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Great pic.
Id be interested to see the mounts behind that wheel in the photo.
I assumed that the only place strong enough for the bump to strike would be directly in the centre of the diff housing but now that pic has me thinking...
There is not much room in there eh
Our kit as below, and you can set the triple bypass so that the last 60mm of up travel is the bump past the last compression tube.
AQlso, if fitting hyd bumps, dont use all 4" of up travel, as that is to much for a 10" up travel car, they need an internal spacer so they have a maximum of 2" of hyd bump for front.
Sounds like the King 2inch (2.5inch?)stroke bump maybe the go then.
Does any one know the max angle off 90deg (from the strike plate or whatever as the suspension cycles) that an air bump can operate?
I figure that it shouldnt have to be specifically 90deg cause thats why the ends of them are dome shaped
I guess the further off 90deg the more psi you will need to feed it
Sandy Rut wrote:Sounds like the King 2inch (2.5inch?)stroke bump maybe the go then.
Does any one know the max angle off 90deg (from the strike plate or whatever as the suspension cycles) that an air bump can operate?
I figure that it shouldnt have to be specifically 90deg cause thats why the ends of them are dome shaped
I guess the further off 90deg the more psi you will need to feed it
Mounting them a few degrees off 90 is about right. So the bottom is angled forward slightly to account for the way the diff will cycle about the rear of the control arm.
Use 4-6mm of clash plate.
If mounting them inside a conventional coil inplace of the standard rubber bumpstop (as in Darren's pic), locate them a shade back from the centre. Otherwise on full compression the bump will try to nose out between the wraps of the coil.
still kinda gettin my head around bypass shocks (and terminology ). So the tubes are at different spacings along the stroke - so for triples as an eg 1 tube is for rebound and 2 are compression and of the comp tubes, 1 is "early" in the stroke (from total extention) and one is late
So if I understand correctly is it possible to set the "late" tube with "heaps" of compression so that you can get away without an air bump (when running coil-overs)
Sandy Rut wrote:still kinda gettin my head around bypass shocks (and terminology ). So the tubes are at different spacings along the stroke - so for triples as an eg 1 tube is for rebound and 2 are compression and of the comp tubes, 1 is "early" in the stroke (from total extention) and one is late
So if I understand correctly is it possible to set the "late" tube with "heaps" of compression so that you can get away without an air bump (when running coil-overs)
Any help on this is much appreciated
Conventional shocks, including most coil-overs are velocity sensitive only. By-pass shocks are position sensitive aswell as velocity sensitive.
In a typical triple by-pass, 1 tube is positioned for rebound, the remaining 2 tubes positioned for compression. So yes you can build a by-pass to act as a hydraulic bumpstop in the final 2" of travel. Triple by-passes start life as dual by-passes anyway, and the additional tube is added so you can pretty much position it where you want.
It doesn't give you the same versatility as triple by-pass plus hydro bumpstop setup, but would be more than adequate for majority of winch comp trucks.
ps - hardly anyone uses pneumatic bumpstops these days...they are sooo 2005 Use hydraulic bumps.
If you buy from Aus dealer they should have a good idea on where to start id reckon. You could ask the comp dudes what they run but i doubt if they would tell you
Apparently changing the shims which dictate valving rates is pretty simple, you just gotta be able to rechage with nitrogen. apparently gas pressure and oil type (weight) doesnt change so should be pretty foolproof.....
2.5" fox triples need to be revalved so that the softest setting after a revalve is the same as the hardest befor re valve. they are buggy shocks after all. at obc we wound all the valves up tight and it was not nearly enough above 70kmph.
cheers bru
ADHD Racing would like to thank Mrs Bru @ Sunshine Coast Developmental Physiotherapy - www.scdphysio.com.au , Ryano @ Fourbys www.generaltire.com.au Blitzkrieg Motorsport
I planning on using kings triple bypass shocks and coil overs. I can get them fairly cheap from the usa. but they need to know what valving i would need. Is there any way to work it out ?
Anything is possible, it just comes down to time and money.
Ferals build www.outerlimits4x4.com/ftopic164570.php
the harder the better. there is no point having triples if all tubes are up tight. i would guess 50% harder then standard issue. also Kings are easier to fit than fox having less dead space therefore are smaller for a given travel. I will be running standard valving on mine but my truck will weigh about 1300kg. if you are worried just buy a valving kit. they are easy enough to do
cheers bru
ADHD Racing would like to thank Mrs Bru @ Sunshine Coast Developmental Physiotherapy - www.scdphysio.com.au , Ryano @ Fourbys www.generaltire.com.au Blitzkrieg Motorsport
bru21 wrote:i would guess 50% harder then standard issue............ I will be running standard valving on mine but my truck will weigh about 1300kg.
cheers bru
Hey bru where did you get your kings?
