How do I check which i have?
Also what is a good, yet reasonably affordable rear locker for 90 sierra?
Cheers
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NT or WT
Re: NT or WT
If it is a 90 sierra, it is a wide trackreprise wrote:How do I check which i have?
Also what is a good, yet reasonably affordable rear locker for 90 sierra?
Cheers
Cable bracing is the way of the future!
v840 said "That sounds like a booty fab, hack job piece of shit no offence."
v840 said "That sounds like a booty fab, hack job piece of shit no offence."
lockers
ok....wide track....cheers.
Now i have searched the bible already for the next question for all the search nazi's around.
I had assumed a 4wd meant all four wheels in equal motion. An easy assumption of someone who doesn't own, know much about 4wds. Bit of research shows this to not be the case, hence lockers. Now, after some extensive reading i will probably go for some rear Lockrights for the type of offroad i'll be doing. However, with my sierra, when offroad i engage 4wd mode and lock the hubs as per normal, why would i need front lockers if i am locking the hubs? is this because the stock hub lockers are different or not as good as aftermarket lockers? Also i got bogged in some mud in the watagan this weekend and when trying to move only the front right and back left wheel were moving.....i needed the complete opposite to happen, had i remained in 2wd mode would i have moved both back wheels or just one back wheel, and could that have potentially been a better result (having both back wheels moving then one front and one back). or does that not all make sense.
Also i found some lock rights online for $200 AUS with $40 AUS shipping to sydney...cheaper then any in australia...seems to be a common trend, does anyone know in sydney cheaper lockers to avoid buying from states and having to wait etc etc and is there any tax paid on the items from the states??
With welding the diffs, from reading this is simply a cheaper way to permanantly lock to the diffs for those who know what they are doing? does it mean you need to buy more gear or simply modify(weld) what you already have.
Also shoutouts to moose....tough break man.
And i will prob be needing new tyres soon, i have firestone firehawks which seem to have a pretty poor review....i've had them a yr and half(since i bought the zook) and have found them fine....anyone else use them or recommend others.....will be driving mostly light dirt and rocky tracks with bit of mud inbetween.
Watagan is awesome also.....anyone a regular?? Just so i know how a far up is mackenzie rd in relation to degree of difficulty, drove through it with ease saturday and the zook performed way better then i thought it would....didn't struggle once.
Now i have searched the bible already for the next question for all the search nazi's around.
I had assumed a 4wd meant all four wheels in equal motion. An easy assumption of someone who doesn't own, know much about 4wds. Bit of research shows this to not be the case, hence lockers. Now, after some extensive reading i will probably go for some rear Lockrights for the type of offroad i'll be doing. However, with my sierra, when offroad i engage 4wd mode and lock the hubs as per normal, why would i need front lockers if i am locking the hubs? is this because the stock hub lockers are different or not as good as aftermarket lockers? Also i got bogged in some mud in the watagan this weekend and when trying to move only the front right and back left wheel were moving.....i needed the complete opposite to happen, had i remained in 2wd mode would i have moved both back wheels or just one back wheel, and could that have potentially been a better result (having both back wheels moving then one front and one back). or does that not all make sense.
Also i found some lock rights online for $200 AUS with $40 AUS shipping to sydney...cheaper then any in australia...seems to be a common trend, does anyone know in sydney cheaper lockers to avoid buying from states and having to wait etc etc and is there any tax paid on the items from the states??
With welding the diffs, from reading this is simply a cheaper way to permanantly lock to the diffs for those who know what they are doing? does it mean you need to buy more gear or simply modify(weld) what you already have.
Also shoutouts to moose....tough break man.
And i will prob be needing new tyres soon, i have firestone firehawks which seem to have a pretty poor review....i've had them a yr and half(since i bought the zook) and have found them fine....anyone else use them or recommend others.....will be driving mostly light dirt and rocky tracks with bit of mud inbetween.
Watagan is awesome also.....anyone a regular?? Just so i know how a far up is mackenzie rd in relation to degree of difficulty, drove through it with ease saturday and the zook performed way better then i thought it would....didn't struggle once.
Fair enough, searching won't help with these questions as they're not normally covered on here.
Your car has "open" differentials front and rear. This means that both wheels ALWAYS receive equal torque. (don't get confised by thus.... I'll try to explain) If one wheel is in the air, or on slippery mud, it doesn't take very much torque to turn that wheel. Exactly the same amount of torque goes to the wheel with grip, and that's not enough torque to move the car.
That means that if one front wheel and one rear wheel don't have much traction, or are in the air, your car will stop, and you'll be stuck.
Locking the hubs isn't the same as locking a diff. free wheeling hubs disconnect the front wheels from the axleshaft/differential/driveshaft. This is done to reduce wear, vibration and fuel consumption when driving on the road.
