Widetrack Feroza Suspension Lift Options

[BenDover]

The other day I visited On Track 4WD Centre in Moss Street to see what suspension options are available to me. He gave me a quote on a 50mm lift using Enforcer suspension products all round and it came to $1100 roughly.

A few days ago I read that a Feroza obtained a 2 inch lift for $200 by getting some extended shackles made for the Feroza.

My question is which is better? I mean there is a huge price difference and I would like to know the advantages/disadvantages of both options.

Keep in mind I am not referring to a body lift.

Cheers
Ben

[murcod]

Shackles- cheap; illegal - could cause a major accident if they failed.

Springs- legal; safe.

Do a search and you'll plenty of info.

You can get springs a lot cheaper than that too (unless they included new torsion bars and shocks in that price?) New front torsion bars add big $$$ to the total and aren't necessary.

[ferog]

Springs wont last unless you buy aftermarket ones. Don't get them reset you'll be wasting your money as not many places will reset it properly. Shakles would be better off road for downtravel/flex purposes, but as Dave says be carefull, then again nothing is legal when you want to modify your 4wd without an engineers cert. The rear end can acheive whatever you want but the front is extremely limited. I payed $1600 for 6" of lift (still stands at 7" extra) on the 80 using the best coils, tough dog ajustables, snake racing heavy duty panhard rod and extended lines fully fitted drive in/ drive away. I think the price they've quoted is a bit steep for so little. I personally would go with shackles I was dissapointed when my springs started sagging. It also means you can fit them yourself and keep the old ones just in case. Better to spend the money on the front where it is needed and get heavy duty torsion bars, and shackles rear, new shocks all round.

Good luck!

[murcod]

Yes, don't get reset springs!!

And, you will at the minimum need longer shocks at the rear- other wise you'll find they will be too short and stuff up the ride over large bumps and limit rear travel. So longer rear shocks and new rear springs combined with the front torsion bars wound up would be the cheapest legal option.

Anything "heavy duty"= less wheel travel and hard riding. Have found that out myself the hard way.... You'll also find the front end will stiffen up as soon as you wind the standard torsion bars up (for that reason I wouldn't buy aftermarket ones.)

Check out Lovells IIRC they make a few different spring types for wide tracks and were reasonably priced. Kings and Dobinsons only do narrow tracks.

[Dangerous Dave]

I've lifted my rear end by increasing the length of the shackles. Its lasted me a little over a year, however the other day I bent my right shackle. I've just spent $1300 with TJM on new springs, bushes, shocks and U-bolts. I'll see how I go with them


All up, I'd go the shackles to start with - quick, easy and cheap. I made mine using about $30 worth of steel! Unfortunaly I cut the old ones up in the process only to now find that they are as rare as rocking horse shit and no wreckers in SA have any!

[Ferwoaza]

Don't forget to budget for newer larger tyres as well

Go a proper new suspension for the above mentioned reasons. Also, check with your insurance company that they allow the modification, if they don't, check out 4wd Insurance, mine's only $30/month with them

[MJHsurfin]

There are advantages / disadvantages to both.....

You won't get 2" of lift from Extended Shackles alone - the most you will get is around 30-40mm from 50mm (2") longer shackles - & this is the maximum longer shackle that you should attempt. Reason is that a Shackle Lift only lifts one end of the spring - thus you only get around 50-75% of the Shackle extra length in kift - plus you also rotate the Diff / axle housing. To get a full 50mm of lift you would need around 75-100mm longer shackles !! - way to much stress on the shackle mounts & your diff would be rotated way to much.
For a smaller lift - 50mm longer shackles are excellent - actually improve ride & travel & are cheap !! You may need longer rear shocks as well which isn't really a bad idea as the stock ones are crap....They are also excellent for a bit of extra height later on to fit those 31's when you get a 50mm suspension kit.

A good 50mm lift with quality rear springs & 4 shocks will set you back around $1000+ with fitting - if you can afford it the Torsion Bars will set you back another $500 or so as well. Some people don't think they are worth it - but once you have a big tyred, big lifted Feroza with a Winch Bar + Winch on the front, the Torsion Bars are worth every cent Even without the Winch - my Feroza with Ultimate Torsion Bars, Modified Ultimate Rear Springs, Extended Shackles & Koni Shocks rode far better than the 4ways (Tough Dog) Kit I had - & way better than stock. For my money - Ultimates are easily the pick (but you pay for it) closely followed by TJM. The advantages are of course - 50mm lift, better load carrying -but as David can attest - not necessarily a better ride - or even better travel for that matter

Also - if you are concerned with ride & travel - stick with rubber bushes (even original Daihatsu ones ) over urethane. Urethane may last longer (maybe) but are hard as hell & squeak like crazy unless you grease all the time.

If you are interested in the Extended Shackles - send me a PM - I have made many sets for Wide Tracks & have one finished set left & ready to ship - super strong ( you will NOT bend these shackles !! ) & complete with High tensile bolts. $80 + shipping.

Good luck with your choice - Mike H.

[SimplyPV]

Yes, don't get reset springs!!

And, you will at the minimum need longer shocks at the rear- other wise you'll find they will be too short and stuff up the ride over large bumps and limit rear travel. So longer rear shocks and new rear springs combined with the front torsion bars wound up would be the cheapest legal option.

Anything "heavy duty"= less wheel travel and hard riding. Have found that out myself the hard way.... You'll also find the front end will stiffen up as soon as you wind the standard torsion bars up (for that reason I wouldn't buy aftermarket ones.)

