuel. I was stoked to get this as my petrol 80 series was averaging close to 30l/p 100km!!! Hope that helps some?

Rick.

It does, a LWB GQ pushes the 30 l/100km mark for gas, a bit better on petrol around 21-22 l/100km on a good day. For a big trip enough this kind of consumption can really affect the holiday budget.

That figure was acheived by sticking to around 95kph, and the road is just flat and straight most of the way. Will post around town figures when I know what they are.

[Loanrangie]

If you plan on any long distance touring then a tdi will give good mileage (800-900 +) otherwise a V8 disco on lpg with an extra sill tank will give you cheap local driving and reasonable range on petrol. For sub $15k stick with a late 97-98 D1 with as low k's as you can find.

[ISUZUROVER]

What do you mean by "a bit of touring"?

If you are planning a desert trip then Tdi all the way. I know people who can get as low as 8 l/100km from a tdi disco. Absolute best for a V8 (on petrol) would be around 12.

The V8 is possibly a slightly tougher engine, should easily do 400-500k, but the top end will need an overhaul at 150k (but you maybe already know this?).

There are 2 Tdi engines 200 and 300 (both 2.5L 4cyl). The 200tdi is slightly more agricultural, but very reliable (last ones built 1993ish). The 300Tdi had a couple of problems which are easily fixed - one was the timing pulley alignment, the other was soft cylinder heads. It is not completely clear if the latter is from overheating (or overfuelling), or if it was a bad batch. Either way, both were easily fixed (new head, or timing kit from LR).

Personally, I would take a diesel over a petrol any day.

EDIT - to add to above:
300Tdi introduced 1993-94. The timing "fix" kit has 3 stages, and an early model will need all 3, later models will need 2, 1 or none. LR dealers can tell from the vin what is needed.
The R380 gearbox was introduced with the 300Tdi, (for V8 models also) and is stronger than the LT77S the 200Tdi (and earlier V8s) had.
Early R380's suffered a lubrication problem to the back of the mainshaft, which was an easy fix if caught early ((oil feeder) - but something to watch for when checking one out.

They got upgraded rear axles (10-spline 1.1" to 24-spline 1.24" at some point). Ideally, if you want to run 33's, it would be best to fit aftermarket 24-spline axles and F&R lockers (or at least HD 4-pin centres). Then the driveline should be more than strong enough.

33's (e.g. 255/85-16s) should fit with a 2" body lift and possibly a bit of a trim here and there.

[Michele]

The timing "fix" kit has 3 stages, (...)LR dealers can tell from the vin what is needed.

Here
http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... lt#1020721

I'd go for the Tdi!

[subaman]

In my 89 rangie I get about 400ks to 85L of gas in a 3.5 v8.

[dragonwagon]

My 95 3.9 auto Disco has never used less than 18l/100km on LPG even when driven gently on the highway.

Think 30l+/100km in hard going, low range.

One trip we used 240l lpg/ulp, 300tdi on same trip used 80l diesel.

The V8 sounds great but it sure loves a drink

[chimpboy]

Thanks guys, this is all very helpful info.

I used the Maverick for a desert trip middle of this year, looking at a Cape York trip next dry season and just debating whether to upgrade or take the Maverick one more time before upgrading.

The Maverick kicked ass on the NT trip, actually, but I think a disco would go all the same places and be a bit more comfy.

It sounds like the V8 disco is probably not going to bring enough benefits compared to the Maverick overall.

IsuzuRover - when you say the 200tdi is more agricultural than the 300tdi, what do you mean?

[ISUZUROVER]

IsuzuRover - when you say the 200tdi is more agricultural than the 300tdi, what do you mean?

Only that it is a bit noisier - it is still a great engine.

[Loanrangie]

About 3 months ago i drove Mel - Adl and back, filled up on the way out of Adl 79 ltrs and made it home plus 3 days of to/from work(168k's) - approx. 880 k's to the fuel light and i have got 80k's when on the fuel light. This was loaded with 2 adults, 2 young kids and all their crap.

[chimpboy]

So, would I be able to count on the TDI disco to overtake a road train at 120 without stressing me out too much?

[cutfenders]

So, would I be able to count on the TDI disco to overtake a road train at 120 without stressing me out too much?

No!

[ISUZUROVER]

So, would I be able to count on the TDI disco to overtake a road train at 120 without stressing me out too much?

If you tweak the pump and boost then the performance isn't too bad. But it won't ever equal a V8. There is a thread somewhere on here that shows you how to do the mods DIY.

[Utemad]

So, would I be able to count on the TDI disco to overtake a road train at 120 without stressing me out too much?

If you want to put 32 or 33in tyres on it the road train will be overtaking you.

That is a very big tyre for a Disco tourer by the way.

$15k would get you an early Disco2 V8 but wouldn't leave much for accessories. Especially if you want LPG.

I love my V8 but if I was buying it specifically for a tourer I'd get a Tdi and suffer the slug.

When people mention the 200Tdi and 300Tdi keep in mind that the 200Tdi was 91-93 manual only and has a very outdated interior. The 300Tdi was 94-99 has a different manual gearbox or an automatic plus stronger axles and a much nicer interior. Exterior didn't differ much between the two. Just different rear bumper, headlights, grille etc

Something else to consider for a tourer is going from a GQ to a Disco1 your packing skills will get a workout. The Disco1 is tiny in comparison.
We bought a camper trailer to overcome that hurdle.