When you lock your hubs, you are connecting the front wheels to the axleshafts so they can receive power, but there is an open diff in the front just like the rear, so you'll only turn one tyre (the tyre with the least traction) in difficult conditions.
The descision about what locker to fit will be based more on what type of ON ROAD driving you're doing rather than off road. Off road, all lockers will basically do the same job, (lock both wheels together) but on road, an automatic locker (like a lock right) will be the most noticeable/ unpredictable, especially in a light, short 4WD.
for daily driven road cars, if you can only afford a lock right, it might be better to put it in the front and leave the rear "open" It's not ideal off road, but neither is a lock right in the rear on road.
If you want to lock the rear, I'd either weld the rear (you don't need to buy anything to do this) fit a trail tough mini spool, or fit an ARB air locker. Driving on road with a welded diff is weird (the car wants to oversteer a lot, especially in the wet) and it's not legal, but it IS predictable, more so than an automatic locker.
However, if you drive your car on the road and want to lock the rear the only way to go is an ARB air locker.
My own car has a mini spool in the rear ( just like a welded diff) and an ARB air locker in the front, but it don't daily drive it.
Hope this helps. Others will have a different opinion.
Steve.
Your car has "open" differentials front and rear. This means that both wheels ALWAYS receive equal torque. (don't get confised by thus.... I'll try to explain) If one wheel is in the air, or on slippery mud, it doesn't take very much torque to turn that wheel. Exactly the same amount of torque goes to the wheel with grip, and that's not enough torque to move the car.
That means that if one front wheel and one rear wheel don't have much traction, or are in the air, your car will stop, and you'll be stuck.
Locking the hubs isn't the same as locking a diff. free wheeling hubs disconnect the front wheels from the axleshaft/differential/driveshaft. This is done to reduce wear, vibration and fuel consumption when driving on the road.
When you lock your hubs, you are connecting the front wheels to the axleshafts so they can receive power, but there is an open diff in the front just like the rear, so you'll only turn one tyre (the tyre with the least traction) in difficult conditions.
The descision about what locker to fit will be based more on what type of ON ROAD driving you're doing rather than off road. Off road, all lockers will basically do the same job, (lock both wheels together) but on road, an automatic locker (like a lock right) will be the most noticeable/ unpredictable, especially in a light, short 4WD.
for daily driven road cars, if you can only afford a lock right, it might be better to put it in the front and leave the rear "open" It's not ideal off road, but neither is a lock right in the rear on road.
If you want to lock the rear, I'd either weld the rear (you don't need to buy anything to do this) fit a trail tough mini spool, or fit an ARB air locker. Driving on road with a welded diff is weird (the car wants to oversteer a lot, especially in the wet) and it's not legal, but it IS predictable, more so than an automatic locker.
However, if you drive your car on the road and want to lock the rear the only way to go is an ARB air locker.
My own car has a mini spool in the rear ( just like a welded diff) and an ARB air locker in the front, but it don't daily drive it.
Hope this helps. Others will have a different opinion.
Steve.
[quote="greg"] some say he is a man without happy dreams, or that he sees silver linings on clouds and wonders why they are not platinum... all we know, is he's called the stevie.[/quote]
Ahhh Grasshopper, the road to knowledge is long for you. 
A normal diff is what is called an 'open wheeler' or 'open centre'.
What this means is that the engine power is delivered to the wheel with LEAST Resistance.
SO.... If one wheel is on the ground and the other is in the air then the power is sent to the one in the air as it has less resistance. This setup works great for most road cars so they can go around corners without tearing up tyres. Not so great off road as you found out.
LSD or Limited Slip Diffs will try to send power to the wheel with MOST resistance through a setup of gears or clutches but they don't always do it.
A Mini or Full SPOOL will lock both axles together so the engine power is delivered to both wheels ALL the time. Not the best for going around corners or driving in wet/snowy/icy conditions, but they are cheap and very reliable.
Welded centre is basically same as a mini spool.
An AIR LOCKER is air activated and fits into an open centre. When activated it becomes effectively Spooled. IE: Axles are locked together.
Locking your hubs doesn't lock the diff, it only locks the hub(wheel) to the axle. The purpose of this is so when road driving your axles and diff centre aren't rotating and wearing out.
That is all. I'm tired.
A normal diff is what is called an 'open wheeler' or 'open centre'.
What this means is that the engine power is delivered to the wheel with LEAST Resistance.
SO.... If one wheel is on the ground and the other is in the air then the power is sent to the one in the air as it has less resistance. This setup works great for most road cars so they can go around corners without tearing up tyres. Not so great off road as you found out.
LSD or Limited Slip Diffs will try to send power to the wheel with MOST resistance through a setup of gears or clutches but they don't always do it.
