2007 EFS Logan Challenge

[Marshy]

The reason why we have gone for a limit of 36" (not that it needs to be justified really), is that, we are trying to make the event acheivable for people that are interested in doing an event, but don't see the point in entering if they are going to be competing against seasoned winch challenge guys.
The Logan Challenge is not a winch challenge, nor is it a rock crawling event, or a tuff truck. We are simply trying to get the event back to what it was.
As far as the question of "why not 37's?". Well, without trying to start an argument, why not 40's? Why not 44's? Why not 54's??? There has to be a cut off. And, we have decided that, that cut off will be 36". Simple as that.
I realise that there are guys out there that have 37's (or bigger) that won't buy new tyres for the sake of the Logan Challenge. It's understandable, I wouldn't buy new tyres for the sake of one event either. But, that doesn't change the fact that the club has made a decision on the matter.

[nastytroll]

If logan challange is goin back to what it was will there be clutch changes n engine re ringing again? What about re beading split rims? I know where it started n what was involved before you want 36" theres no probs there, whats the metric equivelent for those Who dont have 36x?x? on the side wall?
Is there a venue yet? Or vehicle specs n equipment required list?
Thanks for the reply on the tyre sizes Simon n all the information you can give will be appreciated,
Mite try put a team in!
BTW alot of winch challange guys are still running 35" tyres like bolten n shane so the seasoned winch challenge thing is kinda funny
jus my 2c

[green4x4]

315/85/15=36.1" section ht=10.5"
315/80/16=35.9" section ht=9.9"

I think these guys should be supported for makeing rule changes, as soon as some body does something that affects a small number of people they get whinged to, look at it from there point of view, this will more then likley attract a lot of new people to compete in events, you got to admit that with a 36" tyre limit it will make it easyer for new, not so modded cars to achive this entry.

[Pesky Pete]

Well thought I might chime my 2c worth in as well.

I gotta say that even though this change rules me out of Logan challenge (not going to buy a set of tyres for the one event) I do agree with it to some extent. I think that getting the event back to a club challenge style event is a good thing. City Views trials seems to be gaining some popularity as it is aimed at the weekend warriors and novice competitors.

I dont really think the comp has gotten more hardcore over the years I have been doing it, and in many cases, bigger tyres does not give you that much advantage in this comp. I have competed on from 31's to 36's in logan challenge and never really had too many issues on tyre size.

But seeing all the big rigs lined up would certainly be intimidating for a bunch of mates just wanting to go give it a go. I say good on you Logan club and good to see you sticking to your guns.

[STIKA]

If logan challange is goin back to what it was will there be clutch changes n engine re ringing again? What about re beading split rims? I know where it started n what was involved before you want 36" theres no probs there, whats the metric equivelent for those Who dont have 36x?x? on the side wall?
Is there a venue yet? Or vehicle specs n equipment required list?
Thanks for the reply on the tyre sizes Simon n all the information you can give will be appreciated,
Mite try put a team in!
BTW alot of winch challange guys are still running 35" tyres like bolten n shane so the seasoned winch challenge thing is kinda funny
jus my 2c

It has only moved away from that format for 1 year

Shane is assisting in organising the event so he won't be competing

[jav]

You will be right Stika, you got got 31 on yours.

[nastytroll]

315/85/15 is over size so shoulnt be leagal but a 37" MTR is 36.25" measured new so if close enough is good enouh scrutineering will be an issue for the realy competitive,
I'm not worried if Shane competes or not just an example as the centerpede 1 35" is still a very popular tyre with the winch challenge people.
Any specs yet? Whats the difference goin to be with 3 car team, how many entrents for the event, what sort of entry fee, will there be engine capacity limits or number of cylinder limits, suspension limits, tyre tread limits, A venue?
Whens the next Logan Club meeting n are they still at loganholme?

[nat34]

Hi all.

Do you guys need helpers this year??? Been practicing my cooking!!!!!