Check out Lovells IIRC they make a few different spring types for wide tracks and were reasonably priced. Kings and Dobinsons only do narrow tracks.

also, when you wind up ur front torsion bars.... i would suggest taking off ur sway bar since the purpose will have been defeated. rides soo much better...... heaps better imho than with the sway bar on and torsion bars standard... so...take it off!

[murcod]

Just another point- from the info I found Ultimate Suspension use Lovell's leafs.

I was going to buy Lovell's but they were going to take around 11 weeks IIRC to make them?! From memory the leafs with bushes were around $350?

[HeathGQ]

Yeah Ben - extended shackles are not roadworthy in QLD. But either is alot of things.

I had my stuff done at On Track - awesome job, you wont go wrong there. I had custom springs in the rear, TJM shocks all round, and the torsions wound up. The rear end flexed really well, especially in up travel, pity I dont have pics of that. They wont remove the sway bar, but do it yourself later.

I have a design for a replacement front bash plate that looked awesome on mine. Increased the front clearance by miles.

Then look at larger tyres, and a body lift.

[BenDover]

Thanks for all the input!

So it looks like doing the suspension is the best way to go for me...except for the $$$ side of things! This option will hurt the hip pocket bad...

Heath have you done anything to your sister-in-laws Fez yet? Didn't she want you to do it up for her? If you have done anything to the suspension on it I would love to see pics...

Once the suspension lift is done (50mm) how big should the tyres I get be? I dont want them to look unproportional to the car. Would it be 30inch? Also what are the stock tyres in inches so I know what the difference is?

Cheers
Ben

[HeathGQ]

Ben, nothing done yet mate.

I personally would go the 30' muddies again. BFG's are great, but your not gonna like the $$ .

[BenDover]

I'm probably going to go for some AT's as the majority of my 4wding consists of beach stuff. Any that you would recommend? Obviously cheaper the better!

[FeroZul]

Thanks for all the input!

So it looks like doing the suspension is the best way to go for me...except for the $$$ side of things! This option will hurt the hip pocket bad...

Heath have you done anything to your sister-in-laws Fez yet? Didn't she want you to do it up for her? If you have done anything to the suspension on it I would love to see pics...

Once the suspension lift is done (50mm) how big should the tyres I get be? I dont want them to look unproportional to the car. Would it be 30inch? Also what are the stock tyres in inches so I know what the difference is?

Cheers
Ben

What size stock tires were on your car? If they were 225/70/15s, that would make it ard~ 27" depending on what brand/type.

30s would be nice on a 2" lift. I run Pirelli Scorpion A/Ts, they go alright on the sand and aren't too pricey.

[HeathGQ]

I'm probably going to go for some AT's as the majority of my 4wding consists of beach stuff. Any that you would recommend? Obviously cheaper the better!

well I did over 40,000'ks on my muddies, and they were 80% when I sold the car!!!! Being a light car, wearing is not a prob, unless you 'burn rubber'. So if you want A/T's due to wear concerns, dont be.

But, you can get lucky - scour the second hand tyre shops - I picked up a set of bridgestone deserts on sunny rims for 600.

[BenDover]

No the main factor is the tyre noise. I dont want it to be too noisy as my wife drives it throughout the week. Muddies are more expensive generally too.

Would you get 30's on the stock rims? Should I be factoring in the cost of some sunny's as well?

[HeathGQ]

noise is not a prob with good quality tyres. Look after em, regular rotate and balance and all good.

Yes to run the 30's you will need at 7" rims. Zook or F100 rims are the same pattern, so pick up a cheap 2nd hand set off here.

[Dangerous Dave]

If you want a cheap A/T look at the Simex Road Trekker. While they may not be the greatest tyre pattern on the earth, I managed to tackle everything with them and they did pretty well. I had them in a 235/75 R15 but you can get them in 30" and 31". From memory they were only about $120 a corner.

[built4thrashing]

heres another option that no one has mentioned and it is to measure up the length of your rears and try to find what other 4x4 have the same width and lenght but has more of an arc than your stock springs. WT feroza are 60mm wide from memory.

then remove ya sway bar and wind the front up but leave atleast 10-15mm of space between the downward bumpstop.

[r0ck_m0nkey]

heres another option that no one has mentioned and it is to measure up the length of your rears and try to find what other 4x4 have the same width and lenght but has more of an arc than your stock springs. WT feroza are 60mm wide from memory.

This option i would look at rear springs from a solid axle front Hilux, or early model 4Runners. They are 60mm wide, from centre of front eye to centre bolt is 530mm as apposed to 550mm for the Feroza, the rear section is 670mm to the Ferozas 620mm. So all up you have a spring thats about 30mm longer, also the Hilux springs have a higher spring camber of about 40mm.

To fit them you would have to redrill the locator hole on the axle mount forward 20mm, so that your axle locates 20mm back on the spring to keep your wheelbase the same and fit some 2" extended shackles. Combined with the slight increase in length of spring, shackle increase and a spring that is still relatively flat it should flex quite good. The only thing left then would be to mess around and figure out shock lengths or possibly making new shock mounts to find what works. Probabaly would have to extend your brakeline aswell. Bushes and Pins would also need looking into, for the shackle end off memory the Feroza has a 16mm pin, but Hilux has an 18mm, so would need this size for the spring end of the shackle, for the front mount can't say what the Feroza pin size is so would have to do some experimenting there.

[murcod]

My narrow track has 60mm wide leafs; I was told widetracks are 70mm??

[r0ck_m0nkey]

My narrow track has 60mm wide leafs; I was told widetracks are 70mm??

In that case they would be as they are wider then the NT ones, so forget what i just said for Wide Tracks it would only work on Narrow Tracks and would have to look elsewhere for a spring swap. Possibly the rears springs off a 60 Series Landcruiser.