302 clevo into mk Patrol

[demo2]

Hi, new 2 this forum, deserately need some help here as pulling my hair out.
i've finally got round to doing the V8 swap into my Patrol.
But why do things never run smoothly, Buy a kit from dellow automotive and should be easy. First off the clutch release bearing didn't fit on the carrier that slides up the input shaft, so i ring them and they say must have put the wrong bearing in, sorry. No problem i'll get one to suit. Then the engine is hard up against the bulkhead with still an inch till it mates to the bellhousing, big hammer comes out and after a bit of reshaping it's in. B4 i took the old engine out i chocked the gearbox up so as to have a guide as the installed height of the new engine and where to put the mounts. Now with the new engine in at original height there is about 1/2" between mounts and chassis rail, not enuf to get rubbers in. So i lift the engine up and it hits the bulkhead and still cant get rubber in. So i rang dellows this morning and they said engine should sit about an inch infront of bulhead with no reshaping needed at all Easy straight forward transplant he said, so i'm gonna remove the engine again and look at the bellhousing as i reckon they have sent the wrong kit. They also said i may have the wrong gearbox in it, surely then if it was replaced with a shorter box at some time the l28 would have 2 of been moved back to meat it, this wasn't the case, l28 was in originakl position. Its an 86 ( made nov 85) swb and has a 5 spd box. What u guys reckon, wrong kit or wrong box?
Thanks 4 any help.

[demo2]

Also just had a look at the transfer mounts, they have 2 extra holes in the mounts and an extra hole in the chassis side of the mounts, using these i could move the whole lot forward but the gearstick is as far forward in the whole as it will go. Is there usually 2 holes on the mounts on the body? The rubbers only have one stud in them? as i dont know patrols very well i don't know if this is standard.

[demo2]

Just viewed some pics from v8patrol"s conversion. It shows the gear shifter comes out at the back of the box on the 4 spd, well mine is a 5 spd but comes out at the back not in the middle like the one in the picture.
Also my transfer case looks completely differant to his, his is flat topped where as mine is more like 40 degree's. Is it posable i have a box and transfer caes out of a later model? GQ maybe. This is my daily driver and i need it up and running to get to work.

[Patroler]

gq transfers are totally different again, the rear output is in the middle - not offset.

Kingy's (V8patrol) transfer won't have a flat top thats maybe just how it looks in the photo - when installed the top cover slopes down towards the drivers side at the 40 or so degrees like you said.

Diesel gearboxes have the shifter mount in the middle of the gearbox top cover and petrols have the shifter mount at the rear (diesels are a longer motor than the L28) Top covers are interchangeable. Petrol gearboxes have a longer input shaft than diesel ones (not interchangeable between four speeds but possible between five speeds)

The difference between the four and five speed box is an extension housing between the gearbox and transfer, its about 135mm long and contains fifth and reverse gear.

What u guys reckon, wrong kit or wrong box?
Thanks 4 any help.

Hard to say without having a good look, i'd be checking the numbers on the kit, it should fit as advised. Ive got a dellow kit in mine (chev/diesel four speed) and it fits up well.

I'd possibly put the engine in place bolted to the mounts, gearbox mounts, shifters removed, then lift the back of the box to the correct height, i can drop the back of my box about 20 cm before anything hits and thats with a dizzy at the back (2" body lift tho)

If all else fails just put in a body lift

[demo2]

cheers for that, i mean flat top as in the top of the case is like a flattish plate bolted down, mine is a domed top, looked in a nissan manuel and looks nothing like whats in mine, the book shows kingy's stlye, i'll attach a few pics of it now .