[80lsy gq]

315/85/15 is over size so shoulnt be leagal but a 37" MTR is 36.25" measured new so if close enough is good enouh scrutineering will be an issue for the realy competitive,
I'm not worried if Shane competes or not just an example as the centerpede 1 35" is still a very popular tyre with the winch challenge people.
Any specs yet? Whats the difference goin to be with 3 car team, how many entrents for the event, what sort of entry fee, will there be engine capacity limits or number of cylinder limits, suspension limits, tyre tread limits, A venue?
Whens the next Logan Club meeting n are they still at loganholme?

why will it be an issue...it says what is stamped on the sidewall...not actual measuremenets of the tyre so a 37 MTR wont be legal..boy that was difficult..

i can see that we wont be getting home early from the next meeting...better get the video set to tape Prison Break

[nastytroll]

As stated previous I have 35"n 36" tyres so not askin for myself but as green4x4 stated 315/85/15=36.1" is considered leagel but over 36" whats another 3mm This is why OBC has a measured tyre size.
Is the 3 car team n tyre size the only things desided so far cos theres been nothing else posted so far,
80lsy gq if you dont want a long club meeting you dont wave to come

[JWB]

Hi all.

Do you guys need helpers this year??? Been practicing my cooking!!!!!

Hello Nat,
as usual I expect all offers of help will be gratefully accepted by the organizers!

[1MadEngineer]

how about an "aggregate" tire size?????
eg 108"
= 3 cars 36"
or 1 x 33 , 1 x 35 x 1 x 38.5
or 2x 35, 1 x 37

or something like that, just a suggestion.

helps with teams of different makes/styles, and allows room for variety!

[RUFF]

80lsy gq if you dont want a long club meeting you dont wave to come

Pam? Dave happens to be the Vice President so he is generally there.

[nastytroll]

Pam? the club meetings used to always go late, Still no response to the questions of vehicle specs or equipment or the club meeting times n venue, If someone is invited to be present at the meeting time n place is a big help for them to arrive
It would be helpful if some one read the rest of the posts that didnt concern tyre size as I've asked questions with no asnwers

[RUFF]

Pam? the club meetings used to always go late, Still no response to the questions of vehicle specs or equipment or the club meeting times n venue, If someone is invited to be present at the meeting time n place is a big help for them to arrive
It would be helpful if some one read the rest of the posts that didnt concern tyre size as I've asked questions with no asnwers

Sorry Cant help you with any of the Specs as i dont get to meetings much any more myself(Im up at 4am so the meetings go beyond my bedtime nowdays) but Marshy should be able to shed some light for you on this or at least when they will be available.

Club meetings are still held at the Same time and Venue they allways have been held. Second Wed of each month at 8PM at the Hotrod Club in Birchell St Loganholme.

[80lsy gq]

As stated previous I have 35"n 36" tyres so not askin for myself but as green4x4 stated 315/85/15=36.1" is considered leagel but over 36" whats another 3mm This is why OBC has a measured tyre size.
Is the 3 car team n tyre size the only things desided so far cos theres been nothing else posted so far,
80lsy gq if you dont want a long club meeting you dont wave to come

nobody said that 315/85/15 were the legal size..you asked what the metric equivalent was and someone posted that up...if it measures 36.1 inches then it is oversize and isnt a legal tyre...315/80/16 however measures 35.9 so it would be considered the metric equivalent and i would have a stab in the dark and say that that would be the legal metric sized tyre for the challenge

as for your other questions i am sure that once all the rules etc are set in concrete then they will be advertised in the relevant places

i am not on the organising committee for the challenge and as such i will be leaving it to the people in charge to do that (Marshy, Shane etc)

dave

[Marshy]

As stated previous I have 35"n 36" tyres so not askin for myself but as green4x4 stated 315/85/15=36.1" is considered leagel but over 36" whats another 3mm This is why OBC has a measured tyre size.
Is the 3 car team n tyre size the only things desided so far cos theres been nothing else posted so far,
80lsy gq if you dont want a long club meeting you dont wave to come

nobody said that 315/85/15 were the legal size..you asked what the metric equivalent was and someone posted that up...if it measures 36.1 inches then it is oversize and isnt a legal tyre...315/80/16 however measures 35.9 so it would be considered the metric equivalent and i would have a stab in the dark and say that that would be the legal metric sized tyre for the challenge

as for your other questions i am sure that once all the rules etc are set in concrete then they will be advertised in the relevant places

i am not on the organising committee for the challenge and as such i will be leaving it to the people in charge to do that (Marshy, Shane etc)

dave

Thanks Dave.