A Mini or Full SPOOL will lock both axles together so the engine power is delivered to both wheels ALL the time. Not the best for going around corners or driving in wet/snowy/icy conditions, but they are cheap and very reliable.
Welded centre is basically same as a mini spool.
An AIR LOCKER is air activated and fits into an open centre. When activated it becomes effectively Spooled. IE: Axles are locked together.
Locking your hubs doesn't lock the diff, it only locks the hub(wheel) to the axle. The purpose of this is so when road driving your axles and diff centre aren't rotating and wearing out.
That is all. I'm tired.
Want33's - that's a good practical guide but I tried to avoid the "least resistance" thing because it's a bit misleading. Diffs either proportion torque (open or LSD) or they don't... then they're not a dfferential.
I don't know of an LSD that tries to send power to the wheel with the most resistance, AFAIK most of the designs simply distribute a percentage of torque across the axles via worm gears, clutches etc.
They only exception would be the the GM "gov-loc" which uses centrifugal weights to lock up if significant wheelspeed variation is occurring. this can take some (a lot!) of wheelspeed to occur though.
Not having a go at all, and the least resistance thing is a good way of understanding the practical effects of an open diff, but it's not actually what happens.
Steve.
I don't know of an LSD that tries to send power to the wheel with the most resistance, AFAIK most of the designs simply distribute a percentage of torque across the axles via worm gears, clutches etc.
They only exception would be the the GM "gov-loc" which uses centrifugal weights to lock up if significant wheelspeed variation is occurring. this can take some (a lot!) of wheelspeed to occur though.
Not having a go at all, and the least resistance thing is a good way of understanding the practical effects of an open diff, but it's not actually what happens.
Steve.
[quote="greg"] some say he is a man without happy dreams, or that he sees silver linings on clouds and wonders why they are not platinum... all we know, is he's called the stevie.[/quote]
Another good way to get a good mental image or understanding of this is to go ARB and look at their Air locker display it shows the difference between a locked and unlocked diff center.
Or a Favorite of mine at school:
http://auto.howstuffworks.com/differential2.htm
Or a Favorite of mine at school:
http://auto.howstuffworks.com/differential2.htm
..wrench, wheel, wreck repeat..
check out the action @ http://www.darwin4x4.net
check out the action @ http://www.darwin4x4.net
Funny I was just reading another section on 4WD systems and found this..
The Hummer uses Torsen Differentials, so in mud it sounds useless.The AM General Hummer military vehicle combines some advanced mechanical technology with sophisticated electronics to create what is arguably the best four-wheel-drive system available.
As it applies more torque to the wheel with the most traction if they all lose traction say in the mud then do none of the wheels get traction effectively making it useless in a bogged situation.....lolFor the Hummer to get stuck, all four wheels would have to lose traction.
..wrench, wheel, wreck repeat..
check out the action @ http://www.darwin4x4.net
check out the action @ http://www.darwin4x4.net
Er, no it's not.
My dad owned a H1 for years and the torsen diffs work quite well. Basically, you just stand on both pedals and the diffs bind up and the effectivley lock.
The disadvantage of torsens is on long greasy hills - trying to build momentum is hard with one foot on the brake.
He did eventually fit Air Lockers to it, but t hat's not to say the torsens don't work.
Later, civillian versions of the H1 used eaton electric lockers, while military versions continue to use the torsens AFAIK.
Steve.
Steve.
My dad owned a H1 for years and the torsen diffs work quite well. Basically, you just stand on both pedals and the diffs bind up and the effectivley lock.
The disadvantage of torsens is on long greasy hills - trying to build momentum is hard with one foot on the brake.
He did eventually fit Air Lockers to it, but t hat's not to say the torsens don't work.
Later, civillian versions of the H1 used eaton electric lockers, while military versions continue to use the torsens AFAIK.
Steve.
Steve.
[quote="greg"] some say he is a man without happy dreams, or that he sees silver linings on clouds and wonders why they are not platinum... all we know, is he's called the stevie.[/quote]
I used least resistance instead of torque because if a beginner doesn't understand the basics then he/she will have a hard time getting their head around torque.Gwagensteve wrote:Want33's - that's a good practical guide but I tried to avoid the "least resistance" thing because it's a bit misleading. Diffs either proportion torque (open or LSD) or they don't... then they're not a dfferential.
I was going to use the 'one wheel on concrete, one wheel on wet grass' example.
Just trying to keep it simple and limit the number of physics principles to understand.
PS: KAAZ LSD's try to send power to wheel with most torque.
diffs
cheers guys......it all makes perfect sense.....some top notch info there. As air lockers are well and truly out of price range i will pick up sone lockrights.....probably lock the front though.
cheers again!!!! good skills
cheers again!!!! good skills
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