[demo2]

here is a better pic of the transfer case i have fitted, c what i mean about a domed top, the 5th gear extention measures 105mm not 135 so maybe it is a differant box/transfer etc.Input shaft measures 214mm from gearbox face or 190mm from the housing it exits from.
Anyone tell from these dimensions and pics what i have fitted, i need to get this resolved asap as its my daily driver

[ozy1]

your transfer case definatly looks like a MQ/MK transfer, but i also have never seen the domed top before, it seems like your gearbox mounts are quite long, i have never seen anything like them, unless they were extended bu previous owner, maybe he removed a 4 speed, and fitted the 5 speed, who knows,

[demo2]

according to chassis plate its fitted with a 5spd.
Trans: FS5W81A HG46
Gear lever comes out at back of box just infront of the 105mm spacer. Hopefully kingy can shed some light on this

[Patroler]

yea they probably are all 105mm, just my stuff up as im at work and can't have a look at mine, looks like the mq/mk box but yea, like ozy1 said i haven't seen the domed top either.

FS5W81A HG46

FS5W81A is the 5 speed mq/mk gearbox and HG46 means your diff ratios are 4.6:1.

[bilby]

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/PHP_Modul ... hp?t=47882

ask screwy his transfer looks domed in his pic on the first page of his thread

[demo2]

Thanks guys, my box and transfer look same as screwy's, kinguy gave me his number so gonna ring him and c if he can shed any light on this as well.

[V8Patrol]

1/
Your 5 speed box n transfer is stock Nissan ...post 1985 onwards to the GQ model.......
Dont worry about the "domed cover" differances between what you have and what I have, there is a reason my top cover is flat and its not a relevant issue here.

2/
Motor clearance is the major drama here and as we did with Screwys POS there is only one way to fix the drama and thats with a " large hammer "
( read "sledge hammer")
"massage" the firewall to suit.... if there still isnt enough room then massage it some more

Once the heater box in the cabin starts to move ....... STOP

There is a heater box mounting bracket betwen the heater box and firewall, it measures roughly 40mm x 25mm x 25mm and can be seen by looking up from the floor on the passengers side....
take to it with a hacksaw blade and remove it.... trhis will gain and extra 35mm of clearance on the passengers side head of the motor, the bolt which held the heater box can be placed throught the firewall to again hold the heater box in place.

Be careful of massaging the firewall beyound that mount towards the centre of the firewall as there is a water control switch situated between the heater and firewall and if you massage to far towards the centre of the firewall it will become either damaged or will "move into" the heaterbox itself causing more dramas.

Looking at the pics of the transfer / gearbox setup there is room to redrill the mounting brackets and thus move the gearbox further forward, but I'd only go about 20mm at the very most otherwise the front shaft will need altering, The drama here being that the shaft could bottom out due to the reduction in the amount of slip

The rear shaft should cope well enough, they can extend out 70mm safely without needing alteration.
only issue here may be the actuall gearshift lever.... check it out firstly !

3/
Engine mounts......
Post up some pics...... I'll snap a couple of what I do for the Holden / chev conversions

Kingy

p/s
In the shed working on the commodore so use the home number

[V8Patrol]

Enginemount pics............

[V8Patrol]

these are all HQ type mounts onto a 253 V8 engine..... I use comodore mounts for the later model turbo pattern blocks and the chev block addaption but the actual chassis mount remains the same.

All I use and have always used it a piece of heavy wall square tube thats usually 2" square and is welded directly onto the Nissan enginemount plate.

In your case you may need to remover the mounting plates from the chassis and relocate them further back ... this is normal for an SD33 to V8 conversion.

Kingy

[Screwy]

Whats shown in your pics at the top of this thread is a 5 speed box.

It has a Petrol L28 top cover on it also.

My box is a 5 speed out of an 86 MK Diesel ( non turbo )
with the domed top.....

with the petrol selector on it to enable shifting without cutting a hole in the floor.

if u have my number feel free to give me a bell.... im comp keeps crashing out so i cant read all this properly... Bloody virus

screwy

[MKPatrolGuy]

Looking at the gearbox mounts, mine actually sit flat on top of the rubber and have one bolt either side. Unlike yours which has the bracket sitting further back and only using one bolt.