Yes, all rules, specs etc will be announced once finalised. And not before.

At the end of the day, when you enter an event, you are agreeing to compete under the rules set down by the organisers. The ORGANISERS, not the competitors. I apologise for coming across as aggressive in this post, but it is just a little frustrating when we get unnecassary conflicts.

The tyre issue was a decision made by the Logan Club, as a whole, for it's biggest annual event. I'm sorry, but the rule will stand. The reason we have not gone for the Outback Challenge's system of a measured tyre, is because, we are not the Outback Challenge. We are trying to make the vehicle specs as simple as possible for both competitors and officials. As I understand it, in the OBC, your tyres must comply to the measurement when measured at 20psi. Which is fine, if you have a whole team of scrutineers, and a whole day to do it. But, we don't have that luxury. That is our reasoning for the "stamped size" policy. I am not saying that this is a better option than the likes of the OBC. I'm just saying that we are not operating on the scale of that style of event. Therefore, some things have to run differently.
Also, I am aware that there are plenty of "seasoned" competitors that still run on 36's and under. We have not made this rule to stop these guys competing. Far from it. We love having "known" trucks there, it's good for the image of the event. The reason we made the rule, was to encourage the guys that have spent a few dollars on their trucks, to jump in and have a crack, without being up against tyres that could bury half their car in their ruts. This decision has come from constuctive critisism we have recieved over the last 3-4 years.
The club had to make a decision which way to go with the Logan Challenge. Either, we make it an all-out winch challenge, aimed at the XWC market of vehicle, or we peg it back a little, and return it to it's grass roots. Obviously, we chose the latter. So, yes, it will have all the old fav's like mechanical, tyre changing, etc. But, that never really left. Though I wasn't present at last year's event, I had been involved in every event from 1998 to 2005, and the format has barely shifted in that period. The driving probably stepped up a little, but other than that, it has maintained a fairly consistent format. It has always been aimed at people with a broad knowledge of bush and survival, as well as being able to think outside the square to acheive a goal. This year will be no different.

[Pegboy2000]

Though I wasn't present at last year's event

there was a cv changing/bridge building stage last year

[nat34]

Hi all.

Do you guys need helpers this year??? Been practicing my cooking!!!!!

Hello Nat,
as usual I expect all offers of help will be gratefully accepted by the organizers!

More than happy to help out..... Will need to have a little bit of notice to be able to organise family etc but I am THERE!!!!!

[Marshy]

Hi all.

Do you guys need helpers this year??? Been practicing my cooking!!!!!

Hello Nat,
as usual I expect all offers of help will be gratefully accepted by the organizers!

More than happy to help out..... Will need to have a little bit of notice to be able to organise family etc but I am THERE!!!!!

Thanks Nat, it would be muchly appreciated.

[CHOOFA]

I have competed in every challenge but one an when i was a member of the Logan Club when we first started it i ran on 38,s an since gone to 37,s because of comps whats happening Simon no having a go at you but i think it is going to be the start of the end for this event.Starky!

[80lsy gq]

i believe (and this is purely my thoughts alone) that the reasoning behind the decisions the guys are coming up with is that they are trying to push this event in a direction away from where other comps are heading..every other comp around is doing its best to push the limits further and further with the driving stages requiring bigger tyres, stronger drivelines, wild suspension setups etc etc all which mean big $ which is something a minority have...the majority however all have a bit of $ and can therefore put together a rig that can be competitve when running against cars which cant run bigger than 36' tyres..and for a comp to continue running you need to accommodate the majority...

