Outer Limits 4x4 Board

firstly, gday guys, i may drive a poojabber but dont hold that against me

just thought id put up about a little project that seems to be gathering momentum with some mates and i seeing as i will doing the vast majority of research here

as it suggest, a good mate of mine put forward the idea of his 1.3L suzi ute to be turned into a trailer queen as a project over the summer holidays. as it lives on the farm that is leased atm it hasnt been run for some time nor has it been given the once over but we are heading down soon to draw up some plans

some ideas floating around at the moment include:
1.6L EFI S/charged engine swap
32"s
wheel spacers
3/4 ellipticals in the rear
RUF, extending front chassis mounts by about 3 to 4"s and using the factory rear mounts
6.5 T/case gears
T/case lift
P/steering
Welded rear, lokka front
exo

at this stage im just getting as much info as possible and hopefully heading down to check the ute out fairly soon to get some more solid plans

any tips, pointers, heads up etc much appreciated

anyway ill try and update as we go

cheers, cam

Firstly im not going to tell you not to do anything, if you want to do it then dont let me stop ya, but a few suggestions.


1.6L EFI S/charged engine swap
With zook running gear it may be a little too powerful if you dont drive it properly, but drivetrain will hold up if youre smooth. A 1.6 say out of a Baleno is still plenty powerful.

32"s
No problem, will need lift and/or chopped guards, plus RUF will help.

wheel spacers
Expect a lot of bearing changes, these put a hell of a lot of stress on components, and many come loose.

3/4 ellipticals in the rear
Consider maybe keeping the zook really light and using nice flexy springs, can get you plenty of flex that way instead of ellipticals. Use longer shocks too. Be careful when youre driving with ellipticals too, if they suddenly unload it can not only feel wrong but also send you on youre roof.

RUF, extending front chassis mounts by about 3 to 4"s and using the factory rear mounts
RUF is a great idea whichever way you go.

6.5 T/case gears
An excellent idea. Zooks really need em.

T/case lift
Not hugely neccesary and puts more angle onto youre drivetrain. Maybe use a bashplate.

P/steering
If youre not so strong in the arms this can obviously help, but its more things to go wrong.

Welded rear, lokka front
Plenty have run this combo with no complaints.

exo
Great for youre panels and occupant safety.

I beg to differ on 3/4 elliptical setups randomly unloading. This is more of a drop shackle trait, 3/4 done right should have smooth progressive flex, I know mine does.

cheers guys pj im open to all suggestions, its just on paper atm and will no doubt change and thats why i posted, to get feed back from you guys.

i will just say a bit more bout the engine swap, its really half the idea we are doing the project so s/c or not a 1.6 should find its way in, ill just keep looking on how to strenthen the running gear

oh and its a trailer only rig, majority of tracks are rocky, bit of mud, bit of clay etc

cheers

GRPABT1 wrote:I beg to differ on 3/4 elliptical setups randomly unloading. This is more of a drop shackle trait, 3/4 done right should have smooth progressive flex, I know mine does.

Fair enough, i can only go on what i read about ellipticals as i have never run it myself. Ive just heard on sideslopes etc it can unload and send you over before a zook on standard suspension will. Or braking downhill.

PJ.zook wrote:

GRPABT1 wrote:I beg to differ on 3/4 elliptical setups randomly unloading. This is more of a drop shackle trait, 3/4 done right should have smooth progressive flex, I know mine does.

Fair enough, i can only go on what i read about ellipticals as i have never run it myself. Ive just heard on sideslopes etc it can unload and send you over before a zook on standard suspension will. Or braking downhill.

maybe in SPOA application but in SPUA you get none of thise traits. In fact it is very progressive and controlled. I never had any dramas with mine

PJ.zook wrote: T/case lift
Not hugely neccesary and puts more angle onto youre drivetrain. Maybe use a bashplate.

Mine has actually improved my driveline angles and the extra clearance is used heaps.

my car drives alot better offroad with the 3/4 rear and i manage to keep the wheels on deck where they would normally lift or bounce up.
Mine is a lwb though cant speak for swb.

ok i know mrRocky and VR Rodeo are watching this on p4x4 as well so i hope you dont get sick of reading double

bevan im not sure how well the 1.3 runs atm as it hasnt been turned over for 6-12 months

as for wheelbase, i havent been and measured yet (wont be able till to late november after exams) but im pretty certain its like your ute mrRocky

it will remain sua

what offset/wheel spacers is everyone running with 33"s?

as mentioned on the p4x4 thread, i would like to get the exo done fairly soon as id like to retain the majority of the panels intact, and the engine will be done last, as the 1.6 will be freshened up before it is put in (got a mate who works on performance V8s etc and he will be the brains behind the s/c conversion)

what adapter kits are people running, and where from (ill continue researching but if anyone in the mean time wants to add some input go ahead )

oh and diff bracing/amour, whats peoples thoughts on it all?