[chimpboy]

So, would I be able to count on the TDI disco to overtake a road train at 120 without stressing me out too much?

If you want to put 32 or 33in tyres on it the road train will be overtaking you.

That is a very big tyre for a Disco tourer by the way.

$15k would get you an early Disco2 V8 but wouldn't leave much for accessories. Especially if you want LPG.

I love my V8 but if I was buying it specifically for a tourer I'd get a Tdi and suffer the slug.

When people mention the 200Tdi and 300Tdi keep in mind that the 200Tdi was 91-93 manual only and has a very outdated interior. The 300Tdi was 94-99 has a different manual gearbox or an automatic plus stronger axles and a much nicer interior. Exterior didn't differ much between the two. Just different rear bumper, headlights, grille etc

Something else to consider for a tourer is going from a GQ to a Disco1 your packing skills will get a workout. The Disco1 is tiny in comparison.
We bought a camper trailer to overcome that hurdle.

All good points, thanks.

Maybe I just have to wear the cost of ULP/LPG when touring... something to mull over I guess.

[Utemad]

Go down to a caryard and take one of each model for a spin. Great way to spend a weekend

[awright]

to fit 33s you will need to pick up a set of LRA flares or similar (at least flexi flares) as you will need to do quite a bit of chopping- especially if its a 4 door.

Alternatively you can do a body lift as well and probably get away with minor trimming.

In addition you will need to extend your bump stops (or listen to the scrubbing) and ideally go to 4.11 centres in the diffs (especially if you go for the diesel)- just my 2c

[Mark2]

What engine is in your Maverick/GQ?

If its a 4.2 Diesel, I'd keep it.

I dont think a Disco is going to be much of a comfort upgrade in any case.
The seats are probably better.......

[Loanrangie]

What engine is in your Maverick/GQ?

If its a 4.2 Diesel, I'd keep it.

I dont think a Disco is going to be much of a comfort upgrade in any case.
The seats are probably better.......

You kidding ? a disco shits all over a patrol for comfort and ride, my old man has has 2 x gq's and now a gu and i would rather drive my disco any day. If you fit a cargo barrier then there is bugger all difference in rear space between a patrol and a disco - for the overall size there is hardly any extra room in the patrol. Get a tdi auto if you can as auto's keep the boost on and make for a more effortless drive than a manual, i havent done the pump tweak and i am happy with the peerformance of mine.

[Mark2]

What I'm trying to say is that I wouldnt get rid of a 4.2 diesel GQ (assuming thats what he has) to get a Disco - its probably a backwards step. I've owned 3 GQ's, too many Land Rovers to count (I currently have a 110 V8) and stand by the statement that a GQ 4.2D is a better vehicle overall, even if a Disco is a bit more comfortable. I could give you a long list of reasons why I think this is the case but that would be getting a bit off-topic..........

[Utemad]

What I'm trying to say is that I wouldnt get rid of a 4.2 diesel GQ (assuming thats what he has) to get a Disco

He has a petrol/lpg Maverick so wrong on both counts

[chimpboy]

Grave dig. I am warming up to the diesels a bit.

How much better is a TD5 than a TDI? If my finances don't get r00ted, which sometimes happens, I may be able to stretch the budget to a TD5. BUT... only if it's worth it, because the alternative is to get a TDI and have more to spend on upgrades. And... there are some surprisingly low mileage TDIs out there.

Also, do all the TD5s have the increased overhang at the back, or did that come slightly later in the Discovery II era?

Just hoping that someone may have some helpful advice.

My fear is that if I go for the TD5 I am going to have less dough for mods, AND the mods I want are going to cost more. I would still really like to get 32s under it.

[Utemad]

Td5 only came in the Disco2 and it is the Disco2 which has the longer rear overhang.

The Disco1 Tdi and the Disco2 Td5 are totally different machines so you will either want one or the other.

As for cost, a mate just picked up a 2001 Td5 auto SE7 for $10k privately with I think 200k kms on it.

Disco2 mods are probably not going to cost any more than for a Disco1 depending on what you want.

Air lockers are the same.
Springs and shocks won't be too different pricewise (Disco2 7 seat has rear air springs though).
32in tyres will fit easier on a Disco2 than a Disco1 (although neither would be difficult).
Td5 has more power than a modded Tdi to start with.

[chimpboy]

Thanks mate, good info. That is a good price for a 2001 disco 2... if I could get one at that kind of price I would probably grab it.

[TRobbo]

Although the Disco 2 has more overhang it also has more room for packing gear in the back.

For example in my D1 with cargo barrier installed I cannot fit my 40ltr engel in north south - it has to go east west which is awkward and wastes space. Your fridge will fit N/S in a D2.

There are a few electrical gremlins that appear from time to time with the D2 commonly referred to as the three amigo's. Plenty of chat on aulro.com about this and how to fix it.

32's will fit reasonably easily on a D2. You dont see many with 33+ though.

If it were me, and a tourer, I would go a td5 all the way.

I have a D1 with a 4.6 and gas injection. I regularily get 18 - 19ltrs per hundred while touring and towing the camper.

[chimpboy]

Thanks guys.

Okay, in cases where the seller is not clear, are there quick and easy ways to spot whether the car has SLS and ACE?

And out of the early TD5s, is there anything to watch out for ie must-have options etc. I gather some still have a centre diff lock if you add a linkage back in..?