another thought would be that the comp was heading to much towards the extreme side of things and really would have ended up being the QLD version of Woodpecker which is not the direction intended..hell there was even someone wanting to put a team of buggies in last year...there is already enough comps around for the bigger trucks to compete in..the smaller roadgoing trucks need somewhere to compete too(by roadgoing i am referring to guys who still street their cars and run around on 35s and 36s) for them the comps are few and far between

dave

[Marshy]

i believe (and this is purely my thoughts alone) that the reasoning behind the decisions the guys are coming up with is that they are trying to push this event in a direction away from where other comps are heading..every other comp around is doing its best to push the limits further and further with the driving stages requiring bigger tyres, stronger drivelines, wild suspension setups etc etc all which mean big $ which is something a minority have...the majority however all have a bit of $ and can therefore put together a rig that can be competitve when running against cars which cant run bigger than 36' tyres..and for a comp to continue running you need to accommodate the majority...

another thought would be that the comp was heading to much towards the extreme side of things and really would have ended up being the QLD version of Woodpecker which is not the direction intended..hell there was even someone wanting to put a team of buggies in last year...there is already enough comps around for the bigger trucks to compete in..the smaller roadgoing trucks need somewhere to compete too(by roadgoing i am referring to guys who still street their cars and run around on 35s and 36s) for them the comps are few and far between

dave

Couldn't have said it better Bolsy.


Starky, sorry you feel this way mate. We're by no means trying to ruin the event. We're more trying to attract a new breed of competitor, a group that would otherwise not compete. As Dave said, there is very limited competitions for these guys to have a go at. So, that's what we're going for. If the format proves to be largely unpopular, then I'm sure the club will look into making necassary changes. I know your club history mate, and I know that the L.C has always been a challenging event. But, we're trying to set our event apart from everyone else's. Most club's/people try to acheive this by making their event bigger and badder than the next. But, we are going to try the other way. By bring it back to something for the street trucks, instead of the wild tuff trucks. The driving will still be very tough, and extremely challenging.
The trouble with allowing the bigger tyres is that, if your designing tracks to stop someone with 38's, then the guys with 35's are gonna struggle to make it halfway through the course within DNF. Conversly, if you design tracks for 35's, and still allow 38's, then the guys with the bigger tyres will get very bored, very quickly with the stages. So, it's six to one, half dozen to the other.

[tiler0172]

I don,t know what the fus is all about tyre size as there has been teams compete on 31 and 33 and beat guys on 35 -38,s .
It comes down to team work and that is what the event is aimed at .
It teaches new comers a lot about competition and 4wding.
By having a tyre size limit it evens the playing field .
the rocky club held a similiar event up here last year and put a 36 inch limit on tyres and they had some guys that had done the outback challenge and some guys that had competed in the xwc compete and there thoughts were it made them thinck before just hitting things gun ho and driving the obsticals as they had othere cars the couldn,t drive it.
They had to realy think as a team before acting.

[scrun]

I don,t know what the fus is all about tyre size as there has been teams compete on 31 and 33 and beat guys on 35 -38,s .
It comes down to team work and that is what the event is aimed at .
It teaches new comers a lot about competition and 4wding.
By having a tyre size limit it evens the playing field .

They had to realy think as a team before acting.

THATS IT , THATS WHAT ITS ALL ABOUT !!!!!

[mix89]

I am one of those that has competed on 31's and 33's. so far 2nd, 2nd and 4th. Thats nothing to scoff at. Bring it on. Will be back again this year.

[green4x4]

any aprox date for l.c. this year, whats the thoughts for a venue??

[Marshy]

any aprox date for l.c. this year, whats the thoughts for a venue??

We are aiming for the 12th, 13th and 14th of October. (this is the weekend BETWEEN Bathurst and Indy). That is not a confirmed date yet, but it will be around that time.

As for the venue, we are going to have a look at The Springs 4x4 Park shortly as a prospective venue. I will advise shortly.

[green4x4]

cheers, thanks mate

[Marshy]

I can confirm that the venue for the 2007 Logan Challenge WILL be......

THE SPRINGS 4X4 PARK


Dates to be confirmed.