[demo2]

Cheers guys, so much easier when u talk 2 people who know patrols inside out. I did as kingy said and redrilled the gearbox mounts further 4wards, as he said 20mm was the most it could go b4 the shifter hit the front of the hole in the floor,gonna be an arse to fit the rubber gaitor back now tho
Engine mounts now welded in and one rubber in place, just gotta drill the uver side 2mora. Dosn't help i have tall Moroso rocker covers either, drivers side touchin the little brkt that holds the clutch pipe to the flexi hose so need to do something there. Hopefully the rest will be straight 4ward, just nigly things now like relocating power steering hoses etc. Gonna try and use the original powersteering pump by makin a brkt to fit the clevo head ,likewise with the a/c compressor etc.
Will kepp u all posted durin the week.

[MKPatrolGuy]

When I dropped the Chev in my MK I used a Commodore Saginaw P/S pump and Chev brackets and just got some custom hoses made. The steering is now easier than with the original pump.

[demo2]

Did think of usin a ford pump but tryin 2 keep the cost down as just bought a house 2 months ago and havin a months holiday in Dec so tryin 2 budget a bit. Oh meant 2 mention earlier, I am a moderator in a V8 forum, has over 1200 members worldwide, may be of use to u V8 Guys,the address is: http://www.v-8.org.uk/forum/

[V8Patrol]

Dosn't help i have tall Moroso rocker covers either, drivers side touchin the little brkt that holds the clutch pipe to the flexi hose so need to do something there.

Should have mentioned the rocker covers to me on the phone...... You'll gain a bit of extra clearance if they had of been stock height units....
My commodore is tight as too .... have to fit the motor then put the drivers side rocker cover on, brake booster / rocker cover clearance is SFA !

The "little bracket" that holds the clutch hydrolic line ...... drill the spot welds out and relocate/ reattatch the bracket after you figure out how much clearance you'll need..... or as I have done on a couple of tight ones .... delete it all together !!

Loved the cortina.......... very bling bling ........ for a POS phord

Kingy

[demo2]

Finally got the motor bolted in now, ended up cutting the hole in the floor a bit further forward and pushing the gearbox and engine forward to locate on the spare hole on the gearbox chassis mount. Needed to massage the drivers side of the firewall 2 clear the extractors, Ended up making the mounts myself as the dellow ones wern't any use. Worked out nicely so they bolted to the original holes on the chassis mounts. One question 4 u guys, does the purge pipe from the charcoal canister go to a take off on the bottom of the holley? Will be busy 2mora making brkts to hold the alternatot/ aircon and power steering. Will be relocating the alternator to the passenger side up high and a/c below it, in it's original position on the L28 it sat under water whilst i was stuck in water. Will let u know how i get on over the weekend. Top picture is me, glad i wern't the one below

[V8Patrol]

purge pipe from the charcoal canister goes to the take off on the bottom of carby be it Holley or Rochester.



brackertry


I'm glad its you !

brackertry

Pics of the engine mounts too while ya at it !

Kingy

[demo2]

Spent 6 hrs on saturday makin a brkt to hold the alternator and a/c pump,swine of a job but its done now. Wired and plumbed it up 2nite and was dying 2 fire it up, the mrs said its 10.30, u cant start it up with no exhaust, u'll annoy the neighbours, oh well tough shit. Ran it for about a minute, sounded great on open headers. Just gotta get the rear tailshaft lengthened and should be drivin it later this week

[demo2]

Forgot 2 ask u guys, there is 2 wires coming from the original carby that was on the L28, what do these do and can i just tape the wires up? Where do the wires go 2 from the carby?