Your reference to "standard valving" has thrown me a bit because I was under the impression that all kings (at least) were custom valved - i.e. specify requirements when you buy/order?
Since their shocks are for custom applications (could be a lightweight truck like yours or a fully loaded pre-runner) I would have thought that it would be almost impossible to even determine "standard" valving
Or do you mean standard valving for a 1300kg truck
I think what bru means is that alot of shocks are brought in with a standard valve stack(close to what is needed)(for stock on the shelf, if that makes sense), and this needs to be tweeked. Bear in mind that even with the valving and weight of the truck given to the makers of these shocks- they still will require re-valving and/or tunning to work the best.
Have you thought about just running a bypass shock and hydraulic bump stop with your lifted coils?? less weight and seem to work very well??
Have you thought about just running a bypass shock and hydraulic bump stop with your lifted coils?? less weight and seem to work very well??
Thats what I'm doing..
Daniels
Yeah have considered the path you are gonna run but am super keen on coilovers so that I can stuff around with my ride height and benefit from long travel i.e run heaps of sag At this point I reckon triple bypass + coilover without air bumps is the go - relying on bypass to ramp dampening near full compression.
Have you thought about just running a bypass shock and hydraulic bump stop with your lifted coils?? less weight and seem to work very well??
Thats what I'm doing..
Daniels
Yeah have considered the path you are gonna run but am super keen on coilovers so that I can stuff around with my ride height and benefit from long travel i.e run heaps of sag At this point I reckon triple bypass + coilover without air bumps is the go - relying on bypass to ramp dampening near full compression.
Good point about ride height adjustment...
It will be easy to get a bypass shock to act like a bump stop in the final +/-3" of travel. When specking your shocks, just make sure the last compresison tube joins the shock body at the length that you want hydraulic bump stop to start, then have a stiff piston valve stack take over... nice...
AFeral wrote:From what i have reead above. Would i be right in saying you can specify the position the bypass tubes are joined to the body.
Yes you can. Triples start life as duals anyway, and the extra tube for compression is added to create a triple. Just specify where you want it located and it will come from the factory as requested. Expect a delay of course, as generaly only standard configurations are kept in stock by suppliers.
AFeral wrote:From what i have reead above. Would i be right in saying you can specify the position the bypass tubes are joined to the body.
Yes you can. Triples start life as duals anyway, and the extra tube for compression is added to create a triple. Just specify where you want it located and it will come from the factory as requested. Expect a delay of course, as generaly only standard configurations are kept in stock by suppliers.
while its there they may aswell put in a couple more too
AFeral wrote:From what i have reead above. Would i be right in saying you can specify the position the bypass tubes are joined to the body.
Yes you can. Triples start life as duals anyway, and the extra tube for compression is added to create a triple. Just specify where you want it located and it will come from the factory as requested. Expect a delay of course, as generaly only standard configurations are kept in stock by suppliers.
while its there they may aswell put in a couple more too
If only it was that easy....Once you start getting into quad by-passes, it gets a bit complicated especially in the larger 3" or 4" dia by-passes, and a coil-over, and a bumpstop. It can be done, but its alot of effort due to limited space (even on a GQ), so alot of cost if you're paying someone to do it.
I think a triple b/p setup to act as hydro bumpstop in the final 2-3" of travel with just a conventional coil could be made to work pretty well in most situations (espec in a lighter truck). Also, it doesn't require anywhere near the fab work and extra weight of c/o and bumpstops. It just won't be as adjustable or flexible to change as full-blown setup.
5 week production time on fox unless product in stock, 10" and 14" available for patrol [we use those lengths] one week turn around to freight from US on air service.
We set triple with last tube as 60mm up travel for hyd bump set up, and if you order the right part No, no need to change valving, even on my 3.8 tonne when loaded offroad tourer on 37's.
ats4x4dotcom wrote:
We set triple with last tube as 60mm up travel for hyd bump set up, and if you order the right part No, no need to change valving, even on my 3.8 tonne when loaded offroad tourer on 37's.
So you're saying that the valving of the shocks as they came from factory (using the "right" part number) are spot-on for your tourer and will also be right for a comp truck that weighs a full Tonne less?
Use hydraulic bumps.