VR Rodeo wrote:

PJ.zook wrote: T/case lift
Not hugely neccesary and puts more angle onto youre drivetrain. Maybe use a bashplate.

Mine has actually improved my driveline angles and the extra clearance is used heaps.

The extra clearance would be great, but if youre raising the transfer, its putting more angle on youre uni's. This isnt necessarily bad, it just means that youre decreasing service life among other things. Its only a few inches though, so wont make a huge difference if you dont have much lift.

What one hand giveth - the other taketh away.

I've found transfer lifts reduce vibration significantly. The fastest spinning, shortest driveshaft in a sierra is the jackshaft, and in a stock sierra, the jackshaft angles are a bit skewiff IMHO.

You'd be amazed at how little vibration it's possible to have in a sierra AND a flat belly pan.

I transfer lift every car I work with now.

Steve.

bakerboy wrote: 1.6L EFI S/charged engine swap 1.6 fine, no need for S/C
32"s fine with lift
wheel spacers with WT diffs and good offset wheels thats all you need
3/4 ellipticals in the rear work well if set up correctly, better/easier on a NT
RUF, extending front chassis mounts by about 3 to 4"s and using the factory rear mounts 40mm is all that is needed using sierra rear springs and the standard rear mount
6.5 T/case gears personally a little low for 32's but the price is right compared to 5.12's
T/case lift 40mm will see it above the bottom of the chassis allowing a flat belly plate.
P/steering good if you can get a Jimny setup, bolton
Welded rear, lokka front if you are doing that much work and putting the dollars in go airlockers, better investment then P/S IMO
exo pending the design can be well worth it, remember to much get too much weight up top.

Comments in red

I, like alot of people have speedy rims in 15X8 with -24 offset, some people use the speedy 15X7 with -13 offset which gives the same clearance from the inner gaurd/chassis. Some other rims are available in similar offset but that seems to be about what most people run to get the best out of clearance, stability and bearing life.

cheers for the info guys

firstly, the guys are all ready sold on the s/c, it may be over kill but thats how we shall have it

32"s are the minumum size we will be using

at this point in time the most expensive thing will probably end up being the t/case gears, labour wont be a problem so im not sure if the kitty will stretch as far as air lockers

What are your plans for it. With a lot of power you'll be replacing CV's and diffs with regular occurance. I would suggest chromo moly CV and axles but that'll just destroy more costly items up the drive line. Dont weld the diff it won't last with power. Yes brace the hell out of it. Ensure you put a Roctoy ring on the transfer or the gears will just spin apart and destroy the case. Can't do anything for the gearbox though. Get a very good clutch.

it will see all manner of terrain, dune work, mud, rocks and fingers crossed, hope to enter into the mud guts glory comp over here. it will also be used on the farm as our shooting rig

ill look into the roctoy ring for the case

we dont intend to hammer the crap out of it, and will drive within our limits, and combined with the reductions gears i dont see how we would be hammering everywhere, however we do expect some teething problems to start with

bakerboy wrote:we dont intend to hammer the crap out of it, and will drive within our limits, and combined with the reductions gears i dont see how we would be hammering everywhere, however we do expect some teething problems to start with

Yeah right, thats the funniest shiat I've heard in years.

Yeah we fitted this Supercharger but we're just gunna take it easy at 9500rpm

just cruizin' wrote:

bakerboy wrote:we dont intend to hammer the crap out of it, and will drive within our limits, and combined with the reductions gears i dont see how we would be hammering everywhere, however we do expect some teething problems to start with

Yeah right, thats the funniest shiat I've heard in years.