[demo2]

Well obviously no one knew the answer to the last post,lol, rite here's one 4 u, my rear tailshaft is 45mm to short and the front is now 45mm to long, is there any reason why i can't swap them around? I know the rear is a larger diameter but as it's a short shaft do u reckon i could get away with it? I tried them on the opersite way round and the holes line up ok. Will take pics of engine mounts, i ain't 4got

[Heathx4]

According to my exploded carby diagram (note that it didn't quite match my L28 carby in a few places) the two wires coming into the carby were to the "coasting valve assy" and the anti-dieseling solenoid valve (not present on mine). Must admit I don't know when or why the coasting valve would open, and obviously the anti-dieseling valve wasn't necessary for me. Whether you need them is for you to decide I guess!

As for the tail shafts - surely they are different lengths? The front is much shorter than the rear isn't it? Or are you talking about separating the shafts and swapping just the spline sections or something? I don't think you'll get away with it, but keep us informed!

[V8Patrol]

The two wires to the carby = snip ...... then ..... left hand right shoulder.

I've done the tailshaft swap around thing in the past in "emergency" situations.... ie: didnt get em cut n shut in time


and it does work....... but .......

I certainly wouldt recemend it as a permanant thing as it wont last long.

Better to get em done properly and have peace of mind .....after all there's a V8 thumping away at em now

If you have access to a lathe then its an easy job to do the shortening / lengthening and realitivly cheap to get em balanced afterwards, otherwise the job is best left to a profesional mob.

Kingy

[demo2]

Update time, after removing the gearbox twice due 2 a loud screeching noise and a clutch that wouldn't engage, i've finally sorted it.
The input shaft on the gearbox has a shoulder about 30mm from the end, this was hard up against the spigot bearing which was giving it constant drive, in effect the clutch was working but doin nothing. The screeching noise was the starter motor being turned by the flywheel after letting go of the key. With the bendix sat in it's normal position this was still engaged on the ringgear, either faulty starter or the engine uses a differant starter on the manuel version,remember the engine was auto b4. Anyway bump started it with no starter in it and hey presto no noise, drove it up the road and back, clutch workin fine, even lighter than standard L28. So will get on2 the fone to Dellows and bitch about the conversion and tell them u need to turn the input shaft down b4 fitting. Below is a pic of the homemade engine mounts as promised, it uses an upside down "C" section welded to box section that goes inbetween the engine mounts, all this bolts to the existing L28 mounts.

[V8Patrol]

Update time, after removing the gearbox twice due 2 a loud screeching noise and a clutch that wouldn't engage, i've finally sorted it.

i'm glad its your phone bill

For future referance..............
The L28 gearbox front shaft WILL need modification for a V8 conversion...

For Ford motors re-read Pauls last post....

For holden n Chev conversions the very tip of the front shaft needs to be shortened by 10mm ( 3/8ths of an inch ). By the "very tip " I mean the VERY TIP ONLY. Failure to do this means that the front shaft WILL hit up against the crank making ya clutch useless.

For V8 Chev or holden to SD33 gearbox then there will need to be an "extended " spigot bush made up as the front shaft on these gearboxes is NOT long enough to reach the spigot bush fully and as a result only 3 - 4 mm o shaft ends up in the spigot bush. This causes rapid wear to the spigot bush and therefore a much sooner removal of the motor to replace the worn item.

NB: This is for Castlemaine Rodshop and Dellow V8 conversion kits only.


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Paul,
Have you tried to loosen off the starter motor and realign it ? ( a tap with a hammer may be just the ticket )........
Chevs are bytches at "out of alignment" starters and they do exactly what you have described to me over the phone. Because of the poor alignment the bendix drive will either not engage properly or will not release after the motor has started. This drama is usually associated with the older starter motors but I have seen a few hitorque starters do it as well ...... mine for example ......


Should be the same starter motor for either auto or manual box unless phord did a secret squirel thing......


Kingy

[demo2]

Got the starter motor reconed 2day, turns out on manuel clevelands they were fitted with a spacer 2 push starter away from the bellhousing, it's not needed on auto's as the ringgear is further in 2wards the gearbox. Spacer arriving 2mora then i'm off out for a drive