Yeah we fitted this Supercharger but we're just gunna take it easy at 9500rpm

glad i could give you a laugh then, so i shouldnt mention the possibility of nos then...

theres been talk on another forum about lux diffs and spring over, worth it? opinions?

hahah im gonna do it bakerboy, lux diffs and spoa for my sierra Tin top project

but im gonna run 35's plus to get some good diff clearance, you should be able to get the same amount of diff clearance on the zook diffs on 33 i think to lux diffs with 35's or something bigger .

brodie

excellent brodie, when are you starting it? will it be down for mgg10? with any luck we should have this done by feb

think ill stay with RUF and 3/4 elliptical rears, 33"s

I would just go the chromo axles and forget the hiluxes.

thats what i was steering towards

whats peoples experience with zooks and silverstones MT-117 extremes? i was hopeing that i could get some in 33x10.5x15 like the website says but apparently they dont come in that size, only 32x11x15? seems odd as the website mentions the 33's

I have 34x11.5 1 brand new simex JT2 and 2 with 50 % for very cheap
if you are keen and i mean v-cheap.

bakerboy wrote:excellent brodie, when are you starting it? will it be down for mgg10? with any luck we should have this done by feb

think ill stay with RUF and 3/4 elliptical rears, 33"s

yeh man well i have got a surf rear diff just hunting round for a hilux front diffbut the surf rear diff is wider so ill run wheel spacers on the front to eequal it out and ill be extending the chassis aswell cut the body down a lil to make some half doors and all the rest i just bought a mig welder so all should start happening soon im hoping to have it ready for MGG10

haha ill have to keep an good eye on this thread see how yor progress is goin

ah sounds good man, well thursday i can get prices from work on mazda leaves, also look at the gabriel shock specs that some people run. picking it up on the 20th of november, then start on the 3/4 setup, also whack new wheel bearings in along with axle seals, swivel housing seals, diff seals etc, should only end up costing 200 for all that

make sure you post up your work as well mate

Right so iv got a few photos of the blank canvas they are not very good as a complete technophob took em but they will have to do. the tray is stuffed so that needs replacing trying to come up with some good designs for a tray. but the body is very clean and rust free.

the instument panel. thinking of striping this, keeping a tacho for when whearing full race headwear and cant hear engine and then putting in oil and water temp and oil pressure plus a wide band fuel mixture gauge and a boost gauge for the supercharger.
http://i664.photobucket.com/albums/vv6/ ... 7Small.jpg

the view from the back. the tray will be replaced by a race tray with spare tyre and roll bar with 4 lights, possibly a second radiator to aid with cooling for low speed work for the s/c, thoughts?
http://i664.photobucket.com/albums/vv6/ ... 5Small.jpg

and the little 1.3 that will soon be replace by the 1.6 fuel injected, if you look close ya can see the emu export can being used to seal a hole in that hose.
http://i664.photobucket.com/albums/vv6/ ... 5Small.jpg

i thought i had a shot of the side of the car but it mustnt have worked but i hope from these ya can see the idea

What do people think of exo cages? i know they will keep the body neat but does the extra weight up high out weigh the benifits of them, is it more worthwhile puting in an internal cage to protect just pilot and co-pilot? oppinions?

bakerboy wrote:Right so iv got a few photos of the blank canvas they are not very good as a complete technophob took em but they will have to do. the tray is stuffed so that needs replacing trying to come up with some good designs for a tray. but the body is very clean and rust free.

the instument panel. thinking of striping this, keeping a tacho for when whearing full race headwear and cant hear engine and then putting in oil and water temp and oil pressure plus a wide band fuel mixture gauge and a boost gauge for the supercharger.


the view from the back. the tray will be replaced by a race tray with spare tyre and roll bar with 4 lights, possibly a second radiator to aid with cooling for low speed work for the s/c, thoughts?


and the little 1.3 that will soon be replace by the 1.6 fuel injected, if you look close ya can see the emu export can being used to seal a hole in that hose.


i thought i had a shot of the side of the car but it mustnt have worked but i hope from these ya can see the idea

What do people think of exo cages? i know they will keep the body neat but does the extra weight up high out weigh the benifits of them, is it more worthwhile puting in an internal cage to protect just pilot and co-pilot? oppinions?

this buildup might give you some ideas

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/ftopic391 ... ht=gremlin

the hose off the manifold is useless anyway - it just channels warm air to the air box for cold starts =)

Looks like this is going to be a nice build up!

you wont fit an internal cage and people into a Ute cab. Exos are fine, don't add any problem weight.

Make sure you keep weight over the back of the ute as well nothing worse than no weight and no traction.

You can do a search for my old ute, it had a custom tray, exo, 34" Swampers blha blah